If your child won a place at a competitive secondary….

You also have to consider personality as much as intelligence. In theory, my DS ought to have been grammar school material. There was a general assumption he would be going to grammar amongst people I knew because he was known as the smart one by his peers. He failed the 11+ because of anxiety. When he sat CATS in secondary he scored 134 so it wasn’t an academic ability issue. Had it been a 13+ entry it might have been a different story, but at 10 he just wasn’t there.

Thankfully we are also London so he went to a good local comprehensive instead and we didn’t have everything riding on passing the 11+. I don’t really regret that we tried it as the tutoring we did was still helpful, but I wish we’d taken the decision not to do the exam at the end of it.

When DS was in Reception, he was in the ‘top readers group’, who were all then the Narrators in the Christmas Show. I’ve got a picture of the 6 of them - 4 girls and 2 boys. They all graduated this year - 4 Oxbridge, 1 Durham, I Imperial, all with firsts. So that was a good predictor!

My DS was so poor in primary school that I was told it was a good job he was good at sport as he wasn't very academic in year 5.

Turned out he had undiagnosed SEN (autism and dyslexia) he school refused due to crippling anxiety for the whole of secondary school only picking up books in year 11. Entered 6 GCSEs as a private candidate and scraped the grades to get into state 6th form.

He has done SO well in 6th form that he got 3 A *'s in his year 12 mocks and has applied to Oxford (still waiting on that ) but has offers from 3 Russell Group universities already.

So I'd say relax.

@AvengedQuince The Week Junior Science and Nature is really good, lots of fun facts and great pictures.

@LeopardPJS I think we probably live not too far from you (not Stokey any more but quite close).
DD1 was in the top 3 or 4 in her class for maths and English all through primary, and got into Latymer with minimal tutoring, about 4 months. One other from her class didn't make Latymer but got into another grammar outside of London - family moved- and 2 others got into Forest. One of those 2 was definitely middle of the class rather than top and her mum said she wouldn't bother trying for Latymer. So I disagree with what a PP said that the private Indies are harder to get into than the grammars - not the ones near us anyway!

DD2 is probably a stronger reader than her sister but was more middle of the class. She's wasn't as focussed and never had the natural maths ability. For example DD1 would sit and work through a Lego set from start to finish while DD2 would get bored and start making her own thing. She didn't get into Latymer but is doing well at local girls school.

I know a couple of people who just missed out on Latymer but got places at Mary Mag. Also if your child is musical, the music places need a lower score to get in, although I think there are only 20.

Thanks, I read to him but he also likes to read alone (and it's nice when he's still and relatively quiet).

@AvengedQuince
Anorak magazine? Although 4 is quite young. You might be better reading that sort of thing to them!!

My DS1 is really bright, not a genius or anything but "top of the class" material, and yes he did get a place at a selective state school (not a grammar school - a comprehensive that awards 10% of places based on performance in a test). It was clear from around age 3 I'd say.

Are there other good magazines for younger children? Looking for one for a 4 year old, reading age probably 6.

Aquila magazine is fun

I still don’t know if you can tell or not. The pp who said that language at 5 is a predictor of later academic success is interesting. I have heard this before.

Both of mine were severely language delayed - DS’s speech was unintelligible to anyone other than us until he was 7. He then became very articulate overnight. He caught up with his peers and has remained average in our local primary and now high school. He’s Y8. Predictions are that he is bright, but lazy. He works at the subjects he loves and does the minimum in the others. He is on the ASD pathway.

DD’s speech was understandable and she had excellent vocabulary but her diction was poor, and to an extent remains so. She is much more naturally diligent than her brother but wasn’t learning to read and was clearly struggling and was subsequently diagnosed with dyslexia. She is now also diagnosed with dyspraxia, ADHD and autism. She is currently 11 and her reading and mathematics are at Y3/4 stage. We work a great deal with her and she has private coaching with a dyslexia specialist and ongoing speech therapy.

Both children are curious and interested in the world and knowledge about current affairs, politics, ethics, religion - we talk a lot as a family. DD loves building, design, the natural world, geography, science and DS loves reading, writing, drama, film, gaming, computers. They are both lower high school and at this point, i will be chuffed if they both get 5 GCSE passes under their belts, just to give them the greatest number of options for the next stage they choose.

But who knows, I could have an Oxbridge graduate on my hands - but I doubt it. I am incredibly proud of them both.

@LeopardPJS all the pedagogical evidence indicates that children develop at different rates and experience peaks and troughs in their educational achievements. Children who get top marks throughout, from primary through to university, are reckoned to be <2%. Some peak at a younger age than others - for example, research shows that there is no direct correlation between 11+ scores and GCSE grades (grammar schools have this information but obviously aren't over-keen to share it).

Some children may not achieve well at school - there are a myriad reasons for this, too many to detail here, but can be economic, social and cultural as well as purely educational - but thrive on the different style of teaching and learning at university where access to resources, libraries, tutors etc tend to be more equitable than in schools.

So in short, return to this thread in 10-12 years' time and see how your DD is doing then.

DS1 - his year 1 teacher told me he was Grammar material . She was correct . I hadn’t really twigged . He was my first and I just thought it was normal . I was more worried about DS2 who is above average but inconsistent and didn’t get into Grammar. I thought he was struggling 🤦🏻‍♀️.

One of mine was meeting expectations in reception and didn't really learn to read properly until year 1. By the end of year 2 he was exceeding in all subjects and had read all of the Harry Potter books. My middle child has always been exceeding but didn't do as well in her KS2 sats and despite picking up reading quicker, she isn't as proficient as her older brother was at her age. It's too early to tell with my youngest.

Yes, it was with DS1. School didn't tend to gush about anyone, but other parents were telling me from Reception that he would definitely go to the grammar school. We didn't tutor, but we did do past papers, which he was happy to do and enjoyed, and I spent a few hours talking to him about the creative writing paper which was his weakest point - for example he thought that if the question was "write a description of a holiday" everything had to be true, and we talked about using all the senses when describing things etc. No non-verbal reasoning here.

DS2 is bright but nobody ever said "oh he's definitely grammar material" and as it turned out he didn't go to the grammar, but is in top stream in his comprehensive. He wasn't so keen on doing past papers and I didn't push him, although we did a few. Would he have gone to the grammar if we had tutored or if I had made him sit down every week and do past papers? Possibly, but it would have been hellish for everyone.

My 4 were always in the top 3 in their class. They could all read before starting school, just picked it up quickly. They all read loads in primary school, loved the library. They also loved Maths websites so we just signed them up and they extended themselves. DD1 taught herself all the timestables in Reception on some app. DD2 was obsessed with languages, still is. We have a DuoLingo subscription and she is always on their teaching herself stuff like Russians. DSs both obsessed with Maths from an early age. They played a lot of strategic board games when they were little. All 4 naturally good at Music too.

There is no way I personally would have sent a child to a superselective grammar who does not process information quickly and loves Academics. The workload is just too much.

My eldest was clearly extremely bright from day 1. Even at nursery they told me they thought i was making a mistake sending him to our local very good state school and right through people were encouraging me to sit him for highly academic schools. I had him assessed at about 9 and CAT scores were about 130 across the board. However, whilst he like maths he absolutely hated anything to do with English and i reached the point where I simply couldn’t face the battle with him to get his English up to scratch for the highly academic private schools. We are not in a grammar area. He went to our local outstanding comprehensive where he thrived as a big fish amongst other smart kids.

To be fair he didn’t have the self motivation to care enough about his academics until about the end of year 9 when suddenly he flew. His GCSE’s were brilliant, A levels were 2 x a* and an A and he’s at a RG university currently on a placement year doing some incredible things and i have no doubt he’s going to be extremely successful.

We are an educated professional family but i had to let him go at his own pace.

My middle one who I always felt was solidly above average, nothing special and certainly not super selective material has found themself flying at A level and my youngest who is defiantly the brightest has also not really knuckled down until year 9.

What they all have though is insane curiosity for history, politics, music and the solar system and we’ve just embraced it and they’ve come to it in their own time

DS, well ahead academically always.
Me couldn’t read at 9 but won a scholarship at 11.

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