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State or _*poss* free place at private

33 replies

scarecrow22 · 16/02/2023 12:59

My DD is in y7 of what we so far think is a fantastic state school, both the teachers and pastoral care.

My DS presumed he will follow her, and I think he'd be well suited to the school.

However I know we would qualify for a 100% bursary for a very very good private school nearby. DS (y5) is vg at maths but average at English so would need a bit of help. However he is a quick learner and has a lot of knowledge of and understanding of other areas of life, from a love of bonfires and camping to a fascination with infinity, birds and problem solving. I keep trying to suppress and cast off the niggling idea that I want him to try because from the boys I k ow there the school turns out such beautifully mannered young men with a love of learning. But I can't shake it off. Partly because his character is so well suited.

Other factors to consider are that his DS might be jealous and feel we think more of him.

What do you think. Please don't be aggressive about my interest in private education. I guess I never dreamed we'd give it a thought, so I've not resolved it in my head.

Thank you.

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BungleandGeorge · 18/02/2023 10:53

your Daughter is happy and settled, it’s not unusual for children to go to different schools. I’d apply if your son wants to and see what is offered. If he’s only average at humanities I’m not sure he’ll get the full bursary (and they also look at assets such as your house and potential to increase income). Most schools would rather award multiple children part bursaries, I think he’d need to be exceptional across the board to get a full bursary

scarecrow22 · 18/02/2023 10:40

@Dodgeitornot thank you for such a measured and understanding reply.

I don't like the aggressive side of MN, but everyone here has been frank and understanding and so v helpful.

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Dodgeitornot · 16/02/2023 23:01

@scarecrow22 I definitely agree with you that siblings differ and it's perfectly acceptable to have 2 kids in two different types of schools.

However, in your situation you haven't even given your DD a chance to apply for the private. That wasn't even in the cards for her even though private schools are actually really great for the middling, less motivated children.
Whatever reason you may give yourself for that, your DD will still feel like she's second best. On top of that, you're not exactly sending him to the local flunk high. It sounds like a great state option. Why put yourself through any additional stress of annual financial checks etc.

scarecrow22 · 16/02/2023 22:50

Thank you so, so much everyone.

Based on at least two issues, I realise it is not a good course of action - for either of them. It's been very helpful.

I want to address the Freudian or sexist issues raised though: individually, siblings differ: if the boy is more talented/intelligent/keen to learn/hardworking, and the girl has other attributes, it is not sexist to put the boy forward for a different sort of education. It's just the way the penny fell. As long as, if it were the other way, you'd do the same. Ironically my parents were fairly old-fashioned about these things, but they sent me to a v academic school, which suited me perfectly.

That said, DS joins DD in 2024. He can't wait!

Thank you.

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AngelsWithSilverWings · 16/02/2023 21:03

@Clymene also I never said my daughter couldn't cope at state I just said that she coped better with smaller class sizes. She spent all of primary and the first two years of secondary at a state school.

AngelsWithSilverWings · 16/02/2023 21:01

@Clymene the OP just mentioned unfairness between siblings so I commented on my experience of that.

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 16/02/2023 19:09

Given what you've said, I wouldn't do it. The risk of having to move him from a school he's happy in later on would be too high for me.

Even without considering your daughter and the impact on her.

Clymene · 16/02/2023 18:56

AngelsWithSilverWings · 16/02/2023 18:34

I've got one at state and one at private. DS at state school knows it's the best school for him and he knows the private school that his sister is at wouldn't be be as good for him. He also knows the reasons why the private school was the best option for his sister. No resentment. He's very bright and she struggles academically and copes better with the smaller class sizes. He gets it.

Also apart from an optional ski trip we've not paid a penny more that the published school fees. ( we've paid for school ski trips for DS too so all is fair)

The private school uniform was cheaper than the state school uniform ( private blazer was £40 whereas my DS's state school blazer was £80. The private school meals work out cheaper than the state school canteen too.

It's a completely different scenario.

Your daughter rather than your son is in private
She's in private because she can't cope in mainstream
He is cleverer than she is.

In fact, you couldn't have picked more of a different situation if you tried.

AngelsWithSilverWings · 16/02/2023 18:34

I've got one at state and one at private. DS at state school knows it's the best school for him and he knows the private school that his sister is at wouldn't be be as good for him. He also knows the reasons why the private school was the best option for his sister. No resentment. He's very bright and she struggles academically and copes better with the smaller class sizes. He gets it.

Also apart from an optional ski trip we've not paid a penny more that the published school fees. ( we've paid for school ski trips for DS too so all is fair)

The private school uniform was cheaper than the state school uniform ( private blazer was £40 whereas my DS's state school blazer was £80. The private school meals work out cheaper than the state school canteen too.

Clymene · 16/02/2023 18:24

I have two friends whose parents paid for private education for their sons and not their daughters.

While I'm sure you're not prioritising your son's education over your daughter's because you're massively sexist like my friends' parents are, the end result is the same. Huge resentment and feeling that male children are more prized and worthy of investment than female children.

RobinGood · 16/02/2023 18:21

I wouldn’t pursue it for one and not the other, it seems like a recipe for future resentment.

gogohmm · 16/02/2023 18:18

Just a word of caution, the extras bill can be horrific at private schools, the bursaries can change and most demand you show your income and assets annually, it's not guaranteed for the entirety of their education.

Unfortunately very few girls schools have decent scholarships and bursaries we found, lots more options for boys so it may not be possible for your dd anyway

Aphrathestorm · 16/02/2023 17:57

Apply.

But don't get your hopes up. There could be 100+ other DCs up for that one 100% nursery.

MorningMoaner · 16/02/2023 17:53

I would urge caution. Treating siblings radically differently can be dangerous in my experience. I have relatives who have 3 children. 2 went on scholarships to very prestigous boarding schools, the other went to the local, not particularly good, comp and wasn't even put in for any entrance tests. They actually all got broadly similar exam results, went to reasonably well respected Universities and are doing ok in their careers as adults but the one who went to the local school has a terrible relationship with the parents even now, and things aren't great between the siblings either.
It's not the only reason of course, families are complex things, but you don't need to be a psychologist to be able to see that the sense of being deemed "lesser" has had a negative impact on the one who was sent to the state school.
Not that I am saying that would happen to everyone, but having observed this family was enough to put me off doing the same thing when my children reached that stage.

Dodgeitornot · 16/02/2023 17:23

A lot has changed in the last couple of years and schools don't have money to give out 100% bursaries 'easily'. If you have a great state option I think you'd be bonkers to go down this route given the fact you have another child who didn't even get a chance to try this. I'd be pretty pissed off at you if you were my mum. why do mums keep proving Freud right.

Seeline · 16/02/2023 17:22

No one here can say whether the specific private school you're interested in is better/worse than the specific state school concerned.
You say it's very, very good - what do you mean by that?
Also if it's that good presumably the entrance exams are probably pretty tough. Are you thinking about tutoring?
I agree, to get a 100% bursary, your DS would need to do extremely well in the exams/interview.

scarecrow22 · 16/02/2023 16:52

One more from me, the infinity/maths conundrums thing is a joke. No way you'd know that given you don't know me.

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scarecrow22 · 16/02/2023 16:50

For those that asked I didn't consider this for DD, partly because originally the approach to the all boys private school was a bit of a whim (which then began to become serious), and partly because DD has had other problems at school which would have made a pressurised or single sex school out of the question. And I knew she wouldn't want to do or pass the 11+. And, as I said, I only ever imagined our children would be state schooled.

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scarecrow22 · 16/02/2023 16:49

@millionsofproducts @UsernameOfMine @tryandcountsheep @Hersetta427 @LadyLapsang Re bursary/scholarship situation, I am on ESA and DH on a modest education sector salary. I spoke to the school a year or two ago and was told we "easily" qualified for a 100% bursary. I totally understand that DS would have to get in first. Maybe he'd also have to demonstrate a special skill (infinity/maths conundrums or art, would be the obvious options, but I would not expect him to demonstrate and extraordinary talent...)

My post is more about the benefits of the private school over a good state school, and weighing that against my DD's situation.

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tryandcountsheep · 16/02/2023 16:08

millionsofproducts · 16/02/2023 14:28

@tryandcountsheep I think you misunderstood my post - I was referring to scholarships being worth 5% of the full fee, not 5% bursaries!

I understood @millionsofproducts perfectly, and I agree most bursaries are small and awarded often with non-means tested scholarships ( because scholarship excellence are the exact types the school would be happy to help if household couldn't afford the fees.) My DC are all at private school, and family on both sides of DC and I know this happens a lot.

I was just saying 100% bursary qualification is usually a very low bar (income and asset wise) that most even thinking of private education are nowhere near.

That was my point.

Here in London, I know so many people on 6 figures who consider themselves 'poor' and write to bursars, because they've heard so and so got a 'top up' bursary with a scholarship and got a nice chunk off their fees. Households on 40K are on a London scale , in my mind, dis-advantaged living in the capital, but this family would still earn too much for the school's 35K bar for 100% bursary.

scarecrow22 · 16/02/2023 16:07

@UsernameOfMine @Postapocalypticcowgirl I would be entering DS for y7 - so he would do 11+ next school year.

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Postapocalypticcowgirl · 16/02/2023 14:34

As others have said, I think you need to confirm the bursary situation first? Have you been told you would qualify by the school because they are trying to recruit your son, or have you assumed based on what other parents have told you?

Just a few "what if" scenarios to think about:

  1. What if you got the bursary for Y7, but the school finances changed and it was withdrawn later on?

  2. What if your income changed and you no longer qualified later on?

  3. What if something changed which meant you had to move your son during an exam year?

Have you also looked at things like costs of uniform, transport, lunches + extras?

3peassuit · 16/02/2023 14:32

I think you might be setting your DD up for resentment if they have such an unequal education.

millionsofproducts · 16/02/2023 14:28

@tryandcountsheep I think you misunderstood my post - I was referring to scholarships being worth 5% of the full fee, not 5% bursaries!

LadyLapsang · 16/02/2023 14:27

100% bursary is pretty rare. Did you enter your daughter for a similar opportunity? I know siblings who have gone down different routes at 11, but both had the opportunity to sit the entrance exam - one didn’t get a place. How would you explain to her why she didn’t get a similar chance and how might you level the playing field for her later on?

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