Music lessons are a waste of time for most kids

Learning music stimulates many parts of the brain which help with other areas of learning. They also help develop listening skills, resilience, team work and most importantly joy and pleasure.

Learning an instrument and playing in ensembles IS worthwhile even if you just do it for pleasure.

Most people don't go onto to be professional sports people/ artists/ dancers/ actors either. So is this all a waste of time too?

What a very sad unfulfilling life people would live with the attitude that if it doesn't lead to a career then it has no value.

Completely disagree. My 11 year old gets a lot of pressure from playing the piano and it brings a lot of joy to our whole family. What he has gained in enjoyment, self esteem, sense of accomplishment and achievement and huge improvements in his motor skills as someone with mild dyspraxia is immeasurable. It's given him some great experiences he wouldn't have had otherwise and I just love that he chooses to spend time playing and experimenting rather than just sitting in front of the TV as I did at his age.

I'm so encouraged to see all the posts on here. In an era where vile tik tok and the like aggressively bid for young people's attention, I am so cheered to see that so many parents still value wholesome, timeless and grounding pastimes in their children's lives.

I'm sure the deluded, over ambitious parents the OP mentions do exist, but they must be a small minority. Most of us are just happy to see our children dojgn healthy, wholesome, positive things that don't involve hunching over an electronic device.

My DD (7) is learning the violin. She quite likes it, practices for 10 mins or so each day, with some encouragement. I’m quite sure she will never be a professional violinist, but she is learning that practice and effort are important to improve your skills.

She has done a couple of small performances, which has been great for her confidence too.

I played piano up to grade 6, and whilst I was far from professional level, when older I was able to enjoy playing in a group with friends etc. Now DD is learning violin, I often accompany her on the piano, which is great. I love that I can read and play music (albeit not very well now!), despite going months without practising.

I think you've seen a very different side of it to me.

I went to an independent school. Pretty much everyone played an instrument, usually to a high standard. No-one thought about becoming a professional musician and most parents and teachers would have not been at all in favour of that idea. Music was a fun hobby that got you UCAS points and looked good on your CV to assist you in becoming a doctor or a lawyer, not a proper job.

A few people who were really serious about music went off to Chethams.

You might be misinterpreting the enthusiasm of parents. My DD has just started gymnastics and due to her build and our family history I think she could be really good at it, so I'm very keen to know how she's getting on and encourage her to take it seriously and practise skills. It would be great if she could excel in a sport like gymnastics, be part of a team, develop discipline and be active and fit. The idea of her entering gymnastics as a career, with the low pay, high pressure and injuries is the opposite of what I'd want for her though.

Learning music alters your brain, especially when young. So it is worth doing it as a child even if you never play music again because it has made your brain capable of doing more things than it could if you hadn't. Here's one of many sources of that info.

brainworldmagazine.com/music-rhythm-brain/

Disagree.

If you can get to grade 5/ grade 8 standard on an orchestral instrument you can probably find an orchestra or concert band/wind orchestra (or brass band) throughout your life and thus have a hobby pretty well wherever you end up...

Music teaches the value of practice plus that just because you can't do something the first time doesn't mean you will never do it.

Most instruments are a good co-ordination exercise, good for the brain

Understanding music also helps with maths.

My kids play music for fun, I pushed them down the strings route because as an amateur flutist I do struggle to find stuff to do as we're very common... Violinists not so much... As despite being common more are required.

If a career in a regional orchestra, or teaching would make my child happy then it's a good career for them, same as if they wanted to be a sports coach or accountant or god forbid a lawyer...

Eh? I got up to a Grade 7 (I think, it was a long time ago!) on trumpet as a kid. 20 years later I play in a Ska band a couple of evenings a week?

Am I making a living out of it? No, of course not, I'm barely covering my beer money for the night, but does that mean my music lessons were wasted? Of course not, I'm doing something I hugely enjoy on a regular basis.

No, most kids who have music lessons aren't going to make a career out of it. Neither is DD who does Karate, or my nephew in the Air Cadets etc. None of that means those lessons are a waste of time though.

I was at a reunion a couple of years ago. I asked some people there whether they'd learned music as children and whether they were still doing anything with it. 10 of them (about half) said that they'd learned music to a "decent" level, probably grade 5 or above. Two of those said that they still played for themselves or in a group. The other eight said that they hadn't touched their instruments since they started uni, over 20 years earlier.

DD doesn't love music so I decided to let her spend her time on art lessons and netball clubs, which she does enjoy. I don't think there's anything intrinsically special about music compared with other creative or team activities. Most studies on the subject compare children who do music to children who do nothing, not to children who spend a similar amount of time on other activities.

I would’ve thought somebody who loves the arts @Baldrick23 would know that not all learning, not all artistic endeavour is about earning money. The exact opposite in fact. I find your op so depressing, I really do.

signed
Grade 6 Oboeist and music Lover.

Piano can be helpful if you're a primary school teacher too. A friend of mine has done loads of courses and extra work around teaching children with English as a second language.

When she last interviewed for jobs she said they were all more interested in her grade 8 piano and whether she would play in assembly and for the Christmas play than any of the CPD she's done over the years.

Hmm. Interesting point of view. I and two friends were all talented musicians in school. One (me) played through school and university (non-music course), but I knew I wasn’t dedicated enough to make a career out of it. I just did it for the enjoyment. My two friends went on to music college. Only one is still working in music - as a teacher.

Yes but music is also about enjoyment surely? My 9 year old DD has been doing piano lessons for the last 2 years- I have no illusions about her becoming a concert pianist but she enjoys it and being able to play piano is handy. There's also quite a lot of research showing that music helps other learning such as maths
DH plays guitar and was in a band when he was younger- it was a hobby never a potential career, but what's wrong with that?!
Are you saying he should never have learned to play guitar?

My DCs are learning instruments and have done a few grades and continue to have lessons, but neither wants a career in music. I do struggle to get them practice sometimes which is frustrating, and I often say they can stop having lessons whenever they want not they are older, but neither of them want to stop.

I'm not sure they will continue to play forever, but I think it has taught them a lot and it will be something they can always come back to when they are older.

Do you tell all those parents taking their kids to football practice & games the whole of their childhood that they are wasting their time because their child isn't going to play in the premier league?

I think you obviously have a lot of hurt or anger re your own childhood, or this is a reverse?

Agree with other posters about the many benefits of learning to play an instrument or sing.

My DC enjoy this (one instrument) and have had school/local opportunities and fun, eg group things. The benefits from it as an extracurricular are great for their time and the cost IME.

Your OP seems to be mainly around whether it’s good for v talented DC to spend a lot of their time and energy on music vs other things.

Agree with you that the odds of getting classical music jobs are low - and terms/conditions are often shitty. Similar for other creative industries or high level sports. So perhaps it’s about the DCs’ reasons for doing it (or the family’s if the parents are ‘pushing’ music) and knowledge of the realities etc.

I don't even know where to start with this. Most children won't become famous authors or artists so why teach them writing or painting? There are so many benefits to learning a musical instrument, and to doing sports.

*standard.

Last year, I took semi-retirement after a nearly forty year career teaching piano, violin and viola and accompanying. I have thoroughly enjoyed it and have met many interesting children and adults along the way. Two particularly memorable pupils are at opposite ends of the spectrum in terms of ability, but both are enriched by their music. The first is a sixteen year old boy l first taught when he was seven. His talent for the piano was phenomenal and very obvious from the beginning and last year he was accepted into the most prestigious conservatoire in the country as a junior scholar on a Saturday. Since then, he has continued to make amazing progress. He is also a very talented composer and his work has been recognised by the conservatoire. The BBC Young Musician of the Year competition has returned and he is easily the equal of many of the participants. He has been learning viola with me for a year as a second instrument and is going to take grade five in November. He will have a career in music in one form or another.
The other pupil is a young man in his early twenties who has been learning the piano with me since since he was about fifteen. He is autistic and went to a special school. In that time he has reached around grade one in stabdard. He can read music, but his processing speed is slow, so he has to learn every piece by rôte. As may be imagined, this takes a very long time. Just before the summer holidays, we put the final touches into the piece he had been learning for several months. This included pedalling. The end result was a piece of music that was played beautifully; as well as anyone else and better than many. I was moved to tears because of how much it meant and how much more he had to do in order to reach this point.
Finally, to my own playing. As I said upthread, l have recently taken semi-retirement. I am now enjoying making music for myself and have joined a very good orchestra which plays to a semi-professional standard, which I thoroughly enjoy. I have some other personal goals. I have a music degree, which I achieved in 1986, but now I am working towards taking diplomas on each of my instruments. In ascending order: ATCL on viola, LTCL on violin and FTCL on piano. I am really enjoying the challenge and, most importantly, the beautiful music l am learning.

I don’t run because so think I’m going to win the next Olympics. I don’t play tennis thinking I’ve got a shot at Wimbledon next year. I definitely don’t make DS practice his cello thinking he’ll ever be a professional musician (not least because he wants to be a marine biologist).

Not everything has to be training for a future career. You can do things because you enjoy them.

Firstly, several of the professional musicians I have known hadn't even started their instruments by 8 years old.

Secondly, if you think the main aim of musical training for children is to produce a career musician, you have missed the point.

My husband began piano at 14 & voice at 16. He’s made a living from music since his mid 20s. A portfolio career a mixture of teaching, performing, conductin, accompanying etc etc.

my son began piano at 13. He’s not graduated yet but today he’s on a train down to London earning £50 an hour as an accompanist and last month he was working on a Major UK tour of a musical.

for both of them music is what makes life worth it for them.

Do you think the only point in doing something is to be brilliant and make a career of it? What a shame.

Dh learnt two instruments to grades 8 and 5 growing up. He still plays one in a group twice weekly, and the other about 3-4 times a year when needed.

Dd2 played to grade 8. She's at uni and playing in her uni band in a new instrument she took up at uni (very similar to first, but that was the instrument needed more) and they do tours and she has a lot of fun. When she comes home the people she keeps up with are from her youth orchestra, not school.

It's not a waste of time for everyone, just because you don't use it.

I had almost the opposite upbringing of what you describe OP. I always wanted to learn how to play the piano.

We had one at home and I really wanted to learn. I could pick out a few tunes by ear with one hand. My mum actually discouraged me, told me there was no point in me having lessons. She said I'd give up and that playing with 2 hands is really hard. She taught herself and told me that if I really wanted to learn, I'd teach myself.

For years it was an unfulfilled ambition. I really envied anyone who could play.

Years later, age 41, I decided to have piano lessons. I knew a place that taught adults.

Well, my piano teacher tells me what a pleasure I am to teach and that I'm musical. I had no problems at all playing with with 2 hands and practiced so much I picked it up quickly. I actually passed my grade 3 (with distinction) last month, 18 months after I started my lessons.

To this day, I'm so cross with my mum because she totally put me off playing. The amount of pleasure I get from practising is unbelievable. Just think, how many more years of pleasure I'd have had if my mum hadn't snuffed out my dream.

So, OP, with all due respect, you're talking a lot of boll-rap.

I think you unified a whole forum because you touched a nerve. You do from time to time see kids that are being forced to take music as a naice middle-class accomplishment who are clearly totally meh about it, and it kills you to watch all love for music being drained out of a kid who is clearly living out their parents’ dream.

But I don’t think that’s so very common a case. I also think a kid doesn’t have to love music for it to be an interesting skill they’ll be grateful for in later life. They might be meh about the piano as a kid, but they might be happy to have that skill in twenty years when they can pick out a tune on the piano at the pub.