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Original poster

Ex is applying for schools that will make it difficult for DD and me

217 replies

lonerdottierebel · 27/10/2023 09:37

Applications for secondary schools close on Tuesday 31st. My ex has custody and is leaving it until the last minute to make the application. They have purposefully been elusive about it, giving me tiny bits of information to make it look like they are involving me so that it appears that way to a judge (should it come to that), making it difficult for me to prove otherwise. This is a common tactic of theirs and is very frustrating. On top of that, the two schools she is favouring most (as is DD because she does whatever will make ex happy), are in locations that would make it very difficult for our daughter to come to me two nights a week as per court order.

A minimum of two buses is required with substantial walking between bus stops. A forty minute journey each way minimum. I have explained this to my ex who sees this as an opportunity to alienate me further, as we both know that DD, who although says that journey will be fine and although it's only three trips altogether (two back to mine, one to school), will soon tire of it, and when it gets to the school day ending, and she's tired, and the choice is between walking five minutes back to my ex's or making multiple walks and bus journeys to get to mine, she is going to choose the easy option, and could you blame her?

So, what can I do? I have tried being polite with my ex and I have tried being firm. It's on record that I have opposed her school choices and for fair reason. There are schools that more central with more direct and accessible bus routes to both ends of the city (I live one end, ex lives the other). I've reminded them that they are leaving it to the last minute. They know this but are doing it purposefully. I have contacted my solicitor who is on holiday.

In the meantime, what are my rights? I have PR, but not custody. Can I make an application myself listing more reasonably-located schools? If so, how does that affect my ex's application? And just looking for advice in general. I appreciate that as I don't have custody their might not be much I can do but thought it was worth asking around whilst my solicitor is away.

I should also add that for personal reasons I am physically unable to drive and taxis across town will quickly become too expensive to sustain. I have contacted the council about support with transport, but they only offer that to the resident parent. Otherwise, the children are expect to get a public bus. This is all new to me as I grow up in a more rural location with designated school buses that took us from our homes straight to the school gates. I didn't realise I'd been so privileged until now!

Lastly, there is has been an ongoing campaign to alienate me from DD since her birth. On a few occasions we have spent months apart from wedges that have been driven between us for no good reason and it has taken a lot of work to undo the damage. So please bare that in mind when responding. This is a continuation of that alienation.

OP posts:
WhamBamThankU · 27/10/2023 15:30

TomatoSandwiches · 27/10/2023 10:33

No court or LA would side with you on this so best to look at things you can do to change your circumstances like learning to drive, moving closer or requesting a change of contact days.
Your post is entirely self centered so I'm not surprised if you ex has resorted to these methods tbh, grow up.

This

RedToothBrush · 27/10/2023 15:28

Crunchingleaf · 27/10/2023 15:20

OP, no one here has any idea of the dynamics of your situation other than what YOU'VE shared....and on this site the great majority assume the worst about men and the best about women (especially mothers!).

For me it’s not about taking a woman’s side over a man’s. I am taking the child’s side. The child’s needs and voice are not part of OP’s priorities when it comes to secondary school. In fact practical considerations such as catchment area/over subscribed schools are not considered by OP at all.

I won’t deny that once a child hits secondary school it can be hard for the NRP to nurture a relationship with the child. Realistically the relationship needs to be strong going into those teenage years to begin with. However, if OP can consistently demonstrate to his child that the child is always the number one priority even when it goes against what is best for the adult then long term the outlook for the relationship will be positive.

This.

Child first

And

If OP was concerned for the child’s best interest they would have checked out catchments for each school and likelihood of admittance, how good each school is, what they offer that matches their daughters interests or not, facilities and ethos of each school…

This

OP is demonstrating well the 'me, me, me' issue.

SheilaFentiman · 27/10/2023 15:25

OP

This is what my county says for secondary applications.

The address on the application must be the child's current permanent place of residence, usually the parents' address.

  • Where the child is subject to a child arrangements order and that order stipulates that the child will live with one parent/carer more than the other, the address to be used will be the one where the child is expected to live for the majority of the time.
  • In other cases where the parents do not live together, the address is where the child spends most of their time. In cases, where the child spends an equal time between their parents/carers, it will be up to the parent/carers to agree which address to use.
  • Where a child spends their time equally between their parents/carers and they cannot agree on who should make the application, we will accept an application from the parent/carer who is registered for child benefit (where applicable). If neither parent/carer is registered for child benefit we will accept the application from the parent/carer whose address is registered with the child's current school or nursery.
  • You must not use a business or carer/childminder's address.
  • You must also not use a relative's address unless the child lives at that address as their normal place of residence.
  • We will not normally accept a temporary address if the main carer of the child still owns or rents a property that has previously been used as a home address, nor if we believe it has been used to obtain a school place when an alternative address is still available to that child.
  • Where a temporary address is used to secure a school place and the agreement to reside there is due to expire before the allocation of places, we may contact you for an update on your plans to secure a more permanent address.
  • An application can only be made from one address, and only one application per child can be made.

We will need proof of where you live - usually your council tax number, or if you are not responsible for council tax, two forms of alternative evidence, such as a copy of your signed tenancy agreement and a utility bill or driving licence.
We will check the address on your application against the records we hold for your child's current school and we may also check council tax records or write to ask you to provide proof of your address.
We will investigate any applications where there is doubt about the address being given. Use of false information may lead us to withdraw an offer of a place, even after a child has started at a school.

SaffronSpice · 27/10/2023 15:24

If OP was concerned for the child’s best interest they would have checked out catchments for each school and likelihood of admittance, how good each school is, what they offer that matches their daughters interests or not, facilities and ethos of each school….

Reugny · 27/10/2023 15:24

boscabosco · 27/10/2023 14:41

what is the disability that means you cannot drive?

Doesn't matter.

I can give you a couple immediately eye sight issues and epilepsy.

Neither mean you can't look after a child.

SheilaFentiman · 27/10/2023 15:22

SaffronSpice · 27/10/2023 15:18

I suspect the mother has already submitted the application and is just trying to defer the argument.

Yes, this is quite likely

Crunchingleaf · 27/10/2023 15:20

OP, no one here has any idea of the dynamics of your situation other than what YOU'VE shared....and on this site the great majority assume the worst about men and the best about women (especially mothers!).

For me it’s not about taking a woman’s side over a man’s. I am taking the child’s side. The child’s needs and voice are not part of OP’s priorities when it comes to secondary school. In fact practical considerations such as catchment area/over subscribed schools are not considered by OP at all.

I won’t deny that once a child hits secondary school it can be hard for the NRP to nurture a relationship with the child. Realistically the relationship needs to be strong going into those teenage years to begin with. However, if OP can consistently demonstrate to his child that the child is always the number one priority even when it goes against what is best for the adult then long term the outlook for the relationship will be positive.

SaffronSpice · 27/10/2023 15:18

I suspect the mother has already submitted the application and is just trying to defer the argument.

SheilaFentiman · 27/10/2023 15:11

boscabosco · 27/10/2023 14:41

what is the disability that means you cannot drive?

If OP wanted to tell us this, he would have done.

theleafandnotthetree · 27/10/2023 15:07

OP, no one here has any idea of the dynamics of your situation other than what YOU'VE shared....and on this site the great majority assume the worst about men and the best about women (especially mothers!). I personally think you've been given a harsh time of it here and can feel how powerless you feel. Realistically, I think that there is very little you can do to stop your daughter going to the school of her mother's choosing - and of course it is also of your daughters choosing even if you have doubts as to whether that is as free a choice as it might be. Your disability and limited income make the situation even more difficult. All you can do is be her Dad, a good and steady presence in her life, even if its limited in terms of time together, even if it's via text etc a lot of the time. Being a parent is a long game and a complicated one, especially where there is separation and even if relations are good and nobody is trying to alienate anybody. My 16 year old son is minded to stay more with me these days, something I never anticipated and I do nothing to actively encourage. My daughter may in time stay more with her Dad. At this age and stage you have to go with the flow to an extent, which I know cam be very rough.

RedToothBrush · 27/10/2023 15:01

arethereanyleftatall · 27/10/2023 14:48

Not once in your fairly lengthy op did you detail what is best for your daughter.
That's telling.

Isn't it just!

TomatoSandwiches · 27/10/2023 14:50

It isn't your DDs or her mother's responsibility to facilitate contact to the point you believe is reasonable op, all her mother has to do is make your DD available, if DD wishes to not make the journey it isn't enforceable.

If you are unwilling or/and unable to make adjustments within your single control then you will have to accept a new normal.

However this is still all a moot point, your DD may find the journey to yours absolutely no problem.

arethereanyleftatall · 27/10/2023 14:48

Not once in your fairly lengthy op did you detail what is best for your daughter.
That's telling.

boscabosco · 27/10/2023 14:41

what is the disability that means you cannot drive?

EandKDJ · 27/10/2023 14:39

Shewhobecamethesun · 27/10/2023 10:04

No genders are mentioned. I presume OP is the dad and mum has residency.
OP please correct me if I'm wrong

Show quote history

Or a same sex relationship...

RedToothBrush · 27/10/2023 14:34

Bluevelvetsofa · 27/10/2023 14:32

Let’s say, for example, that in your ideal world, your daughter goes to a school you prefer. One that’s out of catchment, a few miles away and requires a bus journey. Who’s going to pay the bus fare each day? If you have no money left at the end of the month, it’s not going to be you is it. Do you think your ex would accede to a request to stump up money for bus fares for a school that was not on her list of preferences.

What you want doesn’t come into the equation. What matters is what your daughter prefers and whether her preferences meet the criteria for admission.

Very fair point...

Lovemusic82 · 27/10/2023 14:34

I don’t understand why people are being so harsh and why people are assuming it’s as simple as changing contact days. OP has been to court and been granted 2 days a week contact? It’s not as simple as just changing those days, his ex would have to agree to it. OP has said that they can’t drive due to a disability.

Of course the priority here is DD and if op rocks the boat too much contact could easily be stopped completely as his dd will soon be of an age where she gets a say in contact (12). I don’t think there’s much that can be done about what school dd goes too, her mother has custody and also dd gets a say in where she wants to go, I’m sure for your dd and your ex your 2 contact days don’t take priority over their choice of school. I don’t think there’s anything you can really do.

Bluevelvetsofa · 27/10/2023 14:32

Let’s say, for example, that in your ideal world, your daughter goes to a school you prefer. One that’s out of catchment, a few miles away and requires a bus journey. Who’s going to pay the bus fare each day? If you have no money left at the end of the month, it’s not going to be you is it. Do you think your ex would accede to a request to stump up money for bus fares for a school that was not on her list of preferences.

What you want doesn’t come into the equation. What matters is what your daughter prefers and whether her preferences meet the criteria for admission.

Feraldogmum · 27/10/2023 14:23

Surely taking your daughter on a weekend, when it's just a couple of trips,would eliminate the problem?
Does your parenting not extend to giving up your weekend, got better things to do?

IncomingTraffic · 27/10/2023 14:18

RedToothBrush · 27/10/2023 14:08

the choice is between walking five minutes back to my ex's or making multiple walks and bus journeys to get to mine, she is going to choose the easy option, and could you blame her?

Which is the closest school to your daughters home and current school?
Which school is the most convienient and easiest for your daughter, as she grows more independent?
Which school is she likely to actually get a place at?

And which school is best for you?

I'm guessing that all the best options for your daughter are not the same as what is easiest for you. But whats easiest for you seems to trump all considerations for your daughter.

You don't seem to have actually bothered to ask which school your daughter wants to go to, and why. I guess she's probably been to visit all these schools and is involved in the decision going on with the other parent but this doesn't even seem to be on your radar - its all about which is easiest for you and 'fairest' to you as if its some sort of competition

I think I know why you are the ex and why your daughter's other parent doesn't give you much time. And you want to wonder why your relationship with your daughter is hanging by a thread when you aren't giving any consideration to your daughter and instead are saying any decision she makes isn't hers but the other parents?

Jesus. CONTROLLING MUCH.

Also:
My ex has a history of frequently moving house. As soon as I move, she will move again.

Finding a new house is not easy. People do not move through choice without good reason. The fact you keep moving too, is just 'odd'.

I'd put MONEY on a MASSIVE backstory here.

All very good points.

I also bet the ex’s version of this tale may not match the OP’s ‘I’m a poor victim of my evil ex’ tale.

RedToothBrush · 27/10/2023 14:16

HesDeadBenYouCanStopNow · 27/10/2023 13:43

From age 11 contact is all about what the child wants. So if your child wants to change the days of the week, how often etc then a court would almost certainly grant it. Including if they chose not to see you anymore.

Generally at this age the child will influence the contact that you get, so if changing days of the week makes travel easier and less unpleasant than they may choose that. It shouldn't need a court order at this age

I have to say that if you have a 10/11 year old and a parent still forcing contact via a court order, something is off especially when the parent in question says the relationship is hanging by a thread.

The child doesn't sound like they are likely to continue contact. Framing it as 'parental alienation' takes agency away from the child to say no in circumstances where THEY are the one who can't stand the parent and its got fuck all to do with their other parent.

The thing that REALLY stands out to me on this thread is two things:

  1. the OP seeing this as a competition where everything has to be 'fair' versus the other parent
  2. the total lack of regard for the wishes of the child - with everything centred around their (the adult parent) needs instead

This is controlling behave to force the other parent to comply and does even pretend to consider the child first.

Give it a couple of years and I bet the kid doesn't want anything to do with controlling parent. And it will everything to do with their own behaviour not their former partners...

LittleOwl153 · 27/10/2023 14:14

As someone who is involved in admissions I would suggest you do the following:

  1. Go onto your (your daughers if different) local authority website and look at the school admissions section.
  2. You will be able to put in your daughters postcode - assuming she 'lives with' her mother and see what her 'catchment' secondary school is. You will also be able to find out what the likelyhood is of her getting into that school.
  3. If you put in the postcode of her current school you will see the 'catchment' secondary for most of the kids shes currently at school with.
  4. You can see from the admissions data the likelyhood of your daughter getting into and school as a 'in catchment' or 'out of catchment' kid

The reality is as PP have said - she will get the catchment school of her mothers address at the point the application is made. No amount of appeals about split custody etc will change that.

For clarification school transport is only paid for those 3 miles (or in certain circumstances a non-walkable route) from home to school where the nearest/catchment school was put on the application form. The only deviation from this is where there is no space for the child in the nearest school, then it is the next nearest. Your address will not come into the equation.

In terms of what you can do - you can make the application. It will piss of your Ex even more and you will still only be able to go on the address that the child lives - not yours - so the catchments won't make any difference. If you both make applications, then the LA decides which to accept - and they usually go with which parent is claiming CHB for the child. Any other input you have will need to be through the courts system under a specific interest application. However if the deadline is missed or this court date is after the deadline then the application/change in application will be dealt with as a late application.

I am aware everything I have written is the opposite of what you want to hear. I do understand the difficutlies you are having maintaining a relationship with your daughter - and as the parent of teens - this will only get harder. Realisitcally you need to speak to your daughter - be honest with her about your concerns about seeing her less. Ask her what you can do to make the time she has with you easier/better and try and use that to build a relationship. Can you for example video call or write her letters between the times you see her?

Tough one OP. Hope you manage to maintain some sort of relationship over the next 10 years - after that will be easier if that is what your daughter wants.

HesDeadBenYouCanStopNow · 27/10/2023 14:11

@IncomingTraffic I completely agree with you

IncomingTraffic · 27/10/2023 14:09

HesDeadBenYouCanStopNow · 27/10/2023 14:06

Given the selfish, petty reasons given for wanting to control the school choice, none of which centre the child that is terrible advice for the child involved.

Show quote history

He’d be utterly unreasonable to submit his own application.

RedToothBrush · 27/10/2023 14:08

the choice is between walking five minutes back to my ex's or making multiple walks and bus journeys to get to mine, she is going to choose the easy option, and could you blame her?

Which is the closest school to your daughters home and current school?
Which school is the most convienient and easiest for your daughter, as she grows more independent?
Which school is she likely to actually get a place at?

And which school is best for you?

I'm guessing that all the best options for your daughter are not the same as what is easiest for you. But whats easiest for you seems to trump all considerations for your daughter.

You don't seem to have actually bothered to ask which school your daughter wants to go to, and why. I guess she's probably been to visit all these schools and is involved in the decision going on with the other parent but this doesn't even seem to be on your radar - its all about which is easiest for you and 'fairest' to you as if its some sort of competition

I think I know why you are the ex and why your daughter's other parent doesn't give you much time. And you want to wonder why your relationship with your daughter is hanging by a thread when you aren't giving any consideration to your daughter and instead are saying any decision she makes isn't hers but the other parents?

Jesus. CONTROLLING MUCH.

Also:
My ex has a history of frequently moving house. As soon as I move, she will move again.

Finding a new house is not easy. People do not move through choice without good reason. The fact you keep moving too, is just 'odd'.

I'd put MONEY on a MASSIVE backstory here.