Effect of VAT on admissions - any intel?

Because kids with SEN in Indy schools don't need an EHCP to access support. So many parents turn to indy due to delays and barriers of getting an EHCP to access appropriate support in state. That's not to say state schools cant/don't support SEN but there is no denying that there is an SEN crisis in state. As an example my friend teaches on state and her current primary class has 33% SEN which take up 80% of her time. This means the other 67% of non SEN kids get the remaining 20% of her time. This simply isn't acceptable for any of the kids in her class as none are getting what they need.

I think I’m right in assuming you are supportive of the addition of VAT to school fees generally.

I’m pretty non-committal tbh. If it raises money for state schools that would be nice but that appears to be up in the air so we’ll have to see. I am however pissed off at the amount of airtime it is getting and all the handwringing about private school kids compared to state school kids, including state school kids with SEN which is an absolute heartbreaking mess.

I don’t see how the government could admit that a kid with an SEN but no EHCP simply needs private education. That would be admitting that state education can be a failure for SEN children. Which it is, but they have to try to fix that not just say ‘ok it’s a disaster but if you can afford private school fees we won’t put VAT on them just for you.’

And there are kids with SEN diagnoses for whom state education is absolutely fine.

Indy schools aren't like vocational training providers. Parents don't pay for their kids to attend ITPs. This is a tax on parents as they are the ones paying the fees. Indy schools already pay VAT on all purchases but currently can't reclaim it. They will be able to reclaim VAT if this policy passes but they also have to charge parents 20% VAT on fees.

the wording of Eton's letter to parents announcing that fees will rise to a mere £63k per child per year is probably instructive here. they didn't announce the fee rise as a contingency plan which will be enacted in the unlikely event that the legal challenge will fail, but rather as something that is going to happen, which is surely will.

I’m not a tax specialist but I don’t see how you could exempt a service from VAT by the nature of its users/customers rather than by nature of the service.

So I can see how, say, a tutoring agency delivering dyslexia support might be exempt from adding VAT. But not a provider of general education.

The only way I can see would be for a child to get a specific grant to cover the VAT (say) if their SEN were severe enough.

I wouldn't pretend to have even the tiniest % of the expertise of a Niedle or whoever on this, but common sense does indeed suggest that something like a tweak to the tax rules impacting private school [bringing them into step with, say, vocational training providers & private tutoring companies, but out of step with, say, state schools & universities] is the kind of 'political' decision that falls well within the fiscal powers of the elected government & parliament and that a court would only overturn in the kinds of exceptional circumstances which likely aren't present here.

Not sure otherwise why you are quite seemingly so desperate to see this very limited challenge to VAT fail!

I have no idea why me presenting my opinion that it was widely expected to fail, based on what I had observed surrounding the discussion of the case, with links, is me being desperate for it to fail. I said I’m not a tax expert and I asked for links to tax experts suggesting it might win so that I could update my understanding of the case. A previous poster said they hadn’t seen much commentary - if it was an exciting case I’d have expected more interest.

If it is a ‘very limited challenge’ - do you mean that it wouldn’t actually prevent VAT being added to private school fees?

My understanding is that, given this was in the Labour manifesto, the Lords traditionally will not vote it down.

No, the public consultation has only just finished. Many Labour peers don't support it. However I believe that it doesn't have to go through Lords due to ammendment of tax law rather than new legislation. That's why this legal case is so important

Has this been through the house of lords yet.

Keir is a supporter of ECHR, it won't be a great look if he goes against that. Although at this stage I don't think Labour give a crap about optics. They certainly seem to revel in being unpopular.
As much as you may want to believe this case will fail, ultimately no-one at this stage can say with any certainty either way

There will be human rights, equality and discrimination arguments that he’s unlikely to have run into.

He says in the Twitter thread I linked to “A successful ECHR/Human Rights Act challenge can result in the court politely asking Parliament to think again (a “declaration of incompatibility”). But the law remains in force.”

No-one can say whether it will win or lose at present, it is a test case because , outside of Greece, no government has ever tried to tax education (Greece failed to do it fyi). The accepted principle is that it is VAT exempt. The SEN angle is key and, as I've already stated, is incredibly nuanced.

Perhaps you could post links to independent-to-the-case tax experts saying it will win so that I can update my understanding?

So you've 1 or 2 X comments saying the case will lose and you've interpreted that as "widely expected to lose"? As with any court case, it comes down to the nitty gritty of legal complexities. The case is being brought via SEN angle, it is complicated and nuanced.

Well that's wrong for a start

There's precedent which indicates that it will lose. Widely commented on in threads mentioned by noblegiraffe that this is an example of unscrupulous law firms getting money for an action they are well aware will fail.

I haven't seen much lately, tbf, but when court challenges first came up I saw a load of people on twitter just say 'yeah, not going to work' and then move on.

e.g. Dan Neidle the tax expert who uncovered Nadhim Zahawi's dodgy tax dealings: https://x.com/danneidle/status/1795523122923474982?s=61&t=U9XrcF693-JpMxeIueYG7g\

I'd have thought the lack of commentary was a sign of complete lack of interest in the challenge due to it being irrelevant. All the discussion I've seen expects VAT from Jan.

I could be totally wrong, I know nothing about tax law, that's just my take on it.

Sorry to ask a side question but does anybody know what universities think of kids who have got cut out of the system entirely and had to home school?

I mean those kids who had to come out of private schools, but couldn't get a place at a state school, and so end up home schooling?

I'd be interested to know how that affects their university application, assuming that they still get about the same grades as they would have had anyway.

"SinclairsLaw: Education" https://www.sinclairslaw.co.uk/services/education

These solicitors are handling the case

By who? I have been following this closely and there is no commentary on this so curious where the “widely expected to lose” comes from.

Widely expected to lose.