How oversubscribed are your local schools? Will they be able to take on students who are currently privately-educated?

Anecdotally friends with sen children have had those children either unceremoniously expelled from local private schools or they are not allowed in in the first place. The latter was for a money no object family. No local private schools would touch their autistic but academically bright son with a barge pole. In the state sector they are obliged to accommodate them. That’s why I don’t really understand the sen in private argument. Unless they are in a specialised school maybe.

There’s some seriously emotive language being used ‘envy’ & ‘hatred’ towards people who have ‘bettered themselves’ honestly get over yourselves!

Mostly people don’t care because they are too busy living their own lives to be concerned about yours 🤷‍♀️

Of course “people” don’t care! The amount of envy and vindictiveness in this country is unbelievable! I have lived in several countries and have never seen such an awful amount of hatred towards those who have bettered themselves and dare send their children to private schools! it is the prime reason why this country has zero aspiration.

I'm just shocked that people seem to think it's genuinely OK to bring in an immediate tax on private school fees with no thought to what a logistical nightmare it will be but also the huge emotional impact on those kids who have to leave their school friends and school at potentially very short notice.

Surely, the most fair and sensible way to introduce a tax on education (if it has to happen), would be to introduce it from the point any kids now enters the independent sector. It's hugely unfair to tax those who signed up before VAT was implemented.

On average. What are people in oversubscribed cities meant to do? Move?

https://www.economist.com/europe/2015/10/30/greece-reconsiders-a-tax-on-private-education

@RoseAndRose Yes they did, in 2015. But it was such a shit show that they revoked it fairly quickly.

Distance doesn't seem like a big deal for private school parents in our area - they taxi their kids to schools already.

I doubt very much that Greece introduced a sales tax on school fees as EU forbids it.

Taxing school fees as a headline policy is a clear demonstration that Labour in uninterested in looking to re-establish a common market (which in days of EEC required sales tax harmonisation) let alone rejoin EU

my local catchment schools are already massively oversubscribed and now refuse all placing requests. I think this policy won’t help although it will obviously vary from area to area.

Nationally, demographic trends mean that there will be more school places than prospective pupils.

But it's very likely that there will be difficulties in some boroughs (those where there are a high level attending private schools and limited scope for expanding state schools). Edinburgh has already been mentioned, several London boroughs are in a similar situation and it could affect other cities too). Plus there might be other local pockets where the national trend does not apply.

Hard to predict exactly, but I think it's very likely that there will be places where it is bumpy. Not necessarily from people deciding to leave the sector precipitately, but deciding not to join it (eg 8+ instead of reception, 11+ instead of 8+, 13+ instead of 11+) and that could mean shrinkage of admission distances.

Children with undiagnosed sen do not thrive at private schools. Most are expelled through behaviour policies. If they are quiet and are going through their private education undiagnosed, then the private school they are at is failing them as they have not picked up on their difficulties. They may find they thrive at a state school where teachers have more experience of sen.

I think the issue here is that taxing education is just wrong, and is not something that happens in other countries including socialist / left leaning ones. I understand that Greece introduced VAT on private schools and the outcome was awful, a real mess.

Also, the kids who will be most affected by having to move at potentially short notice - tbh introducing this without it being a phased-in system is cruel on kids - are those in key years at secondary, GCSEs (Y9-11) and A-levels (Y12/13). The birth rate started to fall around 2013, so the school years with places are not relevant when you talk about those in GCSE/A-level years.

Should we pay VAT on private healthcare too? University education?

No, the simple truth is that Labour knows this is a vote winner which affects a relatively small proportion of the electorate (around 7%). Ideologically it would make sense for them to introduce VAT on private health but lots of people (including socialists/those on the left), especially the young - use it freely.

Area with lots of good schools. Locally undersubscribed so children from other areas are bussed in. So it won’t be an issue

Then the brilliant news for the economy is all the money that will be released when kids move into the state schools and their parents can spend lots more with all the small businesses.

I live in an area with very popular oversubscribed schools but there are plenty of school places in the less popular schools. Even the oversubscribed schools tend to see a lot of movement and spaces opening up after year 7 when people discover the reality of having a child in that school due to long commutes and other factors. It shouldn't be an issue.

School fees are already hardly affordable to working families ( and it coincides with Tory government) - people who don't have external sources of income need to think twice while choosing schools.
In general working people got poorer so if your parents were able to put you through private school doesn't mean you can give your child the same thing - thanks to you know who.

They've closed a school in my area due to falling birth rates. Hope that helps.

@Sirine1708 there have been no increases in the 3 yrs we've been with the school.

I get a discount for being a key worker. My pay inflates as per nhs terms.

I'm interested to know whether online schools like King's Interhigh will be hit with VAT rises.

Was hoping the manifesto might provide more information on exactly what is being defined as private schools but there is very little detail.

I have friends with children doing PA BTECs at 6th form which are state but with 'top up' fees - are they going to be hit with an extra 20%?

What about diploma courses for 18+ that aren't CertHE or degrees and so don't come with funding?

I think the online schools may well see a big increase in applications for secondary - one parent stops work or does WFH, lessons online and then vast amounts of extra curricular alongside.

That's the real reason https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/the-charts-that-shows-how-private-school-fees-have-exploded-a7023056.html

@usernother "Only 2 have places" means there's actually a choice of schools in your area. A lot of private parents don't live within walkable distance from their current school either or just prefer to drive so it's not a problem for them anyway.

Very oversubscribed. Only 2 have places. One is on the edge of the county with bad transport links. The other requires improvement.

@Rehab4rightmove
How many times did your school increase fees in the past 5 years?
I think both Labours and Tories are now a joke tbh but 20% would be absorbed both by schools and parents if not for the previous hikes in fees.

If we are talking about working families paying private school fees, does everyone in your family gets salary increased "in line with inflation"? We work in private sector and it's not a thing for both of us.

The small school we send our kids to, is seriously worried this policy will cause the school to close.
It caters for children who have suffered EBSA. It is a 'budget' private school.
There are 2 such schools in our small city.
Two thirds of parents have said a 20% increase would mean they would have to reconsider.
These families will absolutely not send their kids back to the schools that gave them trauma, they will home educate instead, resulting in less working parents.

I doubt this is the result Labour hope for, but it's a huge vote winner. Pitting people against each other, creating more division.

I want the tories out, but I won't vote for a party that is creating more friction in our fragile society.