How Stressful is the PGCE Really?

@DudeDudeson
don't look my age but you're saying it's actually hard to get a job in secondary teaching? This is my main pro for doing it, that I could actually finally get out of TEFL into something with some security. And it was main con against ID, that I'll just end up back in TEFL. But if the two are equivalent in terms of jobs prospects where I am at this stage in my rather failed life, then it changes things significantly.

I think it depends which subject you teach. If you are going to teach maths or science you will probably get a job easily. You have more qualifications than I do, so schools may be more interested. I was an English and Drama teacher. The only schools that showed an interest in me were rough, inner-city schools, and I didn't think I had the stamina and resilience for them. I was 33 at the time. It may be that the current teaching shortage is more severe, and therefore a post may be readily available, but nothing is guaranteed. As a well-qualified 38 year old, you will be more expensive than a 22 year old. How qualified are you in TEFL? Do you have the diploma? If you do, you may be able to find work writing text books, being a rep for text book publishers, examining etc. It will never be the stable career that secondary teaching is in terms of progression, salary, pension etc. Sorry I don't have better advice. Just sympathy as I was much in the same boat. One friend of mine who worked for years in TEFL retrained in tech and became a UX designer. There are other options if you don't leave it too late.

Sorry for the terrible spelling, my laptop is f*cked after one my kids spilt fizz all over it a few weeks back and some keys don't work.

You couldn't pay me enough to be a secondary teacher, I have nothing but respect for them. I have a few friends from my first degree days that becae teachers and their stories put me off for life.

Oh I am sorry.

Honestly you'd be better off trying to get a job as a temp in a university in admin while you figure out your next move, just google, temporary jobs university admin. Youv'e spent many years in higher education and have a Masters and PhD, that should get you through the door working as student advisor or straight Uni admin. Its better paid than TEFL and pretty secure (more secure than academia nowadays) and just keep plugging away at applications.

You could always work 3 days a week or something and look for teaching American Lit at a campus somewhere . Believe it or not PhD's in English and Lit dept's aren't as common as you'd believe , many just have MA's and a few published books, the Uni's all want PhD's these days. There's also all the further education colleges English and Lit depts. Your experience teaching undergrads is enough again to get your foot in the door , I managed to get teaching gigs at both Uni and FE College, post PhD, based soley on teaching undergrads stints during my PhD, I have no formal teaching qualifications ( I drifted out teaching after a few years post PhD, never got a feel for it).

When I was doing my PhD's we had lots of lecturers in further and higher education were in my cohort to increase their job propects.

Don't give up, keep up the career counselling and get some personal counselling as it sounds like you've had an awful time of it. I know its a cliche but it really is darkest before the dawn.

You've achieved something that 99% of the country hasn't, reached the top of educational achievement, you're a massive over achiver.

Unless you have a calling to teach kids , don't do this, and I'm certain you'll find your path doing something you love, it will just take more time.

I became a secondary school teacher after teaching EFL for many years
I would worry that if you found that stressful you will not be able to cope in a secondary school environment
I work p/t now - 3 days a week - am in school before 07:30am until 5ish then I work at home - no time for naps!
You said you didn't gel with 13-15 year olds either.....

Hold on, you have a Masters degree and a PhD and you can only find work ESL??

Did you get a pass for your PhD? Even if you didn't finish your PhD, did you at least get a MPhil ?Why not teach at Uni, do a PostDoc, try and get a Grad trainee job, 38 isn't too old and many corporates are very open to PhD's trying out for Grad trainee jobs.
There's an accelarated program for PhD's into teaching. Most teachers in the UK don't even have a Masters degree, so you'd walk into a job, here in London they'd be fighting to death to employ you.

As someone with a PhD myself, I'd advise getting on the phone to your old Uni and asking for career counselling, mine offer support for life , most Uni's offer something. Even your local dole office would help as the WORST thing you can do is drift into teaching because you can't think of anything else to do, A TERRIBLE IDEA , DONT DO IT!!!!!!!

I have small children and work 4 days. I sit down for half an hour at lunch. Have never ever ever in 10 years had an hour and sometimes it's literally 5 minutes. Work 8-5 plus maybe another 2 more hours at some point in the week. Sometimes, like at the moment, I work an extra hour every evening. I would say I'm only an okay teacher, definitely not a great one, and I only get away with it because I'm experienced, so know what I'm doing, and keep a low profile in a school where the head has bigger priorities. Don't think I'd have passed my NQT year doing what I do now...

I’d say this is a fair example of the hours required to do the job properly. Some weeks more, some weeks less.
Every type of teaching comes with responsibilities and stresses of its own.
Your own descriptor your abilities don’t exactly fill me with confidence that you’ll make a great teacher!
Good teaching requires commitment, enthusiasm and a desire to improve your kids lives. These are the things that balance out the mind numbing bureaucracy, annoying parents, ofsted and pointless paperwork.
I don’t get the feeling that that’s how you feel about it.

Don't think I've ever had an hour's break at lunchtime as a teacher. Books to mark, afternoon lessons to set up, children to see, colleagues to liaise with, meetings, clubs to run, etc. Lucky to get 20 mins most days.
11 hour days are totally the norm. If you think about it - you teach say 5 hours per day. Each hour lesson takes at least 30 mins to plan and prepare. Then you have to make or gather the resources and adapt the learning for different abilities. After the lesson you have to mark the work in order to inform the planning for your next lesson. Now add in staff meetings, briefings, departmental meetings, parents, observations, events, assessments, reports, individual learning plans for SEND pupils, subject leadership, class assemblies, parents evenings can you see that an 11 hour day is often not long enough.
Why do you think teachers are leaving in droves and striking?

I'm in school 7.45 - 5 3x a week.
Til 4 once a week
Til 6.30 once a week.
Apart from at report time I don't do evening work in the week, but I do 2 ish days in a half term and every Sunday approx 4 hours.
That's in primary with a small class of less than 20.

I did a PGCE after doing ESL (which I enjoyed and was good at). I had cold feet but ignored it. Did my PGCE and school placements and hated it! I got good grades and feedback partly I think because my ESL experience gave me confidence in a classroom plus some ideas and activities. Both schools told me to apply for jobs there. Guess what. Neither of them employed me, one didn't even interview me. They gave the job to a 21 year old. I went for loads of interviews and got nowhere. I then tried supply which convinced me that the job was not for me at all. I ended up going back to ESL (big mistake in financial terms) and teaching in universities abroad. Teaching ESL is so much less stressful than secondary school teaching. If you find ESL stressful, just forget it. I don't know how old you are, but get out of education if you can. I wish I had.

I’m at work 10 hours most days-I get in at 7.30 and leave at 5.30. I’m not first in or last out and would say that’s pretty standard. That’s including taking a half hour lunch.

Some days I leave early but I don’t tend to arrive much later as there no space left in the car park if so! If we have Twilights, events or parents evenings, then it’s much later.

Tbh @DudeDudeson I'm not sure teaching is for you. It's a very intense job often with minimal breaks during long days -think 11 hours in school with one 15 minute break. Home around 6.30/7pm and then work a few more hours into the evening. That's the reality sadly these days. The pace and workload are relentless.

I’ve been teaching 17 years and now a head of department. If you’re having doubts, don’t do it. My PGCE was awful, so stressful, but I think with your experience you would manage and pass it. However, teaching is becoming more and more stressful every year. I’m in a good school in a nice area, behaviour is fine but I’ve still had the worst year ever. There’s a reason teachers are striking.

It depends on whether you actually would enjoy being with young people/would be able to relate to them?

My eldest was literally born to be a teacher. They have this balance of reasonable discipline/relatability with the pupils/patience with them/sense of humour/ability to see the good in everyone/gets on well with colleagues etc. They are just completing their 3rd year post-PGCE and I am not seeing any huge levels of stress or anything, any more than any other job.

They had 2 one year contracts and now a permanent full-time one. My own degree pretty much led to a teaching career, but I couldn't have dealt with the kids!!

Their work/life balance is absolutely fine.

I actually found the NQT year harder than PGCE! Responsibility for my own class was huge and I also caught every bug going. The year after that was hard as well as I lost any additional non-contact time and was given a subject to coordinate (unpaid). THEN things seemed to get easier for a few years.

That was before the Tories got into power and made everything crap though…

I found the PGCE year hellish.
Jumping to someone else's tune, teaching their way, observations every week, filling out endless lesson plans and the the uni assignments on top.
Teaching is easy compared to that.
The bit that makes me think you shouldn't is the work life balance bit. There isn't one in teaching.