SW London Girls' Private & Grammar - applying for year 7 in 2023

Yes we do have atom now. Is the best guide the mock tests?

@secondaryquandries Have you done any Atom? I would do their free 5-day trial just to whip through some baseline assessments and mock tests and get some scores for him. They'll give you some insight into where he's at academically for both grammar and private.

Thank you. He did get though stage one of Sutton grammar, so at least that was good but it has knocked the confidence a bit!

The levels to pass through these grammar school are so much higher than the levels they work at at school. There, he is getting full marks in practice sats assessments, but still not even through tiffin 1. It means so much has be be done out of school.

@secondaryquandries Really sorry to hear this. It's tough, especially when it's the first one. There were some good comments on last year's thread about this (re Tiffin girls) and the general advice was that of course they still have a shot at top private schools (Tiffins is only one test on one day, after all) but that it's advisable to add another back-up school (or two) to the list at that stage, just to give him some cushioning (and yourself some peace of mind).

My ds has had a rejection from tiffin boys after stage one now. I'm interested to know, from those who have gone through it before, can/do children rejected after stage 1 of tiffin get offers from top private schools? I do know a couple of boys who did and got into Hampton, but is this common or an anomaly? 🙏

@1forward2back Really glad your DD is happy. That's all any of us want, at the end of the day. We turned down a few through schools at 4+ as we felt that children change so much in that time that we wanted the flexibility (and 11+ support from a prep) to find wherever might be a good fit at 11. I still think that was the right choice for DD, but ask me again in a year's time when she's actually sitting the exams! (She's in Year 5 too).

3 times in four years @LondonMum20222 !!! I avoided it with Ds though as moved him into an all through for y5!
That would be my biggest piece of advice if I was speaking to y4/5 people. The not having to do 11+ has been amazing.
DD is really happy :-)

@1forward2back I remember reading your posts on one of these threads a few years back. Where did your older DD go and are they happy there? I can't believe you have to go through it all again so soon!

@QuiteAJourney - even more grateful that you are sharing the journey with us! Interesting that you think the boys are easier in SW London, though I have to say that I found the choice quite daunting..

@Firenze12 , good luck to your DD too. Which one is the your first? In an ideal world, we would not have started so early or with KGS.. but counting our blessings that, so far, we have had no timetable clashes.

@QuiteAJourney she’s y5. Also have a son, but that was easy! Girls are so much harder in Sw london!

Yes @QuiteAJourney I agree it will be such a relief for to all be over. Feel like this has been building up for a while.
Great to have others in the same situation. Good luck to your dd!

@1forward2back , I did not realise that you were going through it again this year. DD too? Thanks for joining the thread and providing your perspective having done it last year.

@Firenze12 , I fluctuate, tbh. DH is more level-headed than me. But I so know what you mean.. we have had one interview already, have an interview and creative writing assessment in 2 weeks (Woldingham) and start exams in 20 days (KGS on a Friday and then Sutton High on a Monday)... all so real! But glad in a way that we are getting closer to it and that we will be mostly done by Christmas as I think it is the waiting for things to kick in that makes it worse (at least for me).

Anyone else already feeling overwhelmed?! We are a month away from our first exam now and I'm just not sure dd is ready. I know rationally that they will all end up in the right place but it just seems so hard for ten years old to cope with and the level seems so high!

Totally @QuiteAJourney my daughter’s year there were many families who did that, especially those waiting on grammars. I was shocked too, but one family paid three deposits and gave themselves time to see the gcse results as they were the first proper year since covid! I think that’s a massive waste and very unfair on families who are waiting on the places at the other schools. When DD got into Sutton, her best friend only got waitlist and was waiting for a place but didn’t end up getting one as they didn’t go to the waitlist in the end, and DD said at least two girls didn’t show up on day 1! I always think about those places going to her best mate, but they’re both happy in their schools in the end. Some parents will always play a game with admissions. This time around we’ve decided we won’t wait and will deposit early if DD gets the place she wants.

@SpringCalling I was just talking with a friend the other day about that who had a similar experience. Apparently of a combination of families moving (there are always going to be some cases) but also the fact that schools are finding increasingly difficult to forecast acceptances so they opt sometimes after negative experiences over-offering) to be more moderate in their offers and 'undershoot' and also some families edging their bets by paying deposits at more than one school. I was quite surprised about the latter, but my friend knew a couple of people in her primary indie that had been quite open about having done that.

one thing I was surprised by having gone through this last year was the last minute offers. I know of a few people who had already bought uniform etc and then were offered a waiting list place just before September term started / just after it had started in another case! In one case they were offered and accepted Tiffin Girls the day after Tiffin term started. Not that I'm suggesting anyone holds out for this!

From the experience of our (very) small co-ed indie, the ratio of offers to children is around 2.5-3 and even some of the most competitive schools see quite a few rejections... looking at the last years, for instance, around half or more of the offers from WHS and PHS were not taken (or Kings Dulwich, on the boys' side). Yes, it may be the same girls getting quite a few offers.. but the schools still need to factor that when offering.

If anyone wants to do a comprehensive analysis, then I would suggest using the "feeder" lists at the bottom of this weblink. From there, you can look up each prep school and review their leavers' destination pages for acceptances/offers ratios. For some upper schools, you can reconstruct more than half the class.

www.londonpreprep.com/rankings/

@secondaryquandries EXACTLY! You can't second guess (much less control) the outcome, so you just have to be sensible about the spread of schools DC is applying to and help keep them calm through the process.

They should definitely share the offers around a bit!
But seriously, I guess there's not too much point thinking it over and over. What will be will be. Just need to make sure to apply to a relatively 'safe' school somewhere in the mix!

@secondaryquandries That is indeed the case re some children getting multiple offers and others getting none (or just one), which is why those lists from the prep schools aren't entirely clear-cut!
Pretty much all the prep schools publish their leavers' destinations (though some more transparent than others eg Bute House stopped doing them annually when fewer girls got SPGS offers and started aggregating over a four-year period) so the info is all out there for people who want it. But yes, of the girls I know in older years, there will be a handful of girls who get offers at every school they apply to, which skews the figures somewhat.

These offers/acceptance lists are reassuring. Though I guess 1 child may get 5 offers and another none!
Here is another one from a Wimbledon prep

www.thestudyprep.co.uk/admissions/leavers-destinations/

It's true that all the schools over-offer, but those three prep schools that @bjmin posted (plus Bute) are the exception rather than the rule - not all prep / primary schools are going to be delivering those kinds of results. I would be genuinely astonished if the offer : acceptance ratio was as high as 3:1 although that's clearly the reason that some senior schools ask you to name the other schools you're applying to - they want to be able to gauge likely acceptances.
Re waiting lists: if you read the last couple of years' threads on this, the wait lists for the popular schools (not just SPGS / G&L / CLSG but also PHS / WHS / LEH etc) barely moved at all, which suggests the registrars are getting pretty savvy at figuring out their offer:acceptance ration.
What we've been told is to apply to 4-5 schools which you and DD really like - and would be happy to go to - make sure it's a realistic spread of aspirational, target and back-up schools (with a very confident back-up) and you'll be fine. From the previous years' threads, it's clear that it's very very rare for a child to end up with no offers (or no offers that the family are happy with).

The whole realisation of offers being a multiple of places makes things so much easier. Also, quite a few schools operate waiting lists and they tend to move into them, usually quite quickly after early/ mid March (when they get a clearer idea of where they are with acceptances and especially after grammar schools start moving into reserve list too (domino effect like)

I am so grateful to see this- I was having a complete panic yesterday when I realised it was the norm to put in for 5 or so! It's normal where we currently live to be able to pick and choose if your DC are reasonably bright but the SW London set up seems scary! I can really see the benefit of the ISEB for that reason as so many are adopting it but it does put a great deal of stress on the performance of one day. I myself went to a GDST school, I only did the one exam
and I can't remember being super stressed about it even though we found out later there were only 30 or so places but 250 sitting it. I'm going to try and ensure DD feels equally relaxed.