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Original poster

How to choose a secondary school in 12 hours?

64 replies

Ooopsies · 30/10/2023 18:35

We have lived abroad in a foreign country for several years. 5 days ago we landed back ‘home’ in the UK. Enrolled the DC in the closest school this afternoon after a lot of ringing around. DS has gone into Y6 and I was informed by the school I need to complete a secondary school application form by tomorrow. School have provided the information booklets and the form but I have no clue how to choose a school so quickly. The primary I can cope with, DS won’t be moving but I am going to be looking around and getting DD on some waiting lists for other schools (assuming I want to move her after I’ve thoroughly checked this one out as well as the others).

Before anyone says anything, I miscalculated and we though DS would be in Y5.

What am I after?

  • How to assess a school without looking at a school?
  • What are the most important things to look at?
  • What areas of a website should I focus attention on?
  • What should I look out for that signals a good school?
  • What should I look out for that would be a big no?
  • Anything else?
Im also going to thank in advance as I am very stressed right now. I will definitely be taking any and all advice on board and acting upon it immediately. I will try my best to provide details if they are asked for.
OP posts:
clary · 30/10/2023 21:35

Ah @Takeachance18 has local knowledge I don’t so ignore me Grin

clary · 30/10/2023 21:34

Oh I see Keswick is miles away. If you only get three slots (we do where I live) then I don’t think I’d waste one on Keswick. Might be tempted to put Cockermouth top as a total punt, then two local ones - check out the admissions for the faith school and see if it’s feasible.

Takeachance18 · 30/10/2023 21:30

Every chance of getting a space at Keswick from Whitehaven, children have done the journey for years, Keswick has a high intake, for size/age of population in the area and with Cockermouth and QEGS as options either side and other schools in the South they regularly move out to the West Coast for admissions- being rural lots of children are reliant on school transport. Whitehaven Accademy has potential for improvement as has been through a rough time and the recent results probably reflect this.

clary · 30/10/2023 21:28

Hmmm Whitehaven’s data is very poor, 16% was it gaining a good pass in maths and English? Of course that could mean a low-attaining intake but the P8 is also low which is not promising tbh.

How many slots on the form op? How far away are Keswick and Cockermouth? You could always put them down then move nearer if lucky enough to get a place?

Sorry I don’t know the area so no idea how ridiculous that suggestion is.

TokyoSushi · 30/10/2023 21:20

Is there a class WhatsApp group? Could you ask one of the parents in the class to add you to it in the morning? You could then ask where 'everyone else' is going, you don't have to abide by it, but it might give you an idea.

shockeditellyou · 30/10/2023 21:16

You should put your catchment school down someplace on your preferences. If nothing else, this will mean that you will have a place at a school that’s either close enough to walk or where transport to and from is paid for. If you don’t put down a banker, they can send you pretty much anywhere.

HamstersAreMyLife · 30/10/2023 21:15

Think about transport too. I've applied today and not gone for our catchment school as its the only one DS couldn't walk to so we are taking a punt on 3 schools we are not in the catchment for but will mean he can get there independently!

Original poster
Ooopsies · 30/10/2023 21:12

@carly2803 I genuinely don’t know. He’s literally been in the new primary school once he was there for 2 hours after the council found us a place so we turned up, filled in the paper work and he joined the class without a uniform. He will make friends, but at this moment in time, we have none of this to go off. I’m doing this all completely blind and with very short notice. It was the school who asked me whether I had applied for secondary. I obviously hadn’t hence the stressy night I’m having.

OP posts:
LIZS · 30/10/2023 21:11

The booklet should state how many were admitted in each category. So, for example, check if all Faith applicants got places and from how far away non Faith applicants were admitted. Then compare it it to the category your dc would be placed in.

carly2803 · 30/10/2023 21:08

where are his friends going? he will make good friends within the next 12 months surely?

this should be up on the priority list too

Original poster
Ooopsies · 30/10/2023 21:02

Thanks for the explanation @clary, really helpful.

@Russoooooo and @Takeachance18 thanks for the offer of the local knowledge. We are in Whitehaven at the minute if that helps. We are just renting for the minute as it is close to where DH took a job so we have the flexibility to move somewhere else later on as, all going well, we will be staying here permanently.

I’ve spent the last hour going over websites and reading about curriculum and getting a general feel for the schools.
I have narrowed the list down to 6 schools which are The Whitehaven Academy, St Benedict’s RC, West Lakes Academy, Workington academy, Cockermouth school and Keswick school.

Cockermouth and Keswick seem to do very well. I was reading i Keswick had become a special language centre, one of about 15 schools in the country, DS is fluent in 2 languages and has been learning a 3rd and a 4th so might work for us. I heard there a busses but looking at Google maps they seem quite a long way from Whitehaven, would we get a place?
The Whitehaven Academy seems good from the website, but the underlying in data is a bit poor. I’ve also read a couple of conflicting things about West Lakes Academy. Haven’t found much about Workington Academy? We are not catholic either so would we get a place at a catholic school such as St Benedict’s? As a side note, Catholicism doesn’t bother us in the slightest, we lived in a very catholic country for years. (Sorry for all the questions).

OP posts:
PuttingDownRoots · 30/10/2023 20:46

A quick way to work out where local kids go is to do some uniform spotting at 8ish in the morning tomorrow.

clary · 30/10/2023 20:41

Yeh looking at that list Cockermouth and Keswick are the ones eh. Are you close to either op? Remember it’s a preference only not a choice at the end of the day

Squirrelsonthescaffolding · 30/10/2023 20:34

similar progress measures used to be call ‘value added’ then ‘distance travelled’ which are perhaps clearer, so if a school does really well by students who come in with relatively low achievement and their progress is more than might have been expected then their progress measure will be high, but the students overall achievement eg % getting 5 GCSE passes (4-9 I think) might still be lower than the national average. But actually the school generally doesn’t make that much difference to an individual student’s level of achievement (and there are often not huge differences between schools), a supportive family goes a long way. If possible, having local friends is often really good for the teenage years as they do more independently.

Takeachance18 · 30/10/2023 20:26

Cockermouth and Keswick have been the top schools in the area for nearly 40 years (Cockermouth was formed 38 years ago), the others have varied over time. Buses run from Workington to Keswick daily, Cockermouth is slightly harder to get into if out of catchment.

clary · 30/10/2023 20:13

It’s all a bit if a game tho - just checked a school on that list and it has p8 of -0.11 but GCSE m and E above average and Ofsted outstanding…

clary · 30/10/2023 20:10

Progrsss 8 basically means the progress made by students between them starting and leaving - so it’s not just about student A getting great results - which they might have anyway - it’s about how much they improved.

It's not the be-all and end-all but it is a marker. P8 is low at my dcs’ school and one reason is that kids come in at a high level. But obvs they should still improve.

So a school with high P8 might have low-attaining dc on entry that really improve.

Also look at maths and Eng at grade 5 (= a good pass) - this might be lower than average at a higher p8 school.

Russoooooo · 30/10/2023 20:07

Whereabouts in Cumberland? I’m local and happy to help

Original poster
Ooopsies · 30/10/2023 20:05

Ive spent the last hour making a list of schools from the nearest ones outwards and searching local FB for opinions etc. I have a list of 8 schools. I’ve also included the top P8 schools which seem to be schools people can get to. I need more details on this but this is something someone local is going to have to help me with tomorrow. I’ve also found the OFSTED reports for all of these schools and have a quick look over their results and websites.

Im going to start narrowing it down to 3 using lots of the advice given above which so far has been really helpful in pointing me towards the things to have a look at and consider as well as pointers on how to list schools on the form.

@clary thank you for the link. What does the progress 8 and attainment 8 mean? Is negative bad? There seems to be a lot of negative scores.

OP posts:
Squirrelsonthescaffolding · 30/10/2023 19:37

Local info will likely be most useful. Are you in a road/small area WhatsApp group, many places set these up these during the pandemic. If not , try knocking on your neighbour’s door now and asking to be put on, then ask about where local kids usually go and any differences between schools. This way of phrasing probably gets more useful info than what is best. I taught in a north London school where c60 Y6 children went to about 20 different schools, whereas almost all the children from DCs’ primary school (c58/60) went to the one local state school that they could walk to. So it might not be too difficult a decision if there is an obvious choice, and going with friends from primary might be one of the most important things if your DC is new to the area/country.

PuttingDownRoots · 30/10/2023 19:21

You've had the practical advice so I won't add to it so some reassurance...

Two years ago we had to apply for DD1s school based purely on websites due to Covid. This year I actually got my first proper look round of it with DD2! And in reality... a lot of the stuff on the websites is more useful than the advertising at open days etc.

The bits I found useful...
-SEN policy. One school we discounted as the policy made it clear they wanted everyone to confirm to the preferred learning style. The one we chose had a support unit plus supports anyone who needs it.

  • extracurricular. Not necessarily the exact clubs (they can change) but the culture of offering a variety.
  • Assessment data. I was particularly interested in the Progress Data.
  • Ofsted... a recent report (discounted any more than 2-3 years old) but more what they say rather than the overall grading.

For you I would also look at EAL numbers to see if the schools have experience of supporting that as your DS transitions to the English system.

slopsan · 30/10/2023 19:19

Cumberland is largely rural. Choose your nearest secondary schools. Put down as many choices as there are on the form.
You could look at progress 8, but there is no point putting a school down that is the opposite side of the county that will be a nightmare to get to.
Look at school websites to work out if school buses go there from your location.

YuanZhu · 30/10/2023 19:09

I would be systematic:

  1. work out which schools you have a chance of getting in to. Ask local parents, school, ring the council or see if you can work it out from the booklet. Distance is generally important if the school is oversubscribed.
  2. Work out which schools he could realistically get to. Generally the council will have a lot of information about school transport on their website.
  3. This will give you a fairly short list I imagine. Look at results (progress 8 is particularly helpful - look at P8 by prior attainment for an indication of how the school does for kids like your son. Look at curriculum on school website- what subjects are offered, what is the curriculum like (ambitious? well-thought out?). Look at the head’s intro and other marketing materials- this will give you a sense of ethos. You can supplement this by looking at the Ofsted report and asking around. Ofsted is also helpful for understanding quality of teaching. Website is also helpful for considering particular things that might be important to your kid: sports facilities, drama etc. If you have time, go tomorrow and observe the kids entering or leaving school - are they rowdy with uniform policy not properly followed or is behaviour ok?
Araminta1003 · 30/10/2023 19:04

So you go on the Ofsted website and check out your nearest schools and look at the data of the schools. Things such as results, diversity, how many get X GCSE passes etc. - ideally you go for a school rated by Ofsted as Good or Outstanding. Most importantly though is that your DC can get to the school quite easily be it walk, bus or train etc. Most comprehensive school places are allocated on distance. If he likes Science chose a school that offers triple Science GCSE which means each Science taken as a separate GCSE and the additional maths GCSE for the best performers. Schools really vary on what foreign languages they offer too, how many GCSEs kids are encouraged to take etc If he has any extra curricular talents too check out if those are offered/encouraged. Sometimes if you have eg an Academy football player you want them to get the bus to training directly from school or to the pool etc