Habs girls Vs nlcs

Hi! What was the HB outcome? And what did you decide and why?

We chose between NLCS and HB. Daughter was strongly against NLCS in the end and we live quite near HB, so almost zero travel time and inconvenience and significantly reduced travel safety concerns.

The most ridiculous conversation I’ve heard in so long. For so many reasons. Go with your gut, think about your child’s happiness and not a menial / small difference in grades.

Current Habs parents here, of two daughters. Both are extremely happy and are very different children with different strengths, interests and personalities .
The School is diverse but the comments about a high percentage of girls not having English as a first language, or speaking a second language at home, are extremely misplaced and inaccurate.
The school strikes a very good balance between academically stretching without pressure, and a real emphasis on extra curricular - the sports provision is fantastic, as is the music and there is an ever increasing focus on the creatives both in and off timetable.
Gus Lock, current head of the boys school will soon become the executive head of both schools and is supposed to be excellent - its an exciting time for both the boys and the girls schools.

Hello. I agree too, obviously not everyone can be great of everything, but usually the girls thrive in an area. My daughter is a great all rounder, but she has one friend in her group that finds maths much more of a challenge, yet she’s brilliant at languages and music, plays several instruments and takes three languages at GSCE. Other things to keep in mind when comparing the two, is if IB is an attractive option, Habs take 9 GCSES and NLCS 11. I don’t have any insight into the English at Habs, but the social intake is very much on a par. I go with the above, I felt like the school was a golden chance, our child has thrived at the school and as I said before, I am sure there are happy girls at Habs too.

It’s a concern that I felt before my girls started but now I would answer that 1. No one is bottom of the class, in fact it’s amazing how homogenous grades are (when they are shared - see above!). In other words, there are no outliers. More like a few peaks and then 80% of the class around the same marks. 2. Everyone is good at something. There are so many areas that the girls can excel in (and do). Whether it is debating, sciences, engineering, sports, drama, music and so on, I have not met one girl who is genuinely not really interested and good at something. I think you have to trust the process and believe that, if they made her an offer, your daughter will flourish there. I know I sound almost evangelical, I am not saying that the school is perfect, but we really are very happy.

Thanks all for your feedback. Sorry for hijacking the thread somewhat OP- but I hope it’s brought up some interesting points to help in your decision.

I suppose my other thought is the well-known: is it better to feel clever within a wider range of ability? Being at the bottom of a very high achieving year group could be a miserable place to be :-(

Hello. Yes you are completely correct. There are pieces in the year that are graded from 1-5. I was referring to a couple of friends school that keep grading children in predicted GCSE attainment. My friends daughter ( in year 10 day / boarding school) has been told she’s on track to get all 9s, then a recent end of topic test bought her chemistry attainment into special
measures and meetings and the mother complained to the school. In year 10 at NLCS GCSEs are hardly mentioned and the girls are taught to understand that 100% is not always the norm, my child has been equally delighted to get 70’s in a very tough chemistry or Latin exam and equally has often scored 100% in History, RS and Maths end of year exams.
As with @Herewegoagain78 the girls are taught to take on constructive critics and are happy the ask questions.

@FreneticVerses yes, definitely. I understand what you are saying and I think you are right in being concerned with the MH of a group of girls who, to generalise, will likely care a huge amount about the grades they receive but, to be honest, I am not sure what the right answer is.
Not every piece of work is graded, in fact probably one or two per term per subject but I do think it is useful as a measure of progress. For example, there is quite a lot of focus on good essay writing. You first attempt at writing a history essay might get a 3 with lots of comments on how to improve. A 3 is “good” and the teachers remind them strongly that “good” is good enough. Your next attempt might get a 2 with comments on how you did better and next steps would be to do more of xyz. Getting a 1 at the end (provided that you follow the methods taught) is highly satisfying. They also provide examples (at the beginning) of what a “1” essay looks like (from older girls) so that you know what to do. You could do this without grades, of course, but there is something helpful, I think, about having a tangible measure of how well you have understood what you are supposed to do. In my mind, the lack of maturity (of the students, understandably, of the parents, less so) is shown when the students wants to start with a 1 and only ever get a 1.
A NLCS 3 is still likely to be higher than the average so it should be celebrated as such.

And the same questions for parents at Habs Girls- thank you 😊

Thank you @Herewegoagain78 and @PPLs

Like the no-mentioning of names/point-scoring on newsletters etc.

I wonder if it is better to not grade work and give constructive feedback instead, if the girls are to inevitably share their results? An environment of high-achieving girls needs things like this to safe-guard against perfectionism/resultant MH issues (your comment about the girls caring very much about getting the top grade speaks to this). All the regular testing will surely bear out any gaps.

Is there a parent rep group that meets termly with leadership to voice any concerns/propose new ideas, or another kind of forum? I know this happens at the boys’ sch at Habs. Is SLT at NLCS receptive to these kinds of concerns from parents, or is it a more take it or leave it approach?

Re the demographics - I am always very wary of commenting on such matters in the fear of offending anyone and must clarify that the comment is not based on data but own experience at the school in the case of NLCS and the offer holder events x 2 in the case of Habs and knowing a high number of families in my kids school year through sports etc. Both schools have a very large South East Asian component, Habs might currently have a stronger Jewish presence (again anecdotally). They are both very ethnically diverse but I would be surprised if the % of non-English speaking girls was high. The point that @Kokeshi123 makes is valid, but does not necessarily affect Habs more than NLCS.
Habs being less diverse would not be my experience and certainly not to the point of being a decision factor between the two.

just answering some previous questions, yes the teachers know my child by name, it’s a school where community is very important and there are plenty of occasions for enjoying the school socially as parents and kids (Fantasy Fashion, the excellent plays, auctions etc).
The work is graded throughout the year, the teachers feel strongly about keeping these grades secret (though the girls inevitably share) plus exams at the end of each year.
My experience is that most of the girls do care hugely about their grades and there is definitely a sense FROM THEM that it’s the only option is a 1 (top grade) but I do not get that from the teachers at all, who I find very encouraging.
There are (compared to our previous school) no awards, mentioning of names on newsletters, behaviour point-scoring, commend system as such, though, as you can imagine, there is a lot of success at the NLCS in and out of school that could be talked about.
The girls are supportive of each other and proud to be in an environment where everyone is clever, which they are reminded of frequently and has been a huge confidence booster for my daughters.

@FreneticVerses my daughter started at NLCS in year 7, we are now in year 10, we have any amount of contact with the school that we require. For example, I had a question for my daughters chemistry teacher last month. I emailed her form teacher and her chemistry called me for a chat and answered my query. We have two parents evening a year, lots of out of school evening presentations and speakers. Unlike some
other schools, my daughters work or tests have never been graded into GCSE potential marks. We find my daughters peers to be very supportive and their resilience enables them to understand that if they don’t perform as well as they hoped in a test,it’s not the end of the world and the teachers are very approachable and happy to be emailed to talk through any concerns etc. NLCS offers both Alevels and IB. NLCS works for our child, she was quite shy when she started and she’s much more confident now. She takes part in public speaking and debating lessons and now represents the school in model UN. A school choice is a personal one and a happy and bright child will do well at either. Habs had 27 9 grades in English compared to a 100 at NLCS, it would have caused me concern as a parent as English and essay writing is one of my daughters strengths. Good luck with whatever you choose.

Last I heard, the two schools were in the process of integrating the sixth forms, but I'm not sure if they actually went ahead.
From September (?) they will have an executive head over the two schools. All A level students have to choose one A level which is joint between the two schools. At least this is my understanding, but someone will correct me if I've misunderstood. Even in my day (35+ years ago) we did general studies joint with the boys 6th form.

@BookwormButNoTime not Habs bashing at all- just a parent who is overly concerned about all that I have read on this forum and elsewhere, so looking for reassurance before we make such a monumental decision. Especially the following as mentioned by @MomFromSE

some have more of a culture for external tutoring and mental health issues so these are the things I'd try to dig into when speaking to parents and the school when making the decision

It’s this type of thing that I’m interested in finding out (esp at Habs), rather than minuscule differences in exam results. DD is resilient and just gets on with things - but I wouldn’t want her in an environment where MH/pastoral care is lacking. Any Habs Girls parents out there- would be grateful if you could speak up!

For NLCS parents on here, would you say you feel your daughters are known as individuals by their teachers (one parent has told me they felt not). How much contact do you have with the school? Given the high achieving cohort, how is work graded - are just comments given? I know CLSG (and I think SPGS) don’t give grades as they don’t want to encourage competition between the girls.

You're choosing between two excellent schools. Your daughter must be bright, and I'm sure she'd be happy at either.

As far as some of the kids are concerned, HABS boys' being right next door to the girls' school makes a big difference! Kids can socialise at lunchtimes, and they share coaches. Last I heard, the two schools were in the process of integrating the sixth forms, but I'm not sure if they actually went ahead.

@FreneticVerses Yes, sorry, I got that one wrong. I picked the data off the map not realising it was aggregated data. Seven is still pretty good though!

Congratulations @perhapsLAter

Both schools are academically selective and your bright daughter will have academic peers in either. On an individual level a child is likely to achieve the same grades at either school as the differences in grades are most likely down to differences on the cohort rather than the quality of the teaching.

OP, you might get a broader range of answers not just focused on exam results if you posted more about your child.

1. What kind of environment does she thrive in? Is she competitive, anxious, 'resilient' etc?
2. What is the pastoral care like at both schools
3. Would the IB suit her better than A-levels?
4. Are there any extracurricular activities that she's specifically interested in (like a sport/ music) that one school might support her better in?

I'd look into those points and visit the school again to see if the ethos and general atmosphere feels like a good fit. Some schools are more pressured than others and some have more of a culture for external tutoring and mental health issues so these are the things I'd try to dig into when speaking to parents and the school when making the decision.

Life is a long game so picking the school where your child will thrive holistically and become a happy secure adult is the best chance for long term success in the broadest sense of the word.

@BookwormButNoTime Just checked as we have an offer from STAHS also - it’s 7, not 17! I think the figure is quite consistent year on year. I get your thinking on how Oxbridge numbers are a useful indicator on the type of teaching at these schools. I’m surprised about the CLSG number though- I thought I felt that free-spiritedness, independent thinking there. The boys’ school does phenomenally well in this respect (42 offers this year). My DD is desperate to go to CLSG, but Habs and NLCS are far more local to us.

@Herewegoagain78 regarding demographic being similar at Habs and NLCS - really? I know both are served by a large coach network, but I had the feeling that Habs was less diverse.

CLSG is hands down more diverse given its location - I can’t help but think this is such a positive, leading to a breadth of viewpoints/thinking in the school. (Sorry OP for taking the chat off-piste with CLSG).

@Kokeshi123 really interesting post- thank you.

@TealReal Your comment is highly offensive so I have reported you. At no point did I say that. Nor did I say that they don’t speak English at home or weren’t British born or that they didn’t come from professional families.

What I did provide was an explanation as to why the Habs Eng Lang results seemed low but once again the school bashers seem out in force.

I might not have a child there but I have plenty of friends who do. Some live in multi generational households and do not speak English as a general rule at home as a result.

At no point have I said anything negative about NLCS, other than it wasn’t for us as it felt too academically driven. My point has been somewhat proven by other posters falling over themselves to try and discredit Habs as being somehow “second best” and not give the OP some sensible advice about how to choose between the two schools I.e. choose the one of best fit not get bogged down in analysing exam results. Which to add are pretty exceptional at both schools.

It makes me so sad to see parents so fixated by which are the “best” schools that they forget to look at which is the “right” school.

@PPLs St Paul’s is definitely 37 Oxbridge offers as per their website (see screenshot).

@BookwormButNoTime St Pauls Oxbridge take up was 31 not 37 and st Pauls has slightly higher GCSE and Alevel results. 20% of NLCS take Oxbridge and a higher amount take a combined LSE / Imperial/ UCL and kings. My daughter is a happy high achieving NLCS child. The original posting from the OP was a choice between three schools and someone pointed out that one of the schools attainment is lower than the others.

Yes, you are correct, the IB route takes a lot of the down the Ivy League route and many study medicine at UCL. The vast majority of girls are bi lingual at NLCS.

I don't know anything about those particular schools, but as a parent of bilingual kids, it is a fact that not speaking the school's language at home, or even speaking the school language BUT having parents who are not native speakers of the school language, can have a knockon effect on language attainment at the higher levels (which is what you are getting into at GCSE level).

It won't stop the girls being perfectly fluent speakers of English. But they may not be getting the full range and depth of idiomatic English and cultural references that you will be getting if you have an educated native English speaking parent at home. I'm thinking of a couple of friends I have from South Asian backgrounds. They come from prosperous middle class backgrounds and are well educated, but they sometimes don't "get" certain cultural references, British historical "stuff," references to rural British things, or certain idioms/turns of expression when they come up in conversation.

We are in Japan and my daughters speak both languages at home - my husband is a native speaker of Japanese. I have friends where they are their spouse are both foreigners and both speak English (or English plus another language such as Russian), while sending their kids to Japanese school. Of course the kids are fluent in Japanese. But the lack of home input can create gaps as kids get older which then lead to somewhat weaker performance in kokugo (Japanese language and literacy, as studied in the Japanese school system). It's a very good idea for parents to be aware of this and think of ways of supplementing the kids' vocabulary and cultural references in the "school language" (Japanese where I am, and English in the UK).

So it's entirely plausible that performance in the language arts may be a little bit lower in a school in the UK where many kids, even highly educated ones, speak another language at home most of the time, or are speaking English but with a parent who did not grow up in the UK. We are talking in relative terms, however, and I have no doubt that the girls in question are still doing extremely well in English by any reasonable person's standards, as well as in their other subjects. All the schools referred to in this thread will be very good schools, so personally I'd focus on where my daughter was likely to thrive and enjoy her school life.

Yes @BookwormButNoTime is totally wrong about Habs girls not speaking English at home- of course they bloody do! Where do you get your information from? Neither are they generally of Pakistani origin but of Indian origin.
They aren't fresh off the boat ! Their parents are highly paid professionals on the whole and if they speak another language at home, it makes them bilingual, not lacking in English skills.

Independent thinking is one of the reasons why I am so happy for my girls to be at NLCS. The leavers destinations (quite a few girls from NLCS go to the US and not Oxbridge thanks to the IB by the way), the GCSE stats are, of course, useful but ultimately I think you should base your choice on the feel of the school for you. It is quite different. Where did your daughter feel more at home? For us there was no question between Habs and NLCS (we had offers from both).
By the way the demographics are very similar, some of the comments above make no sense, but then again they come from a parent that doesn’t have a child at either school.