11+ Will you take a selective private school waiting list place over a less selective firm offer?

That is so helpful thanks! I wondered how they did this. In my area the ones going private tend to apply to all of three selective schools. Some will get three offers by the end of the month.
I suspected they all must over offer and try and attract the best. One has wait list places too. One school has sent offers out now but the others haven't yet.

All independent schools "over-offer", that is, they might make 200 offers when they have only 100 spaces to fill. They do that because they know that they will not be the first choice of every applicant that they offer so, making 200 offers, they expect only 100 acceptances.

When they are overly optimistic about the "yield", that is, it looks like fewer than 100 offers will be accepted, they go to their waiting lists to get to 100 acceptances.

When they are overly pessimistic about the yield, that is, it looks like more than 100 offers will be accepted, they can do several things:

1. Increase the size of each form, so that 5 forms of 20 may become 5 forms of 22 or 24, provided that facilities permit.
2. Increase the number of forms to make a "bulge year", so have 5 forms of 20 become 6 forms of 20, again, provided that facilities and staffing permit.
3. Withdraw outstanding offers once the acceptances reach a hard limit of number of places when facilities and/or staffing no longer permit.

I've heard different stories about this, including that distance selling regulations only apply if you haven't seen the product, so you're on the hook if the school has a record of your attending any open days.

What's an exploding offer?

@NLondondiva I hope you're right! I shall check them out.

Re paying deposits - I think that schools now have to abide by the 14 day "cooling off" period for distance selling so check the T&C!

@Ndd135632 could you shed a little light on how you received your deposit back please? We're in a similar position to OP and I'm loathed to jettison £3.5k by accepting an offer for our second choice school should our first choice WL school suddenly become available after the deadline. Thanks.

@ChiefRoady don’t worry too much - I don’t think these schools are phased by shy 10/11yo - my DS was definitely shy . I think they are quite skilled at coaxing out of them what they need . They also want a mix of kids . It would be a nightmare if every single child was supremely self confident ! But obviously you can’t know for sure but the main thing is he is still in the mix! Good luck .

@ConfusedDotCom111 Do you think your DD would have done well at interview?

@NYE2023 thanks for responding. That’s very interesting to me as I thought the same but my DS is on one waitlist having had a general interview. It’s quite conceivable that he did not interview well as he’s quite intimidated by new adults, to the point of becoming monosyllabic!

@ChiefRoady yes I do . So for one co Ed popular school near here 1. an interview which was just a pleasant chat usually meant a straight offer unless you did something heinous in the interview 2. An interview where they asked you to, say, read a passage and discuss usually meant top half of wait list unless you smashed it and turned it into an offer 3. Having to do few written questions in a separate room before the interview because there were concerns as to whether certain skills were strong enough probably meant at best wait list but further down ( unless you smashed it to move higher up; or crashed out with a no ). But it is school dependent but the above certainly held true for our cohort but that was some time ago . But there will be someone around who has more recent experience than me.

Agree with this. Make sure the firm offer you have is not an ‘exploding offer’ tho. Oh yes that flipping nightmare they throw on us too! Accept last minute and see if wait list place comes up. Our waitlist place came up 2 days after I accepted the firm offer and I still got deposit back. Sometimes they can be kind. And I also agree with @NYE2023 and @HawaiiWake on calling. Monday afternoon is a great idea. You can always call in a lovely way checking in and saying how keen you and your DD are on the school. As someone said they want to fill places and I am sure will go first to those top of mind and likely to accept. When I got the call saying there was a place they knew already we would be delighted and were super happy to call us. And I called weekly asking for updates. In a gentle and happy way. Fingers crossed OP. Update us! Wherever she goes ultimately I am sure she will do super well.

@NYE2023 do you mean if it was a general interview vs subject focussed?

What are the schools, @ConfusedDotCom111 ? Went through all this last year, so might know
the chances of things moving or if the other school is good.

That's a great idea from @NYE2023. You'd be annoyed if you accepted the firm offer ahead of its deadline only for a WL place to then come up. And indeed a good premise for making another call.

Do you need to accept your firm just yet if it’s not yet acceptance day ? Our wait list place came through the day before acceptance day . Unless it is a school with “exploding offers “ surely you can wait until the last minute just in case the wait list comes up at the 11th hour Certainly you can use this as reason for ringing them .

Maybe call on Monday, after half term and in the afternoon? In a friendly, chatty rather than pushy parent vibe. Depending on your date when you last called and emailed them.

call me cynical but when it comes to waiting list management they will be after those that accept quickly so they don’t end up scrabbling to fill their spaces . If a candidate has made it to the waitlist then they have met standard . So perhaps the only element of “balance” is if a wait list candidate was also strong at sport / music etc . But frankly they will be doing this with a business head on - they need a full school and a cohort with the best possible potential to translate into the league tables !

it’s hard to second guess waitlists - don’t forget schools over offer places to ensure that they don’t end up with too many spaces so it isn’t “one out on in “ like it is for state . However some schools will always go to waitlist; and I know plenty who managed to help engineer that a waitlist place was theirs rather than someone else’s including myself ! I have to say I’ve known a fair few over the years successfully beg quite hard for a place so whilst I agree you don’t want to be annoying, I would very much keep in touch in a non pushy way which also conveys how much you want the place .

if you mention the school someone might be able to give some more specific advice . For example one local popular school here you could usually tell likelihood of a place coming up from waitlist depending on type of interview you had .

If you're prepared to lose the deposit on the confirmed place then you accept that and stay on the WL for the other.

If WL school doesn't rank the list, my guess would be that you won't hear until after acceptance day as they will potentially review all acceptances as pp has said to ensure balance.

Given you've already notified them that you'd accept a place, I'd possibly be tempted to speak to them once more in a few weeks, but wouldn't do more than that. They'll be very used to pushy parents and have a process to follow so I wouldn't expect contact to make a difference, but you never know!!

Minus being unscrupulous 😀

It’s not a fear. I’m rather Machiavellian in my approach to things and I take a long term view of success.

@Motherparent19 don’t let your own fears hold your son back. My DS was less academic than my DD. Went to a highly selective school and it has pushed him higher than I would have ever imagined. And he loves it! He gets a lot of pride and esteem from doing well there.