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AI chatbot doing kids' homework for them - undetectable

237 replies

noblegiraffe · 31/12/2022 01:27

The robot apocalypse is upon us - an AI can now produce essays that cannot be picked up by plagiarism software. The Telegraph is breathlessly reporting that teachers are begging the government to solve the problem.

I've been playing around with the AI, and it is, indeed, impressive. It can produce perfectly reasonable essays in response to exam questions, in whatever style that you request; and not just essays, it can answer maths and science questions (and indeed any subject) with step by step explanations

Should teachers be worried? Probably. My DS reports that he has already heard of kids using it to do their homework.

How can we combat this?

Well, for English and humanities teachers, I would advise that you make an account and chat with the AI yourself. Feed it questions, see what it comes up with. It does come up with different answers each time you ask, but with strong similarities. If you feed your essay question in enough times, in enough ways, you should be able to spot AI generated answers.

The other solution is to only bother marking work that the students have produced in class, in test conditions - this is a policy I've had as a maths teacher for years. As a correct answer is a correct answer, who knows if it was produced by the pupil, their tutor, their parents, or the kid they hang out with at break time?

Parents: Try to encourage your kids not to cheat as in the end the AI can't sit their exams for them.

The software won't be free forever. But who knows what is coming next?

chat.openai.com/chat

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Ridelikethewindypops · 01/01/2023 07:53

I'm amazed it's free tbh. Is that just temporary whilst they are ironing out glitches/ polishing the product?
Also I think the potential for blackmail should put people off?

itsgettingweird · 01/01/2023 07:40

Although Ai website also has its uses.

One of the students put "help - my mum beats me" in the AI software when they were doing a lesson on it and they got a call from the police (you have tonight a phone job in).

Not funny but they found it really funny he's got caught being a twat!

The exercise in class that day was something g like trying to confuse the AI.

itsgettingweird · 01/01/2023 07:34

My ds is a computer science student.

He's known about this for ages!

I agree it's a problem. I'm lucky he's too honest to actually use his knowledge and cheat!

Piggywaspushed · 01/01/2023 07:18

EduTwitter hugely excited this morning about ChatGPT's ability to write lesson plans. Good. Maybe this will put a stop to the awful industry of selling lesson plans and the annoying people on SM who ask for other people's schemes of work!

Piggywaspushed · 01/01/2023 07:17

Yes, I do know that : don't worry wasn't having a pop! It's just the results I got did read more like an American High School grade paper than the specifics of an English GCSE. There are differences and not sure the AI knows this.

Ericaequites · 01/01/2023 03:35

@Piggywaspushed Good American schools expect quotes and analysis. In university, I was offered decent money to write essays for others. I didn’t do it because I am honorable, and I couldn’t write a paper bad enough that the student wouldn’t be caught.

Magpiecomplex · 31/12/2022 22:31

BTECs are mostly or exclusively coursework depending on the level, and while I could tell if something obviously doesn't match the student's vocabulary, this sounds more sneaky. I shall have to investigate! As a PP said, I might use it in class to generate "exemplar" answers and then we'll pull it apart and rebuild.

RSintes · 31/12/2022 21:18

@noblegiraffe Students have to write analytical essays in target language on a set film and novel in French/German/Spanish, a bit like the kind of essays they do for English Lit. We usually end up doing the same titles that real actual Abitur or Bacclauréat students do in Germany or France which is quite cool.

RSintes · 31/12/2022 21:15

Yep @noblegiraffe it's works just as well in other languages too. I've been fiddling around with a French and German these holidays to see what it can cope with and it's admirably (and frustratingly) good. It also make pretty good worksheets for a range of tasks in various languages. I even tested it by asking it to produce a worksheet for KS3 English native speakers learning how to tell the time in Mandarin (notoriously tricky) and it's really quite good, both in term of the language plus the pedagogical scaffolding etc of the worksheet. So I've decided to embrace it as a learning tool rather than try to resist it. At least at KS5 I can force switch it off in lesson with timed exam conditions and take the line with my students of "well that's lovely dear but can YOU do that in the exam"

Reugny · 31/12/2022 20:52

FluffyYucca · 31/12/2022 16:35

It won’t write me a Mumsnet post - it doesn’t do posts for individual forums apparently

It will do starting thread posts for forums including MN.

noblegiraffe · 31/12/2022 20:02

Presumably it can write an essay in, say, German as fluently as it can write one in English.

What sort of essay questions do they have to answer?

In maths kids can use Wolfram Alpha to give step by step answers to questions, and my niece was telling me her classmates all use some app where you take a photo of a maths question and it gives you the answer.

OP posts:
RSintes · 31/12/2022 19:41

I'm going to be using this in class with my sixth formers next week to get it to write sample essays on particular questions and then we pull them apart and see if they're any good and then adapt to make them our own.

As an A-Level MFL teacher and given the preponderance of Google, Deepl and Linguee, I gave up some time ago setting essays for and instead essays get written in class, closed book and under timed conditions. It truly remarkable how different these can be to whatever guff is produced for 'homework' these days.

But it's useful to let the students know that you know these things exist, as then they're less likely to pull a fast one on you.

JaffavsCookie · 31/12/2022 18:04

Thanks Noble
Was discussing this with my youngest uni aged dc over the holidays. We were all amazed at how good it was to be honest, granted we are all scientists and the like rather than arts/humanities based but it wrote me a very good A level biology essay, and summarised my PhD ( years old on a rare genetic disorder and DNA sequencing) more eruditely than I could have done.
one a side note I really like the idea of only marking work done in class, i get so fed up of marking past paper Qs for my sixth formers where they have clearly googled the answers. Wondering if i can sneak that in past our marking policy.

DorotheaDiamond · 31/12/2022 18:01

FluffyHamster · 31/12/2022 17:46

I would try to get feedback before explaining where it's come from. All the people in education I've spoken to are very defensive, and are adamant that they would recognise AI generated content.
I'm not so sure...

Problem is the only way to do that would be to have dd submit it as her own work which she categorically won’t do!

FluffyHamster · 31/12/2022 17:46

DorotheaDiamond · 31/12/2022 17:43

DD has one more piece of coursework for her English iGCSE…done at home, submitted to teacher, verbal feedback then a week to polish….

I will be putting her title into the AI and then getting the AI to polish it - then I’m going to send it to the HoD and ask them what they think!!! I will explain what it is obviously!!!

I would try to get feedback before explaining where it's come from. All the people in education I've spoken to are very defensive, and are adamant that they would recognise AI generated content.
I'm not so sure...

DorotheaDiamond · 31/12/2022 17:43

DD has one more piece of coursework for her English iGCSE…done at home, submitted to teacher, verbal feedback then a week to polish….

I will be putting her title into the AI and then getting the AI to polish it - then I’m going to send it to the HoD and ask them what they think!!! I will explain what it is obviously!!!

titchy · 31/12/2022 17:36

Intersex on the very first line Angry

titchy · 31/12/2022 17:35

TeenDivided · 31/12/2022 16:52

Titchy. Can you try asking for 250/500 words arguing in favour of sex based rights over gender based ones? I'm wondering if it can argue against its own point of view ...

It is important to recognize that sex and gender are two distinct concepts. Sex refers to the biological characteristics that define males, females, and intersex individuals, while gender refers to the social and cultural norms, roles, and expectations associated with being male or female. While sex is a fixed characteristic, gender can be more fluid and is often culturally and socially constructed.
There are several arguments in favor of sex-based rights over gender-based rights.
First, sex is a biological fact that is inherent and cannot be changed, while gender is a social construct that is subject to change and varies widely across cultures and time periods. This means that sex-based rights are more objective and grounded in reality, whereas gender-based rights are more subjective and dependent on cultural norms.
Second, sex-based rights are necessary to address the unique needs and challenges faced by individuals based on their biological sex. For example, women have different healthcare needs than men, such as the need for mammograms and pap smears, and may also face different types of discrimination and violence. Similarly, intersex individuals may have specific healthcare needs and may also face discrimination and stigma. Recognizing and addressing these needs through sex-based rights ensures that individuals have access to the resources and protections they need to thrive.
Third, gender-based rights can often be used to reinforce harmful stereotypes and reinforce oppressive systems. For example, the idea that women should be responsible for caregiving and men should be breadwinners is a gender stereotype that can be used to justify discrimination against women in the workforce and to restrict their opportunities. Similarly, the idea that men should be tough and emotionless reinforces harmful stereotypes about masculinity and can contribute to the stigmatization of mental health issues among men.
Fourth, sex-based rights can be more inclusive and less divisive than gender-based rights. While gender-based rights often focus on the rights of specific groups, such as women or LGBTQ+ individuals, sex-based rights can provide protections and resources for all individuals, regardless of their gender identity or expression. This can help to reduce tension and conflict between different groups and create a more cohesive and united society.
Overall, while both sex-based and gender-based rights are important, sex-based rights offer a more objective, inclusive, and practical approach to addressing the needs and challenges faced by individuals. By recognizing and addressing the unique needs and challenges faced by individuals based on their biological sex, we can create a more just and equitable society for all.

Piggywaspushed · 31/12/2022 17:31

noblegiraffe · 31/12/2022 17:11

I love “too factual” as a criticism Grin

Too factual, whilst at the same time making factual errors!!

Reugny · 31/12/2022 17:12

noblegiraffe · 31/12/2022 15:55

I asked it to write me 500 words on why teachers deserve a pay rise.

Coming to a thread near you soon Wink

Copy paste...

Nah can't be bothered.

Won't overcome that.

noblegiraffe · 31/12/2022 17:11

I love “too factual” as a criticism Grin

OP posts:
Piggywaspushed · 31/12/2022 17:09

Yes, but as I think I proved, it's crap specifically with those subjects. Its responses are too factual.

noblegiraffe · 31/12/2022 17:08

Are there any subjects where elements of coursework are completed at home anymore?

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filka · 31/12/2022 17:07

I guess it would be worrying (if undetected) on a course where the coursework makes up a significant part of the final grade. But if there is a final exam then people who have turned in AI-based course-work are just going to get the grade that reflects the work they have actually done, knowledge and understanding they have built, and their ability to write that down on paper in the allotted time.

Not written by AI.

TeenDivided · 31/12/2022 16:52

Titchy. Can you try asking for 250/500 words arguing in favour of sex based rights over gender based ones? I'm wondering if it can argue against its own point of view ...