North London Secondary state for my DS

Fortismere's results are still very good and it's still very well thought of as far as I can tell. A much preferred alternative to Highgate Wood. I couldn't really care less about Ofsted's grading. Hopefully it'll make it less oversubscribed.

Where did you go in the end ?

The 20 places for Islington kids at DAO include siblings and cared for children, and maybe children with an EHCP too, so some years the number of actual places available through the test/music are more like 8 or 9. Which is not to say it’s impossible, but you definitely need a plan B!

I know little about CFSB, but I would say that if you’re going to compare the GCSE results with other local schools, remember that boys schools usually have lower results than mixed. I think if you look at school profiles on the gov.uk websites you can see a breakdown of % of 4-9 passes by sex at mixed schools which is a better reflection of how well boys are served/achieve.

To the point that in year 6 in Tetherdown, those who aren't tutoring for grammar/private, are tutoring to get into the top set in Fortismere..............

yes but the difference very pronounced, more so than in other schools

Surely it’s always the top set that gets the good results, by definition?

Fortismere isn't that well regarded locally. Largely the top set that gets the good results, big drug issues, pastoral care poor. Downgraded at last Ofsted.

To be in with a chance of getting into an over subscribed school you’ll need to be very close to it. To do that you’d need to either sell you current house or let it and rent close to the school.

APS and Fortismere are well regarded and get good results. APS is strict and Fortismere has lots of gossip about drugs and bullying but I have no connection so I don’t know the truth.

Wren Academy in Finchley and Ashmole academy are also get good results. Wren has the added bonus of being near The Compton School which is outstanding so a bonus choice there.

Obviously there are selective / grammar schools but if tests are stressing you out then it’s probably not the right path for you. Almost every child who takes those tests will be coached or tutored.

No state school will totally ‘middle class’ but you can tell by looking at house prices around the school how rich parents have to be to stand a chance of getting their kid into it. I think Fortismere would win this!

There are two decent choices for girls, Highbury Fields and EGA. But it’s a bit grim for boys

Also, I think most posters, and the general consensus, is that there are not many good state or private options in Islington at all. SMMA is the only decent option and that's also very difficult to get into and there is only one private school that is not great. I completely disagree, as an Islington parent, that we have great options. There are much better options in Haringey or Camden.

They go on about it because it's true. A reasonably bright child will not get into DAO. I know more kids who got into Latymer than DAO. The 20 places for Islington kids is misleading. In reality there are far less due to siblings and only the very very best will get through. Based on the what the OP has said, I don't think she should factor this is as an option as it really isn't. Is she said her child was exceptionally gifted, I would still say it's a bit of a lottery. I say this as someone who thought my bright/top set kids would get into this school, and other grammars, and they didn't, neither did loads of other very smart kids. The average in most state schools seems to be 1-3 per year. I don't know where you are based or what school you're referring to that gets more kids than that in?

For what it's worth, my own anecdotal evidence is also that loads of very bright kids from Islington do not get into Dame Alice Owen, whereas they get into Westminster or City. Of course, most of them would not choose it over these other schools, and they just sit it for practice.

@winterrabbit - different year groups and different schools will have different outcomes.

But my point was for the OP - they live in Islington and if their son is musical and/or reasonably bright, they stand a chance of getting in, so worth a shot. As other posters have pointed out, there are other good options for Islington kids - both private and state - and lots of families are (understandably) put off by the journey to and from Potter's Bar each day. So that all helps ultimately narrow down competition for those 20 places.

It does seem that certain Islington parents love to go on and on about how 'impossible' it is to get in to this school - and I don't think that's particularly helpful or true, so...

Complete opposite to my experience. I know 3 kids in DS's year who got offers from Highgate and none got offers from DAO.

@winterrabbit - 4 families in the past 5 years. Most recent Islington child I know of tried for DAO and Highgate. Didn’t get a Highgate offer, but did get through to DAO on an academic place.

How recent was that? I know literally one child who got into DAO and loads who got into super selectives or grammars. The 20 kids includes siblings from Islington so in reality the numbers available can be way fewer that that. Even for the brightest kids is a very remote possibility.

I know quite a few Islington families get into DAO - and the kids weren’t wildly academic, nor off the scale musically talented. Yes they were bright… but those same kids tried for super selective privates (City/Westminster/Highgate etc) and didn’t get offers, but they did for DAO.

They were tutored yes, but all the kids in other boroughs trying are also being tutored! Islington still carries an advantage…

I agree with @winterrabbit I've lived in Islington for almost 20 years and I know about 1 or 2 families who managed to get into DAO. And that required intensive tutoring etc.
If you are religious/at a faith primary then you can get into SMMA on a slightly wider catchment but still need to be within a 1 mile I think.
APS is getting v popular now so would check catchments in recent years before moving.
Honestly for boys it's pretty tough in Islington! Some of us gave up and went private

CFBS is a tough school with poor behaviour (and a matching zero tolerance behaviour policy), poor communication (don't expect teachers to ever reply to emails) and average results. It does well at percentage getting 9-4 at GCSE but only 60% get 5 GCSEs at 9-5 which is not comparable to SMMA, Fortismere or APS who average around 75/80% at this level. On the plus, the building and sports are amazing but it definitely is not a gentle or nurturing school although it is a lot better than Highbury Grove or any of the other City of London academies. If I was you, I would move next door to SMMA, APS or Fortismere. Of all three, SMMA is my favourite and definitely worth the effort. Dame Alice Owen is near impossible to get into even if your child is a genius.

I was reading about that school the other day- it’s where Gary and Martin Kemp (who grew up in Islington) went.

We are considering moving to be closer to the school although not sure how we would do that with owning a property.

Are you saying that you own a property where you currently live and would not be willing to sell it?

Or that you do not own, just rent at the moment?

If the latter, all you have to do is break your current lease and rent a new place within “catchment”* for the school of your choice. There is no difference in the local authority’s eyes between renters and owners for school admissions residence purposes. What IS important is that you must actually live in the house as your only and permanent home.

• it won’t be a catchment as such, as the max distance from school to which offers are made will vary from year to year, I am assuming you know this already from primary applications, info will be on Haringey website for Fortismere and AP.

Have you looked at CFBS? Highly recommend it.

@Hatcher - I see what you're saying, but it still stands that it's easier to get in from Islington, I think? It is a big borough, but the number of candidates won't be remotely as large as the number from all the other postcodes combined. Even if Islington candidates historically rank in the Top 100 each year, 20 of those places exist for them at any rate...so it follows that it's less competitive for the Islington kids.

Anyway, don't wish to derail the thread - but I think for the OP it's worth trying to DAO if they are in Islington and their son is musical. If he plays an orchestral instrument AND has musical aptitude AND lives/goes to school in Islington, his chances are quite good I'd say. Not a slam dunk, but not that difficult. And you're not expected to be crazy grade 8 level either - they don't expect the levels that is asked for music scholarships to privates like Highgate or NLCS.

Hi @daffsinvase . I like a good numbers puzzle! I see what you are saying but I think we do not have the numbers of how many Islington kids sit the exam. It could be 50 for those 20 places or it could be 500 for those 20 places (Islington is a big borough). But we do know that every year enough Islington candidates (18-20 depending on how many get through other routes) are ranked in the top 100, so would have gotten in even if they were from a different postcode. They would be in the top 100 anyway. These 20 don’t get any postcode advantage.

I think Dame Alice likes to perpetuate the sense that Islington applicants have some advantage, in order to attract Islington parents. It’s precisely because the school has over the years succeeded in making itself attractive to them, that this advantage is gone. To be in the top 20 of Islington applicants one has to be strong enough to have gotten in from other postcodes.

@Leopardmatches - they do count siblings in the Islington intake.

@Hatcher - I could be wrong, but it depends how you look at those numbers. Leaving aside getting in on catchment place or sibling place, if you consider the music and academic intakes - the more kids that are applying for places, the more the overall standard of candidates goes up, and the tougher the competition is.

To use your figures, it's a 1 in 80 chance versus a 1 in 20 chance, no? I'm not saying a child who gets in from Islington is always going to be less academic or musically talented than one who gets in from the other postcodes - but it probably follows that the most academic, or the most musical, in a much bigger pool of candidates will probably be more academic or musical than those from a smaller pool.

Because Islington candidates are competing against far fewer kids, they have a big advantage - it's not really a level playing field on that front.