Tiffin boys and rugby

And guess what, I won't mind....as I believe he will end up where he should be.

That is a great approach that every good mum should follow

And guess what, I won't mind....as I believe he will end up where he should be. If that basketball player makes it in...well-deserved then.

Maybe he gets in via the sports pathway, or maybe he gets in the academic way...
Or maybe (purely hypothetical and don't take it personally) he will miss by few points and a basket ball player with a lower score than him will get in.

All the kids were given the opportunity to sign up to be assessed for music or sports. It is up to you to decide to register or not. If you have a dc who is naturally inclined or worked hard in sport or music, then great to try.

And that is a positive thing the new head teacher is doing this. We were not considering Tiffin seriously until I saw the sporting opportunity (not because he is not academic enough, he is, but he is also very into sports).

Maybe he gets in via the sports pathway, or maybe he gets in the academic way...but at least we know, there is an interest in sports at Tiffin.

@SometimesYouWinSometimesYouLearn Drawing talent as you mention is a positive for me, there are only a few sport and music places and it's an added value to the school. If some children are border line on test results and they miss out, they would still have a good chance to secure a place as the waiting list moves and regardless, they would do well wherever they go.

You have a right to your opinion. In my opinion that would make only sense if all of kids were assessed and given points for music and sports.
Grammar is not in the end a sport specialist school or music.

They have a new headteacher from private school who uses private school tactics to draw talent then to boast what a great sport team winning that they have. All at a cost of kids who were on the border of getting in

Don't really agree with this. These are 9 kids who excel in sport or music. I think it is important to recognize other areas of importance besides just academics. And it is not like these children are preforming poorly in academics. They are still required to pass the test. And also, children who excel in sport or music spend time focusing on them, instead of just studying.

Which is unfair to other kids who scored higher in the English and Math test

The point is, the first 9 in each category are given priority if they pass the test in the second stage. The children are given ranking order in their music or sporting ability....based off the amount of points the achieved during the assessment.....they rank I think 30 of these children and they get 10% leeway off the first stage test. The second stage they need to hit a pass mark.....and they take the first 9 in the ranking order of those who passed the mark. The pass mark is a bench mark.....and for the children who get in via the normal route.....I think they are ranked by highest score....so even if you pass the benchmark, you might not get in, as there might be many ahead with higher scores if that makes sense. So the benefit is, if you are in the top 9 for the ranking by stage 2 and manage to pass the test, you get priority to get in.

@W4mumoftwo from what I understand for the first stage, the boys were to run laps and see how many laps they can do in 8 minutes. I think with each laps there were markers, so if you hit the marker, but did not finish the last lap, that was noted...so points given for each time you hit a marker. Boys were running in groups that were split up. Not sure how accurate these tests are or who was paying attention to when the different kids passed a marker. But, I think it is good they have it, as it will attract some more sporty kids into the school.

Sports aptitude at Tiffin- my son attended, he is a top athlete and didn't pass the first round. I was surprised and asked him casually about what happened. He said there was this kid blocking him in the running test, there was a narrow space and he couldn't take over, he felt he was doing it on purpose and asked him at the end: where you blocking me? and the kid said: maybe... I said, well, such is life, you are too polite. But you don't need extra points to get a place, you will do well in the tests...I think these assessments are misleading.

I know two boys at Tiffin, both sporty and very bright but also lovely kind personalities. Not my top choice, it is our option 1 for state but we want to go private, as sport is equally important to academics for us, but just thought I'd put my experience..

Oh thank the Lord!

@GranCanaria37 , to help answer your original question, this website has information about school rugby. It says Tiffin has 26 teams, and plays in 8 leagues/competitions: https://schoolsrugby.co.uk/schools/tiffin-school-537/teams/2023-2024/rugby-union

You can also see how it measures up against some other schools in these league tables, but they're a bit fiddly to use: https://schoolsrugby.co.uk/leagues

Good. I wasn’t personally attacking you. I was pointing out your flawed thinking. And frankly you’re not discussing the topic the op asked about - you seem to be here for your agenda

Well, they do give a marginal competitive advantage to some kids who are sporty and musical as well as being very bright.

My first thought when I read the consultation was, given that so many of their kids are sporty and musical anyway, it was a lot of admin effort to go to for little tangible benefit. But maybe it sends a message that music and sport are valued by the school, and therefore attracts more sporty/musical applicants. Perhaps it's all part of trying to shake off a perception that they're a nerdy exam hothouse.

The school is academically focussed but extra-curricular is a big thing and there's lots of encouragement to participate.

@heydood so what is the point of that music & sport aptitude tests at the admission point if they are anyway only considered for those who scored highest and got a place anyway? That would make sense in private school where there is a scholarship/fees discount.

I am sorry but I will not continue discussion with somebody who doesn't seem to discuss the topic but continues personal offensive remarks.

Apologies op as this has gone completely off track as these threads always seem too.

If you patronise people and claim you have critical thinking skills, implying others don't well you better use them. I would also question how helpful your contributions have been too.

"That suggests that 10 percent of the spots could go to 9 pupils who just passed the 11+ exam but excel in sports or play the violin"

"Just passed" is an odd conclusion given the two stage process and the fact that they only prioritise the 9 in each category who got the highest maths/english scores.

That suggests that 10 percent of the spots could go to 9 pupils who just passed the 11+ exam but excel in sports or play the violin, allowing them to secure a place. Meanwhile, a child who scored slightly better on the exam might not get in because they lack those additional points for musical or athletic aptitude.

I understand that there will only be 9 spots, but I am aware of the intense competition among families aiming for super-selective private schools. They push their children to play guitar and violin from an early age and participate in as many sports as possible. The competition for those 9 places will be fierce and very ambitious parents will push to develop musical and sport skills beyond average.

Prioritising pupils premium gives equally capable kids whose parents could not afford 11+ tutoring to get chance to get to school. That is actually a good thing in my opinion.

Also a positive thing is the Inner catchment as before it was absolutely crazy. Children from e.g. Brighton were applying to this school leaving no chance for talented local kids to get in.

@northernerinthesouth2000 Do you have anything relevant to the topic to contribute or only ad personam attacks? Is that the level of the discussion that is mastered at Tiffin?
@TiberiusFlam Please look carefully. I asked questions and not the conclusions.

Btw I requested mumsnet admins to review if we have puppet game here

Using her critical thinking skills 😂

@SometimesYouWinSometimesYouLearn so you hadn’t even read the policy? Then how did you come to your conclusions?

@SometimesYouWinSometimesYouLearn , it's all in the policy that I linked to above (I first read it when they sent it out to parents for consultation a few months ago). The aptitude tests are optional extras, not for all. If they take the tests and score above a threshold they will get a 10% leeway for selection from the first-round of maths & english tests. They then have to score above a threshold in the second round of maths/english tests. Only the top 9 maths/english scorers out of the sports-aptitude candidates and the top 9 maths/english scorers of the music-aptitude candidates will have any advantage over the rest of the kids in the second round.

They're also now prioritising pupil-premium.