Feedback on SPGS

We haven't had eating issues at all. DD has one friend out of a wide group who has problems with this. These existed before she went to the school according to her parents (I believe them). I think body issues are widespread in teenage girls and seem to be prevalent even in very unpressured state schools where DD has many friends. DD is actually really well balanced about this and I love that she has chosen not to remove body hair etc and wants to just be herself and is comfortable with her own choices. She doesn't care about weight or looks much at all. Her friendship group are all supportive and kind. With mental health, again I see a lot of problems in all kinds of schools and don't think this is particularly tied to one school - we have seen problems in all DD's friends' schools and many are at normal comprehensives. DD is pretty anxious at times but has had good support from school.

I do think, by the way, that the only thing you have posted that I think is actually a real problem and that I have encountered too is the issue with clearly very bright children feeling like they aren't very clever or aren't doing well enough. If you are very bright and have been comfortably at the top throughout your primary schooling it can certainly be a shock to suddenly be thrust into an environment where you are no longer the best at anything. Or even if you are outstanding at one or two things, there are still things where you are quite clearly not the best or even close.

I think the school is quite good now compared to when I was there at trying to stop girls doing too much and pushing themselves too hard. But I also think that being one of the crowd when you are used to being special can be hard to come to terms with. I asked my daughter when she got her place whether she thought she could cope with that, and she surprised me by saying she would love it (I was sceptical tbh, but she does). I knew it would be like that because I went there too and spent my secondary years feeling like I might be a bit dim despite ending up going to Oxford. It is a particular difficulty for those who come from state schools, I think. But forewarned is forearmed. And because of my experience I have been at pains to keep on pointing out to my daughter that St Paul's is NOT the real world and that she knows very well from her primary school that it isn't the real spread of ability and that being bad at (in her case) Biology actually means that in a normal school you'd be in the top set and everyone would think you were really good at it. For DD being bad at Biology means she is stressing about maybe getting a 7 at GCSE. I don't care if she does and have told her so. It has been quite a struggle to get her to believe that she is good at it compared to many! So I really recognise that part and also think that there are probably many children who just can't cope with that. It is probably difficult in advance to know if that is going to be a problem for your child.

But for those children who go to a normal school or even just a less academic but still selective school and are comfortably at the top of lots of stuff and then end up at good universities where everyone is just as good as them at whatever they have chosen to study, the shock just comes later. Swings and roundabouts. For DD as I say, it has been almost entirely positive. Happy to expand on the not positive things but they don't include pastoral care, spoilt kids, poor teaching, being worn out, or anyone being judgemental.

I'm sorry your DD had a rubbish time. Hope she does better now and ends up wherever makes her happy.

Glad to hear your DD has had a positive experience, although that was not the case for ours. At one point we considered changing schools but decided against it as she was very uncertain about being the new girl at a different school and decided to try her best to manage SPGS. After that, her experience of SPGS certainly wasn’t terrible, not bad enough to justify changing school, but it wasn’t brilliant either. She is doing rather alright now in her sixth year. She has noticed a lot of girls struggle with mental health, again not necessarily to the point where they need to change school, but to a point where it is rather noticeable.

May I ask if your daughter has noticed signs of (fairly widespread) eating disorders, body issues or academic stress in her year? If not that is certainly welcome information as it contradicts my own experience.

I posted on a few SPGS threads since as soon as I clicked on one, the other two threads were recommended to me.

I was also subscribed to some of the other threads you have commented on tonight so that is why I have noticed that you seem to have searched specifically for SPGS to post your experience.

I replied because I was subscribed to this thread, having previously commented on it so it popped up on my 'Threads I'm Watching' page. I do comment on threads about schools that I have personal experience of (often SPGS since there seem to be quite a lot of misconceptions out there) from time to time in the hope that this may help other parents.

My daughter is in her fifth year at the school so I guess she is an older pupil too, and has found it an almost entirely positive experience. I don't understand why your daughter is still there if she has had such a terrible time over six full years. Did you not think of taking her out and sending her to a school that would suit her better?

I mean this in good jest - but I could ask you the same question! Why are you trawling the old boards and replying to people whose experience contradicts yours? No school has a universal experience, good or bad, but I am providing mine.

I also feel that when it comes to secondary schools, mumsnet is very good for parents of young girls entering the school to help each other out but there is not much input from parents who have sent their child there for a long period of time. My daughter is at her sixth year at the school, and I believe I maybe can provide some insight from older pupils.

Once again this is my daughter’s experience- will not reflect all, but she does indeed has struggled and tells me the general level of wellbeing there is less favourable than one would expect. If you want to ignore information that contradicts your views go ahead, but this is all for the benefit of the children!

Why are you trawling through the boards for old threads about SPGS? I'm very sorry to hear your daughter did not have a good time there but her experience is fortunately not universal.

Hi, mum of an SPGS girl here - know the school very well. It is not a healthy environment. I believe SPGS can be a good for some people and the excellent league table ranking makes it attractive, but here are some other factors to consider:

• the academic pressure is real and while it’s not directly the fault of staff, I believe it culminates from the environment being saturated so many bright children. Academics are valued here and there will naturally be students who perform more highly than your daughter in some areas. As a result, most students struggle with feeling academically inadequate and are worn out.
• pastoral care has been horrible from personal experience.
• not economically diverse and most kids are spoilt. While the school is trying to change its economic makeup, the overall culture is still dominated by people who have had an unusually rich upbringing and my daughter complains about the commonplace entitled behaviour from other students
• eating disorders are VERY commonplace. my daughter knows almost no one who has not had some kind of issue with food.
• I believe the good academic results come from the pupils they select rather than the quality of teaching. The teaching is certainly good at SPGS but certainly not a cut above other private schools in West London. A few of the teachers are actually quite poor, although to their credit they all seem to care about students and are willing to try their best to help them if they have a problem understanding something.
• don’t think the high academic standards make it a tolerant environment for shy girls who are more academically than socially oriented - it is unfortunately just as cliquey as any other school and the girls here are judgemental of one another.

Happy to elaborate if you message me.

Overall, I would advise not to undervalue the importance of the pastoral. For your daughter to thrive, she must be happy. It can be a great school for some but it is definitely not a “warm” environment.

DD is a current student. State Primary. Very Happy. Teachers excellent. I always come away from Parent Teacher nights wishing they'd been my teachers.

No uniform. Sports kit 3 days / week (at least in the lower years). Hair colour, makeup, piercings, whatever are not policed, and that generally comes from an attitude of 'you do you'. It doesn't seem to distract or detract from anything.

No exams in Yr7 (MIV). They start in Yr 8 (UIV). Plenty of homework and assignments though. DD is perfectly OK with that and just gets on with it.

Lots of clubs, societies, sports, music.

Overall, I think everyone there is good at something, whether that's academic, music, sport, art, whatever, and it reminds me (in a positive way) of the quote (or mis-quote) from Stephen Fry;

"Don't try to be clever, Fry. Everyone's clever here"

So far, it's been everything she (and I) hoped for, and nothing we didn't.

Kids seem perfectly normal and pleasant. Can't comment on the commute.

Hope that helps!

Thanks all!!
Just wondering if anyone has any insight on SW bus to SPGS. Looking at the SPGS website, it doesnt tell much apart from that there is a bus. How is it working with the Hammersmith Bridge in equation, what route does it follow after Putney, how long is the commute?

@Waitingwaitingwait My DD has been using it for years from Hampstead. One of the Finchley Road stops. She's on her last year now. There's no magic to it. You go to the bus stop that is closer to home 10 mins before the designated time (there's a timetable), you board the bus when it arrives, sit down and go to school. On the return trip you get on the bus at hometime (the bus leaves 15 mins after lessons end) and get off at your bus stop. Ms Ng sends lots of bus literature once you confirm your interest. It's first come, first served so do it promptly. There's a fee involved of course. Can't recall how much now as it's been on direct debit for years. I want to say around £500 per term? PM me for the timetable. The bus leaves Golders Green at 7:09.

Would anyone be able to give some info on their DD’s experience using the school coach to go to spgs. We are looking at the route from Golders Green but quite keen to know how it is working in practise. Thank you

Thanks @Liam436 and good to know - I was thinking more what is the OP's alternative looking like academically and pastorally

@Liam436 thanks for sharing your pov it is nice to have a view from someone that did not opt for that school at the end to understand the reason. I agree with you that commute is important and even spgs said that girls with commute of 1h or more should not even apply there.
I would rather prefer my daughter to be aware of her surrounding during that commute time rather than do homework in it not to miss her bus/tube stop etc. Plus transport can be busy at that time or they need to change tube etc.
we are lucky to be 20 min from the school so commute will not be an issue for us but when we had to decide for my older DD and whether she should attend CLsG or not that was a factor as it would have meant her going in the district line at 8 in the morning during rush hours.. not funny at all when you are an adult already.. so can’t imagine when you are a 11yo with your sport bag, violin and school bag..

@Coronateachingagain

It has worked out very well for us, for the most part.

Is the alternative you have academic enough?

@BonjourCrisette

With respect, when we visited St Paul's on an open day a few years ago, they seemed very receptive to the issues we raised and seemed to want to help where they could. This wasn't the case for all the schools we visited. It's true that we chose a different school in the end, but we considered St Paul's for a while.

I have a 6th former at SPGS and the 11+ seems like yesterday. In her last year now, with a Uni offer from Cambridge. Go for it. It's a great school and importantly your daughter will be surrounded by like-minded girls of similar ability. For those keeping an eye on Oxbridge offers (which of course is not everything) there were 47 this year out of 117 university applicants. (Not everyone applied to Oxbridge of course). Quite a few to US Ivy League too.

The teaching is patchy. Some excellent teachers, some good, some average, some bad. Girls do well despite the teaching because they are capable and motivated. They are not boffins. They are regular girls. I would say that they are treated like adult, university students from Y7. They are supported with extra lessons, lunchtime surgeries if they feel the need (although most girls do not take advantage of this).

I recommend SPGS while heartedly. PM me if you like.

Liam posts a lot about SPGS for someone who doesn't have a daughter there!

I am happy to report that for us, the train strikes haven't been an issue. DD has been late a few times when there were tube strikes with no repercussions whatsoever (only reaction has been 'poor you, hope you're OK' when she has apologised for being late). Transport fares are low for school children with a Zip card. And the only time DD lost anything on the train was on her first or second day when she left a load of sports kit on the tube in a bag. Luckily a kind adult picked it up and dropped it off when he or she got off the tube further along the line and a sensible tube worker contacted the school who rang me (lucky I bothered to sew the name labels in because it would have been quite an expensive bag to lose). We were reunited with the lost bag within a matter of hours and it taught DD a lesson about paying attention to her belongings. She's never lost anything else on the tube since then!

I would personally consider curriculum, ethos, fit for what your daughter would like, and 'feel' of the school above everything else. A commute of an hour or so is absolutely manageable. They get used to it, though they are tired at first - just like they are tired when they first go to nursery or school or whatever. Any step up takes a while to get used to. A commute is a lot to take on but if your child is a good fit for whatever school, the benefits may be worth it if your child actively wants to do it. For us, we had the choice between good local comprehensive, sought after superselective grammar and St Paul's. The ethos/feel and curriculum were what swung it for me (if I had not been so interested in arts/creative/language curriculum, the grammar would have probably been almost as good though nowhere near as good on ethos and atmosphere).

I would tend to choose to go local with a short commute. Remember the trains are increasingly unreliable these days with all the strikes and everything else, so not a good idea when punctuality is important. Also consider the time spent, transport fares, and risk of losing things on the train.

You should find out if SPGS has a school bus that goes to your neighbourhood. I've always been impressed about how well organised they are on issues like these. We considered the school for our DD but decided on a much closer school instead that has worked out very well.

Younger years mostly wear PE kit, as they get older less so. But it’s not so much what they wear, as the general approach - no one is going to tell them off for wearing make up, or having blue hair, or nail polish, or really anything much in terms of appearance. Some things (PE, science) require certain kit to be safe, and need hair tied back, but they don’t have many rules beyond that.

Similarly, there aren’t behaviour points or other reward systems, and detentions are very rare. There isn’t a house system. It’s part of the liberal approach, which isn’t everyone’s cup of tea, but which I really like.

I don't think so, to all of those questions. But who knows in future? I think the girls who are studying Mandarin have had some Zoom sessions with children in China. But mine doesn't do Mandarin so I am not sure of the details.

Thanks @BonjourCrisette I was also wondering about the relationship of SPGS and his sister school in China.
I think one site in Chengdu has opened already and another one will open soon. Do you know if the school will offer the possibility to girls to spend a year there by any chance? Are there plans to open school in other countries as well?

Lots of girls do wear PE kit. Equally, some dye their hair blue and stomp around in DMs. It's all good. It's what's inside your head that counts!