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Original poster

How to manage sports scholar demands for elite athletes

103 replies

BigSmiles34 · 10/01/2023 20:26

My DS is in year 7 of an independent school in which he is a sports scholar (partially funded). He is also an academy footballer at a good club.

The school were aware of his ongoing football activities before starting the school, although he has started a new club since attending the school.

There were no policies, specific documents given when we accepted the scholarship, although I was aware that my DS would be involved in sport- presumably football and possibly others.

There are sometimes timetable clashes with school sports and academy training and I have been trying to manage that. The expectation is generally that my DS must prioritise school games and must always attend Saturday sport.

The academy that he is attending trains 3 times a week. 1 of the days is a “day release” from school where the boys do both education and football training.

The school has refused to give permission to “day release” - either part time or full time and have not been supportive or reasonable and only seem to be interested in my son’s contribution to school games.

I feel stuck between a rock and a hard place as my DS is very concerned that he is missing out by not attending his academy programme and feels powerless.

Any advice on how to approach this would be most helpful!

OP posts:
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Bigbum987 · 16/03/2023 06:46

Football Acadamy’s have an agreement with independent schools and education authorities for time off site. It’s reported as educated off site.
They back fill education with one to one subject tuition, plus provide education enrichment activities (such as history projects, language development, cultural experiences etc, this is often in the evenings / weekends / school holidays) It’s part of the premier league EPPP.

the club will have safeguarding to ensure school and educational attendance, they will have a education department whom monitor education attainment (plotting expected grades - seeing if the player is on target), deliver education sessions in the club, negotiate tutors, liaise with the school for curriculum info, timetable info and discuss with the school time required off site for day release/ overseas tournaments etc. the club will also have pastoral care and psychologist, whom may be useful in this situation given the extra layer of stress the school are orchestrating, the player will be demonstrating resilience throughout this, a trait that is required for elite athletes.

football clubs have partner schools (where they move kids in to if they relocate) they also have to negotiate with potentially hundreds of primary and secondary schools, most premier league clubs also have a fair share of ex players off spring in the system, so they are use to negotiating with various prestigious independent schools, modern independent schools, grammar, comps right through to the special needs and PRU facilities.

Bigbum987 · 16/03/2023 05:52

the football clubs education team, pastoral care and welfare psychologist will be able to negotiate time off school. They can provide back fill tutors for missed education.
football clubs have links with partner schools to provide education to some of their Acadamy player and all of their scholor players (to offer A levels), most big clubs also have links with local uni’s too for higher education.
it’s not all or nothing the poster can rectify this situation to support DS, school & club. It seems the school haven’t been guided correctly by the club’s education department.

Bigbum987 · 16/03/2023 05:47

My son is now a professional player in Premier league football Club & plays for the national team.
I suggest you speak to the football clubs education department, the clubs pastoral & welfare officer and maybe the clubs enrichment psychologist too. They could then support negotiations with the school.
It would have been the clubs education department who negotiate the day release, time off school for tournaments etc.
a lot of clubs have “partner schools” often independent schools they use to educate their Acadamy players and to deliver the further education to the scholars at year 11&12.
my child has been in the football academy system for 12 years, he is now a professional player, it’s hard work to get the balance, he got amazing GCSE’s is doing Alevels, the club are supporting higher education & enrichment opportunities too.
its not one of the other, it’s healthy for the player / pupil to excel and be supported in both facets of their life.
It’s blinking hard work for DS and the wider family. I’m sorry you are in this situation with your school, it seem very short sighted of them to add this pressure to you instead of encouraging what could be an amazing experience. Xx

Original poster
BigSmiles34 · 24/02/2023 20:02

@Baller21 this school is a London school. Perhaps you can DM me?

OP posts:
Baller21 · 24/02/2023 16:06

BigSmiles34- I would be very interested in knowing which school this is happening at( even just the initials). We are just going through this and trying to decide if the scholarship is worth it. And like you in our initial discussions they talk about supporting academy players and being used to having them but your thread has made me worried.😳

snowtrees · 21/02/2023 15:53

@DistrictCommissioner St Bedes.
Google Man City St Bedes and you can read all about it

DistrictCommissioner · 21/02/2023 13:34

Interesting reading! I’ve noticed a friend of DC we know a hobby is less and less able to take part due to the demands of school sport (also a sport scholar).

@snowtrees as I am from Manchester & nosy, which school do Man City use? A neighbour’s son was at MGS and at the academy but he was let go in his mid teens.

Original poster
BigSmiles34 · 20/02/2023 20:17

That is true, I did say that and to be honest I really don’t mind my DS playing other sport as he does love sports. Some sports actually enhance his overall athleticism and strength which is a good thing. He’s a great contributor to their sporting teams and as a scholar of course he is expected to be. We just feel that they could be more accommodating.

OP posts:
unfortunateevents · 20/02/2023 18:43

BigSmiles34 · 20/02/2023 17:49

Very true! I also wonder if my DS was given this opportunity at a rugby academy or equivalent if their stance would be the same…

To be fair, you did say in a previous post that he was expected to play rugby, hockey and cricket as well as his football at school. So that seems to accord with their insistence that they don't want kids to specialise but rather be good all-rounders.

Dodgeitornot · 20/02/2023 18:04

@BigSmiles34 that's what I was getting at. If he was invited to play for a Wales development Rugby team, they'd probably be posting that in their newsletter.

Original poster
BigSmiles34 · 20/02/2023 17:49

Very true! I also wonder if my DS was given this opportunity at a rugby academy or equivalent if their stance would be the same…

OP posts:
Dodgeitornot · 20/02/2023 17:28

But they're happy for a child to specialise in a sport as long as it's at their school? They sound lovely.

Original poster
BigSmiles34 · 20/02/2023 17:25

I was due to update on this thread and so this message has reminded me to do so!

In response to whether the school is a smaller less prestigious school; the school is well known and desirable. It has around 1000 pupils and is in the top 25 in terms of GCSE results. It is not one of the best sporting schools, but is good, particularly at Rugby, cricket and water polo. Although they have football teams, it is not one of their major sports.

Since my last message on the thread, I have had a meeting with the school. In nutshell, they had basically said that they do not believe in sports specialism for children this age, they generally do not allow day release and have not granted this for other boys. There was one boy who has gone on to sign a professional contract with a premier league club and they allowed some kind of hybrid day once the boy had reached year 11. Others have not received this. One boy in year 10 had been trying to get day release for years but was not permitted. He was released from his academy recently. Who knows whether he simply did not make the grade or if missing the additional training hindered his development and resulted in his releasing.

The academy have said they will try to make it work until they feel that my DS is at a disadvantage over the other boys. They do invite him to train with the 13s and 14s sometimes.

Based on how they have handled previous academy players and the recent meeting, it would be accurate to say that they are not going to budge on this one. I’m not going to make any irrational decisions right now, but am making enquiries at other schools and am keeping an open mind.

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WombatChocolate · 20/02/2023 12:38

It strikes me as odd. Is it a smaller or less prestigious independent school and one without a decent number of high level sports kids?

Top sports schools have lots of professional sports coaches. Their teams perform well and yes, they use their elite students to boost performance. BUT at the same time, they understand that elite sport happens outside school and requires big time commitments and they are flexible on that. The school does benefit from having them on teams sometimes and can boast about their achievements out of school, but they know that the elite sport will come first. It’s just how it is.

Schools with the best sports reputations understand this and are flexible. It is probably those that are smaller, less prestigious and don’t have the really top level sports teams who try to cling into their sports scholars and impose daft requirements.

whattodo2019 · 14/01/2023 09:30

You. wed to choose between the school scholarship and the academy. You can't get a discount on fees and not expect your son to give the school 100% of his sporting commitment. The school should have looked at his Academy commitments before offering the scholarship too, to be fair. But you can't have both of they clash..

snowtrees · 12/01/2023 17:59

On the point of gymnastics - the elite squads have day release or similar and a lot are actually home schooled due the amount of hours they do

Tiggernpoo · 12/01/2023 16:13

OP I think you might need to do a little bit more research into the education provided by the club as I'm not sure it would compare favourably to the education provided by most schools let alone an independent school. The clubs are ensuring that the boys adhere to a basic standard required by the government in terms of the minimum number of GCSEs and passes in Math/English. My friend's son (who left his independent school to pursue football) only has 5 GCSEs and he was a former academic scholar.

CloudPop · 12/01/2023 11:56

BigSmiles34 · 12/01/2023 09:04

@WednesdaysPlaits I think you are also missing the point. This is about finding balance. It’s not me saying that my DS does not want to participate in school sports. I am saying that we were led to believe that the school supported academy boys who are sports scholars and this does not seem to be the case. If they had said frankly in the beginning that they do not entertain specialisation in sports or academy pathways then we would not have gone for the school.

This is exactly the point. Almost all sports scholars will have sporting commitments outside of school. How else does anyone ply for the County? Clearly school sport is important and your son needs to be available for school matches in priority to anything else, but they should be completely understanding and supportive of sport outside school. I assume you're talking football as you say academy, in which case the school are being disingenuous if they hadn't realised this was going to happen.

unfortunateevents · 12/01/2023 10:24

BigSmiles34 · 12/01/2023 09:07

@WednesdaysPlaits to clarify, I used the word ‘persuade’ as my son had offers from other schools which the school knew about. They did indeed persuade us to join them over the others.

They may have been keen for him to join, but the ground rules have changed since then – he was not with this particular Academy and day release was not on the cards. I can understand why they thought that the academy requirements were different to what they now transpire to be. I think both parties have been somewhat naive, the school in not having a formal contract setting out exactly what the obligations of a sports scholarship are and you in thinking that you could change the terms of his outside participation after joining the school.

Original poster
BigSmiles34 · 12/01/2023 09:07

@WednesdaysPlaits to clarify, I used the word ‘persuade’ as my son had offers from other schools which the school knew about. They did indeed persuade us to join them over the others.

OP posts:
Original poster
BigSmiles34 · 12/01/2023 09:04

@WednesdaysPlaits I think you are also missing the point. This is about finding balance. It’s not me saying that my DS does not want to participate in school sports. I am saying that we were led to believe that the school supported academy boys who are sports scholars and this does not seem to be the case. If they had said frankly in the beginning that they do not entertain specialisation in sports or academy pathways then we would not have gone for the school.

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Original poster
BigSmiles34 · 12/01/2023 07:58

@Ericaequites you are right in that we will ultimately have to find another school who is more supportive if this meeting does not go in our favour. The school actually said that they were very impressed with the academy’s education set up and that they have not come across one like this before. As mentioned, their education is one of the best offered in the country. I honestly do not believe it is about my DS falling behind in school either. We will see…

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WednesdaysPlaits · 12/01/2023 07:56

You may have missed the point here. This is not about choosing between education and football. It is about a good school supporting a talented child and who persuaded him to join the school because of such talents.

No I think you have this backwards. In applying for the sports scholarship you persuaded them to give him a discount because of his talents and how they would benefit the school.

IkaBaar · 12/01/2023 07:50

If the school are like this now, what will they be like in exam years? I’ve heard of schools no longer allowing regular day/afternoon release in exam years. I wonder if the school were used to dealing with elite kids in other sports where the clubs can be more flexible.