Are more of you planning to move your DC from private to state for 6th form now?

Nice. Jesus wept.

Good job their school day is so short then.

Wow this is so inaccurate you really need to do your research properly.

this is what is so mad about the 11+ - half of it isn’t taught at state schools at all. Not VR, NVR, any reasoning and sometimes not some of the Maths which can be Y6 content not yet covered.

Private schools of course teach this. State schools aren’t allowed to as it is useless for those not taking the 11+. So state school kids have to either self learn via books or get a tutor. Outside of school, in their free time.

I wouldn't know as we don't live in a grammar area thankfully. I personally think they are even more divisive than private education, all the desperate striving to keep your kids away from the less able. But it's all water under the bridge for me as I'm done with school aged kids.

I'm guessing yours aren't.

Or maybe people don’t live in grammar school areas, or are fundamentally opposed to selective state education, or their children are more than capable of performing well at a comprehensive school.

How do you know who believes whom on an anonymous forum? You can only speak for yourself, of course. I'm not saying everyone is capable of doing it without tutoring but some clearly are. I'm guessing yours aren't.

I think people don't believe you. But that's the nature of an anonymous forum, anyone can say whatever they like about themselves

Why are you not understanding basic facts? I was making the point that not all children are hothoused by parents for grammars. I also evidenced it with my own personal experience, which you seem to have missed the point of and instead chose to interpret as boasting. And once again, there were others in his cohort just as bright and just as untutored. Are we done now?

@Sneezeanddessist

It was more the "did you just join to boast". Sorry if my reality doesn't fit your rhetoric.

It was because we were asking you few times what point actually you making... That all kids are like your son? That it is easy to get to grammar and preparation are not needed?
Surely one child is hardly an argument in the broader conversation

But that was when CEM was used. I heard that they withdrew from CEM and do now GL everywhere to grammar.

???

I see!

What on earth are you talking about? My DC can privately educate their own DC if they decide to. I wouldn't be influencing them either way.

@Sneezeanddessist you obviously have an extremely bright dc who will no doubt go on and do good things with a well paid job. Hopefully they won't want private education for their own kids, I suppose at least they'll be able to buy a house in a super selective grammar area.

@Smoothie23 bucks grammar 11+ has NVR (or at least it did have when my son sat it.
it’s not been a feature of any of the 5 independent school entrance tests which DS2 sat though. (But is in the CATS they sat each year in prep)

Oh it wasn't asking the specific school that was rude. You can ask after all. It was more the "did you just join to boast". Sorry if my reality doesn't fit your rhetoric.

You are talking total nonsense about NVR. VR is not part of the curriculum either. Maybe you need to do a bit more research.

It was never easy to get into a super selective grammar but it was and still is possible for a very able child to get in without tutoring. That's all.

What is so rude about asking which grammar school requires NVR? Simply I never heard of it as the grammar schools exam principle is to require only the state school requires but at a high speed and with complexity. And they would never ask for NVR which is not in curiculum .

You are describing a genius that required hardly any preparation. Maybe it was many years ago and getting into superselective grammar was easier? Nowadays even brightest kids prepare to get in through many means.

Do you mean to be so rude? I am not saying which grammar he went to. Nor am I saying he is a genius, just very bright. I have no need to boast but I don't like when the trope comes out that all grammar school DC are tutored and hothoused by their parents to get in. That is not always the case. In his cohort I knew a number of very bright DC whose parents could never have afforded tutoring. It does bring something to the topic because it calls out statements that are just not true. Are you the thread police?

There’s a fair bit of diversion in this thread - NVR is certainly part of the Kent 11+ and is not taught at state school. It’s illegal to teach it at state schools.

So state school kids either need to learn it via books and or a tutor. Unlike the private kids who are taught it at school.

I am sure - I am talking about one school in our experience. Of course it’ll vary. But the LSE doc quoted above it does seem to be a thing at uni.

IME, the difference in how they learn is stark, and can be seen when they swap from one to another. (Private to state grammar, one school!).

It was a mix of maths, VR, NVR and an essay I think

Which grammar school is that? Just want to explore which grammar school includes NVR in the exam. NVR is in most cases a private school thing.

We knew he had a very high IQ because his primary had picked up on it and he was working independently several years ahead in Maths and English

I still don't understand why a mum of some genius joins the chat as if she wanted to prove that children are not tutored. Do you understand that it doesn't bring anything to the topic? One swallow doesn't make ...Or did you join to boast?

Didn’t say that - see the post below. 🙄

Difference is in how they are taught day to day. In school.

I said no tutoring and that is exactly what he had - no tutoring.

I'll ignore the condescension. We knew he had a very high IQ because his primary had picked up on it and he was working independently several years ahead in Maths and English from about Year 3 (not at our instigation). When it was time to think about secondary, we visited a range of schools with him but we pretty much let him decide where he liked best. When he was interested in the super selective, we looked atthe school website together and read about the exam. It's all public domain stuff. It was a mix of maths, VR, NVR and an essay I think. None of it was rocket science. There were no mock tests for the exam - the school doesn't release them.

More significantly than getting into the school without any tutoring, was the fact he excelled when he was there and had a great time. He and was always in the top few in the year across all subjects but he also did loads of sport, music and debating etc. The school was the perfect fit for him. I felt sorry for some there who had just been shoe horned into it.

So your DC did benefit from having a workbook to prepare (I think you'll find that was on my list)?

I think we are arguing over terminology. I accept that you did not employ an actual tutor. However, your child did benefit from some support by being provided with a book, which is different from going into the exam having with no preparation at all.

Perhaps instead of saying "no tutoring" we should say "no preparation for the exam"? I still think it would be extremely difficult to go to a super selective exam with no preparation at all.