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11+ is going to ruin me

442 replies

AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 12:40

Hi, sorry if this is garbled, I've had a very emotionally fraught morning.

DS is due to sit 11+ this September. He has had a 1:1 tutor for around 18 months. She comes very well recommended and is known for being upfront with parents if she thinks their child might not be quite right for the process/test. She assures me he is able enough.

He's been doing well across all areas, although slightly less so on the maths. He has a LOT of homework which I try to spread out across the week, so we're only doing a couple of (set pages) of books a night and the corrections for practise tests he'd done to previous week with tutor.

Its not always been easy to get him to focus after school, which I do understand as he works hard at school too, but we get through it. Lately he has been so emotional about it and I've apparently just got to the bottom of why... Sat with him this morning, going through corrections of test he'd sat last week. Just burst into tears, beside himself, wouldn't tell me why... Gave him some space and afterwards he told me it's because he doesn't like the way I explain things to him and that I'm "too positive."

For context, I've been a primary school teacher for 14 years. I know how to teach children and what works for different children. My kids at school always achieve well, above national expectations and I've never had any complaints about my teaching style. I never get frustrated with him, am supportive and encouraging and always try to approach the work with a positive attitude, explaining misconceptions patiently.
I'm a single parent and work full time teaching, so to be completely honest it's a massive slog for me to keep motivated and positive for him doing all this by myself. His father is utterly useless and does NONE of the work with him.

I just don't know what to do. This whole process is killing me, I am utterly exhausted. Hearing what he said has just knocked me for six. All this money and time I've invested and endless motivation when I've been on my knees after hard days at work. And I've upset him.

I'm sad and confused and I don't know what to do. I have asked him multiple times if it's because he doesn't want to carry on and he always says he doesn't want to give up.

What do I do?

OP posts:
LIZS · 24/06/2023 15:48

Honestly at this stage I'd back off and leave it to the tutor and his self motivation, unless he wants something explained.

starray · 24/06/2023 15:43

I'm seeing lots of misinformed answers about the 11+ process. It's not the same for people who did it 20 years ago...or even 15 years ago. Much much more competitive now. You really do have to prepare - anyone who says their child got in without even looking at a practice paper is talking nonsense. (Or maybe they child got in years and years ago where it was still possible to do this). It also depends on which part of the country you are in. It's incredibly competitive in London.

Op, it's the dynamic. Mum and child dynamic. It's really difficult to teach your own child. Not your fault at all.

AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 15:43

Dubaibutwhy · 24/06/2023 15:40

I'm going through the 11+ for the second time. 30 mins a night does sound a lot if in addition to his tutoring and other school work.

How about reducing your sessions to twice a week or doing 10 min tests instead?

My problem is, his tutor stars pages in the books she'd like him to complete for the next week, so I feel obliged to do them and that I'm being judged for being lax if it's not done 😬

OP posts:
cadetmumstress · 24/06/2023 15:43

If your child needs that much tutoring / homework to get through the 11+, they're probably not grammar school material.

What a miserable 5/7 years he'll have ahead of him if he has to put in this level of work to keep up with his peers.

Run a couple of practice papers, go to the mock so they can experience test conditions and then enter them to sit the tests. If they pass - great! If not they go to the alternative school where they'll probably thrive and be free of the pressure.

Dubaibutwhy · 24/06/2023 15:43

Also it might just be a difficult dynamic. 11+ prep with DD1 was HELL. With DD2 there is far less drama. She just gets on with it.

Dubaibutwhy · 24/06/2023 15:40

I'm going through the 11+ for the second time. 30 mins a night does sound a lot if in addition to his tutoring and other school work.

How about reducing your sessions to twice a week or doing 10 min tests instead?

AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 15:33

MolkosTeenageAngst · 24/06/2023 15:29

I know I’m missing the point of the thread, but have been able to work out the process for the first 3 codes but not the last one (HUGE = JYMM). Just wondering if anyone can help me out!

It's probably what's called a "mirror code" if that helps ☺️

OP posts:
PreplexJ · 24/06/2023 15:33

Nowfeeltheneedtopost · 24/06/2023 15:27

I was replying to the person saying they had three degrees and couldn't see the pattern.
For an academic 10 yr old, I think a number of familiarisation sessions would be enough. However, I agree that VR and NVR tests are absurd to include in entrance tests because the child's performance can be improved by practice - hence the tutoring arms-race. I am based in SW London and the super-selective grammars here no longer include these, instead focusing on maths and english and making clear that children are not expected to have covered more than the curriculum. Doesn't stop the crazy tutoring of course...but at least children aren't doing absurd VR/NVR tests for an hour a day!

And SW kids start practicing maths and English more an hour a day instead.

dizzydizzydizzy · 24/06/2023 15:33

Aw the 11+ system is so awful! DD failed the 11+. I knew it was wrong and that she should have passed. She went to a comprehensive. She was very happy there and did extremely well. She got virtually all 9s in her GCSEs and 4 * Astar in her A Levels. Now doing a masters degree at a top uni.

But yes, as PPs have said, you can normally only pass if you have been tutored up to your eyeballs. Such a stupid and unfair system!

MolkosTeenageAngst · 24/06/2023 15:29

AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 14:58

Aside from the content of the exams (mainly maths) not being taught until much later, I'd love to know how many naturally bright children would even know where to begin in answering questions like these without at least exposure to them. DS has been taught the technique and can now do them with ease. Children will not have encountered anything like this during year 5 at school. If no one was tutored to at least teach them the technique we'd have pretty empty grammar schools.

I know I’m missing the point of the thread, but have been able to work out the process for the first 3 codes but not the last one (HUGE = JYMM). Just wondering if anyone can help me out!

AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 15:28

PreplexJ · 24/06/2023 15:22

"I'd love to know how many naturally bright children would even know where to begin in answering questions like these without at least exposure to them."

@AlwaysReadyNeverSteady

It is pointless to explain what it is to those who haven't got a clue what this is about in MN.

There is only 2 months to go, ignore those negative comments and focus those constructive ones.

Thank you, I definitely will xxx
Again, thank you to everyone who's offered some fantastic advice, it's truly appreciated, particularly when I was really struggling earlier today.
DS is playing out on his bike with his friends in the sun, the terrible taskmaster that I am...
And I'm having a glass of wine while I write reports and a script for my class assembly 😂

OP posts:
CurlewKate · 24/06/2023 15:28

@AlwaysReadyNeverSteady So it's pass and catchment, not competitive? What was the pass mark last year? Because if you're talking an ordinary Kent grammar, for example, those scores would easily hit the pass mark.

Nowfeeltheneedtopost · 24/06/2023 15:27

AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 15:18

But would a 10 year old? Completely cold? Put in front of them? Never seen it before in their lives?
Enough to get in the high 80s/90%?

Some, I'm sure would be able to. But enough to fill an average sized grammar school? Don't be silly.

Some exposure and being taught the process? Definitely.

I was replying to the person saying they had three degrees and couldn't see the pattern.
For an academic 10 yr old, I think a number of familiarisation sessions would be enough. However, I agree that VR and NVR tests are absurd to include in entrance tests because the child's performance can be improved by practice - hence the tutoring arms-race. I am based in SW London and the super-selective grammars here no longer include these, instead focusing on maths and english and making clear that children are not expected to have covered more than the curriculum. Doesn't stop the crazy tutoring of course...but at least children aren't doing absurd VR/NVR tests for an hour a day!

PreplexJ · 24/06/2023 15:23

Goldencup · 24/06/2023 15:11

9 years ago DS sat the exam in Sept 2014.

Good that your DCs hardwork got rewarded!

PreplexJ · 24/06/2023 15:22

"I'd love to know how many naturally bright children would even know where to begin in answering questions like these without at least exposure to them."

@AlwaysReadyNeverSteady

It is pointless to explain what it is to those who haven't got a clue what this is about in MN.

There is only 2 months to go, ignore those negative comments and focus those constructive ones.

MarigoldGlove · 24/06/2023 15:22

So you're telling me your friend did absolutely no work with her child to help them? No familiarisation papers, nothing? As I said, you don't need a tutor to have a tutored child. Not many children are prepped as intensely as OPs son

Yes, that's what I'm 'telling you' because that's what happened. I've never seen a grammar school entrance exam so I don't know why this is so unbelievably stunning.

AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 15:19

CurlewKate · 24/06/2023 15:17

@AlwaysReadyNeverSteady OK- next question. Is it a super selective you're aiming for or a pass mark and in?

It's not a super selective, just a selective state grammar

OP posts:
AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 15:18

Nowfeeltheneedtopost · 24/06/2023 15:12

Really? You have 3 degrees and you wouldn't know where to start with it? It is logic and patterns.

But would a 10 year old? Completely cold? Put in front of them? Never seen it before in their lives?
Enough to get in the high 80s/90%?

Some, I'm sure would be able to. But enough to fill an average sized grammar school? Don't be silly.

Some exposure and being taught the process? Definitely.

OP posts:
CurlewKate · 24/06/2023 15:17

@AlwaysReadyNeverSteady OK- next question. Is it a super selective you're aiming for or a pass mark and in?

AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 15:15

CurlewKate · 24/06/2023 15:11

@AlwaysReadyNeverSteady

How's he doing on the practice papers he's doing?

The VR, NVR, and coding and logic style questions he's doing well, around 85-90%
It's the maths that's coming in a bit lower, which upon closer inspection is almost always because he's not been taught that actual maths yet, or it's completely new to him because it's year 6 curriculum content

OP posts:
Nowfeeltheneedtopost · 24/06/2023 15:12

fireflyloo · 24/06/2023 15:02

@AlwaysReadyNeverSteady
I've 3 degrees including a doctorate and I wouldn't know where to start with that!

I've recently been through 11+ with dd. She had a tutor for a year, as did most in her class. Despite being an ex teacher, I can't teach her. We're too close. I had to take a massive step back. I think it's normal for them to go through waves of emotions. I'd just continue being supportive and encouraging without being pushy.

Really? You have 3 degrees and you wouldn't know where to start with it? It is logic and patterns.

AlwaysReadyNeverSteady · 24/06/2023 15:12

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

I live probably half a mile further out than I need to be to be sure of a good chance for the good schools. It is a ridiculous area for schools, with insane house prices because of the schools. Frankly, the way things are financially I couldn't afford to actually go through the process of moving anyway, I'm already on the bones of my arse now paying an extra 200 on my mortgage (in a cheaper area) because of rates rises.

OP posts:
Thethingswedoforlove · 24/06/2023 15:12

My dds were tutored precisely because of the type of question you shared op. They haven’t struggled at all. Quite the opppsite.

Goldencup · 24/06/2023 15:11

PreplexJ · 24/06/2023 14:31

Wow that is 7/8 years ago

9 years ago DS sat the exam in Sept 2014.

CurlewKate · 24/06/2023 15:11

@AlwaysReadyNeverSteady

How's he doing on the practice papers he's doing?

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