Secondary School Appeal

OP, if the school is that far away, wouldn’t your daughter qualify for free school transport? Are there many children in your area going and if so is there a school bus? To qualify your daughter would need to be attending the nearest suitable school so there are closer undersubscribed schools you may be told she needs to go there, but from the sound of it she’s been allocated this school by them so you’d have expected them to place her in a closer school if one were available.

We won our appeal a few years ago. We were 8m outside furthest distance, and on allocations day 3rd on wait list, but we're not offered a wait-list place and got in via appeal heard mid-May.

Look at the other appeals threads for how to appeal. We made the case that the school had space as well as why it was important for our child to go there. Apparently many parents don't do the first part. We were one of two upheld appeals out of 2 days of hearings. Was initially told our case was thin, but whatever we said, it worked.

But thankfully I'm not in your LA, and my salary is not funded that way - like I said earlier. Yes, schools pay for the appeals service but you are wrong to assume that funds my salary.

I can’t help re appeals but if you missed out on a place at preferred school by 85m, chances of success on the waiting list are high. Lots of state school places will come available almost immediately while parents choose to either homeschool or send to private

is there not a catchment school with transport arrangements?

"No my salary is not paid through top slicing school budgets, but nice try. I present appeals for all academies and our very few LA schools that are left."

Different LA's have different models. Yours may (or may not) be similar to ours. Ours takes a "service provisioning" approach. They provide a service catalogue, which includes the appeals service as a catalogue item. LA-run and Academy schools can procure the service from the LA, or use an appeals service from an alternative service provider.

Any school (LA or academy) that subscribes to the service will get an itemised bill.

If you had the role you describe in our LA it would be paid for by the appeal service subscriptions

Other LA's, that have fewer academies, provide the appeals service from a top-slice of their overall schools budget.

Either way, schools pay for the appeals service, which covers your salary.

"it has become (as usual on Mumsnet) unhelpful and frustrating due to misinformation being given. 20 years of appeals experience, what do I know???"

You know a lot, from your perspective, but others also have long years of experience and know a lot from their perspective too. You have made the mistake of assuming your views trump everybody else's (very common on these threads), that other views should be silenced, and that the op can't make their own mind up about which advice to take on board, and which to ignore. The op seems very sensible so I'm sure they will do that.

I also have that background. Nobody should withdraw from exercising their legal rights out of guilt or emotional blackmail. Otherwise, there's tacit approval to the notion that schools could break Admissions Law 'because only somebody selfish would appeal'. And it's a given that, without this legal protection and right acting as a check and balance, some schools would break the Law.

Take away the reliable income for independent appeals staff ensuring that decisions are legal, take away the imperative for Governors, Heads and Admissions staff to know Admissions Law and follow it in all cases, and you will end up with schools discriminating against children on the basis of things like disability, income, ability, ethnicity and other Protected Characteristics.

It's no different legally than exercising a right to Trial by Jury or having free legal representation upon arrest in Criminal Law - nobody should be dissuaded from having legal representation and denied the opportunity to be tried by a jury of peers because it's more expensive for the Government; just because the legal test is on the Balance of Probabilities, rather than Beyond All Reasonable Doubt, that doesn't mean anybody should eschew their legal rights out of a misplaced sense of 'social responsibility'.

So do appeal, OP. You may be offered a place completely separately to that over the coming weeks as people make decisions to go to other places, or if the consultation period for EHCP establishes that your preferred school is the best place to meet your child's needs - but still appeal. It's your right, it's the right thing to do and I hope that the Panel make the decision that is right for your child.

No my salary is not paid through top slicing school budgets, but nice try. I present appeals for all academies and our very few LA schools that are left.

Any parent wishing to appeal will not see the school's case until they do, and that may help their reasons for the appeal.
All LAs work differently in relation to how appeals are paid for, maybe this is something you should explore if you feel that your school is struggling to manage appeal costs.

Leaving this thread as I wanted to help and support parents but it has become (as usual on Mumsnet) unhelpful and frustrating due to misinformation being given. 20 years of appeals experience, what do I know??? 🙄

There's no benefit to being the first to appeal when there are weeks to go before the deadline.

This is an important point. All appeals for the school must be considered at the same time, by the same panel. Usually there is a "group stage" where the school presents its case, followed by an individual hearing for each parent, where they present their cases. Decisions are made in a single meeting after all appeals are heard. Therefore there is no advantage in appealing sooner rather than later, so long as you meet the deadline.

I am also involved in the appeals process, so my views are just as valid as yours, and typical for many schools.

Do you mean you are an admissions manager for the local authority? And do you mean that you are the presenting officer for schools that are under local authority control? If that is the case, you have one perspective. Your salary is probably being paid by top-slicing of school budgets, so you have no reason to care about school finances.

In contrast, my experience is with academies (more than one). Our academy trust is the admissions authority. We pay the local authority for our appeals service out of our budget, so we get an itemised bill.

Local authority schools may not get an itemised bill, but they are still paying for the appeals service (in fact, ironically, the undersubscribed schools in the LA area are probably subsidising the oversubscribed schools for their elevated use of the appeal service).

I can see how that makes things trickier.

My DD is in year 7 so I spent time on this forum this time last year. There was a thread on those who had appealed and those on waiting lists. Worth having a read, it really does seem to be the case that there is movement on the lists. There was lots of good advice about being able to find your position on the waiting list too. There were also a lot of people who won their appeal.

My advice (and I've never submitted a school appeal so feel free to ignore!) is don't rush yo submit it. Take your time to do your research and formulate your arguments. There's no benefit to being the first to appeal when there are weeks to go before the deadline.

As an admissions manager and someone who presents appeals for over 100 schools per academic year, I would recommend that you submit your appeal.
Previous poster is projecting her own school difficulties onto their responses, and they also have zero knowledge of the local context or school case.
The cost differs depending on LA/appeals service so don't give that any thought. I'd be very surprised at a school paying £400 per appellant in the bulk appeals.

Ok, I concede that point, but it makes no difference to the other points made. Whether it is SEN or SEND, it doesn't have an EHCP so any school should be able to cope with it, and therefore it isn't a strong appeal argument.

Many schools have a community fund that you can donate to anonymously, so it is worth considering.

She has SEN not a disability. Special educational needs are dealt with through the EHCP process. I know it is on its knees, and parents are desperate, but Appeals Panels are not qualified to judge whether one child's SEN outweighs another's, and they know that all schools have to cater for SEN.

I realise this isn't what people want to hear, but it will be the school's defence. Without it, they would be the target of SEN appeals from all over Bristol.

"And you don't know whether the school OP is appealing for is one of the ones which puts up a week case or not."

Neither do you. But there are ways of gauging it from the local context, such as the type of school (academy or LA), whether there are undersubscribed schools nearby, whether there has been recent building work, and whether the school's recent appeal stats show they have a solid defence. These are all things that people can think about for their own appeal.

Each appeal costs our school an extra £400, which does make a huge difference financially

£400 is nothing compared to a child traveling over 2 hours a day for school - and a disabled one at that.

And you don't know whether the school OP is appealing for is one of the ones which puts up a week case or not.

@Meadows11 I would put in an appeal and also go on the waiting list for any other schools nearby which would be easier to get to. At the same time I would start to practice on the buses and attend any other transition events run by the allocated school.

"Ignore previous poster, they are on every appeals thread trying to dissuade parents to appeal."

No, I've given encouragement where it is warranted. I work in a school, so I know about the finances and the "defence" side of appeals. I also have admissions expertise. My insight is just as valid as others who are panel members etc, though coming from a different perspective. I can tell people what the school's defence is likely to be, and I can tell them the negative impact of appeals on the school. What they do with the information is up to them.

"Assuming the school is holding other appeals, then one more won't make a huge difference financially."

Each appeal costs our school an extra £400, which does make a huge difference financially.

"Nearly 1 in 5 appeals are upheld. That's not fantastic odds, but it's not terrible either if you research your case well"

In many cases appeals are only successful because schools deliberately put up a weak defence. These are usually LA-run schools that want to put up their PAN but they haven't been allowed to because the LA is trying to fill up less popular schools.