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Homophobia in school

37 replies

TooManyPlatesInMotion · 18/01/2024 20:44

DS is 13 (y8) and goes to a boy's Catholic school (state). The majority of boys are Catholic or otherwise Christian, and most are from culturally very conservative backgrounds. We are a C of E family ourselves.

DS has a group of friends, is generally quite outgoing and laid back and is doing very well academically, loves sport too. The school has really helped him improve his motivation and engagement.

But - and it is a BIG but - I am so sick and disappointed with the general culture of casual homophobia and misogyny, expressed constantly between the boys. My DS has told me about this and when he first started some of the language came home, so we have had discussions about how unacceptable and hurtful that language is.

It is now definitely really affecting my DS who, I suspect, may be questioning where he fits in, and his own sexuality. Some of that is obviously conjecture on my part, but he knows my door is open if he wants to talk about it.

DS is so, so angry in a way he struggles to talk about and has now started getting into fights, eg when hanging out playing football after school. He is thin on the details but there has been at least once occasion when he has told me of suggestions that he is gay, plays like a "batty boy" etc. I am not condoning the fighting on his part and have spoken with him about it. There is no excuse for fighting, regardless of provocation, but I am really worried about his wellbeing.

My issue is with the school and what I do now. The language and culture is worse than when I was at secondary school in the late 1990s, when gay/queer/lezza were the worst insults going and no one came out at school, even in 6th form. I cannot believe it is still like this in London in 2023.

Surely the school have safeguarding obligations, a duty to promote a culture of inclusivity and " British values" (or whatever it is called) in PSHE, regardless of it being a Catholic school?

Has anyone dealt with anything similar or have any advice?

Thanks.

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AliasGrace47 · 02/09/2025 13:59

Foxesandsquirrels · 19/01/2024 13:10

It's certainly the joke amongst the London schools I visit as a dyslexia teacher. They do have a lot to answer for, especially as they seem to really play up on the stereotypes of LGBTQ people in all their campaigns. All the gay boys seem to be feminine and the lesbians have short hair and look manly. Everyone is covered in rainbow and super proud. What happened to just letting it be? Honestly if they left it all alone it and just said ok so what John likes Daniel, it would serve the community far better than what they're doing now.

And if schools are using stereotypes only in stuff, why is that an excuse for honophobia? Nobody should be bullied for how they dress or have their hair etc

AliasGrace47 · 02/09/2025 13:56

Foxesandsquirrels · 19/01/2024 13:10

It's certainly the joke amongst the London schools I visit as a dyslexia teacher. They do have a lot to answer for, especially as they seem to really play up on the stereotypes of LGBTQ people in all their campaigns. All the gay boys seem to be feminine and the lesbians have short hair and look manly. Everyone is covered in rainbow and super proud. What happened to just letting it be? Honestly if they left it all alone it and just said ok so what John likes Daniel, it would serve the community far better than what they're doing now.

What do you mean 'look manly'? If a woman, lesbian or not, wants to wear traditionally male clothes, what's wrong with that? Plenty of women like trousers and short hair etc, what's the issue? Same for feminine boys.

There's nothing wrong with not being gender-conforming, is there? Gay people are a bit more likely to be that, and that's fine.

Otoh they should be clear that gay people don't have to look a particular way.

dorisdaydidnitdodirtydeeds · 19/01/2024 23:22

Nottodaty · 19/01/2024 09:23

My daughter goes to a Catholic school - they would not accept any of this behaviour. One girl who used the term Gay to a boy - (your acting so gay) was pulled up on it immediately and it was then followed up with a year assembly- acceptance, bullying. As a school they have PHSE sessions just like any other school. We are usually informed if it’s to with a more sensitive subject to enable any support a child may need.

I would definitely speak to the school. They need to ensure the message is sent out and behaviour improved!

Sadly it may be because it’s an all boys school - friends that are teacher have always said , if they had daughters they would send them to all girls school, sons to a mixed!

Edited

Teacher here, worked in Catholic and state school for many years. I couldn’t have said it better that Nottodaty, even down to the comment about a daughter to the girls school, a son to mixed.

TooManyPlatesInMotion · 19/01/2024 21:37

I will do @25Green

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25Green · 19/01/2024 19:13

@TooManyPlatesInMotion that’s a great step forward!

You might find that names don’t need to be mentioned as they might know who you are talking about anyway.

Glad he has managed to get through today! Keep us updated.

thecallofthemountain · 19/01/2024 18:51

TooManyPlatesInMotion · 19/01/2024 16:55

I have contacted DS' head of year who is coming back to me with some dates for me to discuss with him further.

DS himself doesn't want to name individual boys, which makes it tricky. He has, however, managed to get through today without getting into any trouble himself for fighting or anything else and I feel he is on an even keel for the weekend, which is something.

Hopefully they actually do something.

TooManyPlatesInMotion · 19/01/2024 16:55

I have contacted DS' head of year who is coming back to me with some dates for me to discuss with him further.

DS himself doesn't want to name individual boys, which makes it tricky. He has, however, managed to get through today without getting into any trouble himself for fighting or anything else and I feel he is on an even keel for the weekend, which is something.

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Foxesandsquirrels · 19/01/2024 16:25

25Green · 19/01/2024 15:13

@Foxesandsquirrels Just want to make sure that we are not justifying the behaviour of some misogynistic and homophobic kids due to some 'stereotypes of LGBTQ people'.

@TooManyPlatesInMotion if you feel like it is getting out of your depth maybe seek some help with counselling. However, the school should definitely have a PSHE lead which you should talk too.

In that case, before you send another patronising message, you might want to make sure you've read my original post, not just the reply I sent to someone specific. I clearly say in my first post: It isn't an excuse as their behaviour is disgusting

Hadalifeonce · 19/01/2024 15:18

It's not just in your DS school, DD was in a mixed school, she said the level of homophobia and sexism among the boys was appalling.

25Green · 19/01/2024 15:13

@Foxesandsquirrels Just want to make sure that we are not justifying the behaviour of some misogynistic and homophobic kids due to some 'stereotypes of LGBTQ people'.

@TooManyPlatesInMotion if you feel like it is getting out of your depth maybe seek some help with counselling. However, the school should definitely have a PSHE lead which you should talk too.

Foxesandsquirrels · 19/01/2024 13:10

TooManyPlatesInMotion · 19/01/2024 11:44

Absolutely this @Foxesandsquirrels . It is a source of hilarity amongst many of the kids - constant jokes about trans issuing, identifying as x/y/z, and a real push back against the progress that has been made in recent years on LGBTQ+ issues.

It's certainly the joke amongst the London schools I visit as a dyslexia teacher. They do have a lot to answer for, especially as they seem to really play up on the stereotypes of LGBTQ people in all their campaigns. All the gay boys seem to be feminine and the lesbians have short hair and look manly. Everyone is covered in rainbow and super proud. What happened to just letting it be? Honestly if they left it all alone it and just said ok so what John likes Daniel, it would serve the community far better than what they're doing now.

Foxesandsquirrels · 19/01/2024 13:07

SquirrelSoShiny · 19/01/2024 11:44

Honestly I agree with you. I think Stonewall and trans activists have so much to answer for. Most of the worst activists are straight men who fancy women. Meanwhile LGB people who just want a quiet life are now having to watch the backlash unfolding and watching teen attitudes going back to the 70s. It is absolutely dismaying.

Yup. Not to mention the genuinely gay kids who don't want to come out whilst in school because they don't want to belong to an intense rainbow waving club. They just want a quiet normal existence with the girl or boy they fancy, just like the straight kids get to have.

MahShinyShoes · 19/01/2024 12:31

I bloody hate that we - rightly - try to teach our boys to recognise misogyny and homophobia & the payback they get for calling out a bigoted meathead is a fight or bullying.

See also: 'dont be such a girl'

It's all another drip into the subconscious that other groups are lesser than straight men.

It undermines the PSHE best lessons in the world, but how do you change a culture that punishes people for calling out bigotry?

stayathomer · 19/01/2024 11:51

Son in a Catholic school in Ireland and they regularly address bullying, have awareness talks about heterosexuality and homosexuality and people being allowed to be who they want to be etc. saying that I’ve had big arguments with ds about his language- he had a big beef with the ‘f’ word being taken out of the fairytale of New York at Christmas. His best friend is gay and I told him if people were calling his friend that he wouldn’t feel the same and he said his friend feels the same. He also regularly makes ‘identifying’ jokes and I told him to leave it, that there’s people out there just trying to figure out who they are and where they fit in and they don’t need jokes and people isolating them further but again just an eye roll and he thinks I’m too paranoid and says everyone just gets along, there’s no need for all the talk.

TooManyPlatesInMotion · 19/01/2024 11:44

Absolutely this @Foxesandsquirrels . It is a source of hilarity amongst many of the kids - constant jokes about trans issuing, identifying as x/y/z, and a real push back against the progress that has been made in recent years on LGBTQ+ issues.

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SquirrelSoShiny · 19/01/2024 11:44

Foxesandsquirrels · 19/01/2024 11:35

Tbh I don't think this is a catholic school issue. It seems to be very common at the moment with young people. It isn't an excuse as their behaviour is disgusting, but I have found young people are becoming more and more disengaged from the LGBTQ+ and trans issues and are seeing it as all a bit of a joke. I think the push in all of this has caused things to actually get worse than better in terms of acceptance. A lot of young people think it's all a joke and it's causing a dangerous problem.

Honestly I agree with you. I think Stonewall and trans activists have so much to answer for. Most of the worst activists are straight men who fancy women. Meanwhile LGB people who just want a quiet life are now having to watch the backlash unfolding and watching teen attitudes going back to the 70s. It is absolutely dismaying.

Foxesandsquirrels · 19/01/2024 11:35

Tbh I don't think this is a catholic school issue. It seems to be very common at the moment with young people. It isn't an excuse as their behaviour is disgusting, but I have found young people are becoming more and more disengaged from the LGBTQ+ and trans issues and are seeing it as all a bit of a joke. I think the push in all of this has caused things to actually get worse than better in terms of acceptance. A lot of young people think it's all a joke and it's causing a dangerous problem.

TooManyPlatesInMotion · 19/01/2024 11:12

Thank you @25Green . I am very sorry to hear that your brother had such a horrible time of it.

I am open with my DS. He knows he can talk to me and ask me anything and that I will always help. But he is 13 and angry and doesn't want to have in depth chats with his Mum (I would have felt the same at his age too tbh!).

Absolutely no LGBT+ society or anything similar. I wish there was!

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25Green · 19/01/2024 10:53

The best thing you can do is have open and frank conversations with your DS. Be there for him.

My brother went to very well known London catholic school in late 80's early 90's and unfortunately what you describe is happening, happened to him. I do feel that part of the issue with catholic schools which I feel breeds this mentality is what people refer too as 'catholic guilt'.

I would take the school to task about this behaviour, Stonewall has a lot of support in this field. Does the school have an LGBT+ society? Maybe trying to get some speakers in? Lessons on LGBT+ history, celebrated in February?

Like I say the best you can do for him is keep that conversation open with him and try and guide him the best way you can.

TooManyPlatesInMotion · 19/01/2024 10:20

@HooverIsAlwaysBroken yes, this is exactly it, there seems to be a rejection amongst the boys of the entire LGBTQ+, and indeed a reaction against it. It really is open season.

In the circumstances you describe, it does sound like the school mismanaged some of the initial conversations around the issues though!!

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WinterSnowFox · 19/01/2024 09:25

My son goes to a regular secondary school he is year 7 and is called gay constantly and homophobic remarks

Nottodaty · 19/01/2024 09:23

My daughter goes to a Catholic school - they would not accept any of this behaviour. One girl who used the term Gay to a boy - (your acting so gay) was pulled up on it immediately and it was then followed up with a year assembly- acceptance, bullying. As a school they have PHSE sessions just like any other school. We are usually informed if it’s to with a more sensitive subject to enable any support a child may need.

I would definitely speak to the school. They need to ensure the message is sent out and behaviour improved!

Sadly it may be because it’s an all boys school - friends that are teacher have always said , if they had daughters they would send them to all girls school, sons to a mixed!

HooverIsAlwaysBroken · 19/01/2024 09:08

I am so sorry to hear about your son, it must be so hard.

We had a related issue a few years ago when there were unfortunate, not age appropriate talks around LGBTQ+ issues in the school without notifying the parents. The schools intention was probably good but many of the boys (including DS) became convinced that you could change sex based on your behaviour and, as they were happy as boys, they worried and started to reject a lot of the activities which the talk had mentioned as girly (music, drama, arts).

now a few years down the line, they reject the entire LGBTQ+ movement, possibly because they are cross about that initial scare (I had DS asking me if one of his male friends was/would become a girl due to their hobbies).

It is quite weird, any comment on racism is abhorrent to these boys but there is open season on LGBTQ+ issues.

we are coming down as a ton of bricks on homophobia and misogyny and I would like to think that DS is bringing those attitudes to school. If you are friendly with any of the parents I would put some feelers out on what they have heard? I would never tolerate homophobic comments and I can assure you that I would take it extremely seriously if I suspected that DS made any comments which could be interpreted that way.

stomachameleon · 18/01/2024 22:49

@TooManyPlatesInMotion I imagine that's the case both ends of the spectrum. I teach in a PRU and the language and colourful views I hear would make your hair curl.

downtonuton · 18/01/2024 22:33

I think this is a Catholic School thing - also London but DS came out in Y7 at an undersubscribed school in 'requires improvement' and it was never much of an issue. Some minor comments, not total plain sailing but no bullying and he is not one of the super popular kids either.

We did find the people would use 'gay' as an insult, but not against gay people.

in gaming etc - 'man that was so gay' when someone missed a shot or similar when playing sports. I even heard him do it once. I did point out he shouldn't and he did stop but it's just something kids say (and shouldn't). But it's not picking on gay kids or saying they're bad or anything.

My friend has a gay son in mixed Catholic school and it is a different story - not able to be himself there and no support from the school really - and kids do get picked on there

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