Attainment grade 8 & 9 what do they actually mean in year 7?

It is total nonsense to assess using a GCSE grade system in Year 7 when they haven't even started the course and are nowhere near having the skills or knowledge to do so. It kills any joy in learning at this early stage. Let pupils enjoy knowledge for knowledge sake without trying to equate this learning spuriously to a GCSE outcome. This whole flightpath business (based on SATS or Year 7 makes me so cross (speaking as a teacher where fortunately my school sees sense on this issue).

It is the downside of a very selective school - they can be doing really really well, but it doesn't feel so amazing because it is average for the cohort. We talked to our DS a lot about this when started secondary school, and I do find myself reminding him. At his school, for example, 2/3 get a 9 for Maths, Chemistry and Physics.

It's a difficult balance between wanting them to put effort in and not coast, but also sending a really clear message that their worth is not measured by grades. Our school is actually very good at this, but the boys themselves... not so much.

I would just take this opportunity to remind him that if there is talk of 'average', it is in the context of already high-achieving children - and that he's doing brilliantly.

I had an argument with DD's school over something like this. DD got a bunch of "working below expectations" in her Year 8 report. She was absolutely distraught, particularly in 1 subject we're she'd actually got 100% in every piece of work bar one where she'd dropped 2 marks. The school's response was that she was expected to get 8s and 9s at GCSE and the teachers were not prepared (in Year 8) to say she was on track for that. I pointed out that I totally agreed with the teachers' point, but it was a nonsense to be telling a high achieving student that they were working below expectations which did absolutely nothing for their self esteem/self worth. The school ignored me, and after that I told my DC that the grading system was for solely for the school and they should not consider it as relevant for them.

I think my post has added confusion to the thread, I apologise. I was just trying to show that different schools use different methods of showing attainment and that they are very school specific.

My DDs key stage 3, 27 point system isn't a prediction of her GCSE scores just showing how she is doing in KS3, but using a similar 1-9 grading system as KS4. All of her grades are in the 7-9 range so obviously she should do well in KS4 if she keeps working hard.

At the school I work at roughly 15/180 students will get 7-9s in their GCSEs. Our school is in one of the most disadvantaged areas in the country with incredibly low literacy levels and high Send numbers, so our school average is close to grades 4/5 but that is a significant achievement for many of our students. If your DC goes to an academically selective school then the average is likely to be much higher as they have chosen the most able students but that is not a reflection of national results.

@MassiveSalad22 For higher tier maths you only need to get around 20% (might have gone up a bit) to pass.

Because the government in their wisdom decided to have 6 passing grades and 3 not passing ones, they need to be able to distinguish 8s and 9s from 7s (although really who cares, it's just bragging rights really).

Anyway, many schools don't bother with percentages and most aren't daft enough to attempt a 27 point scale.

Oh dear god. 2% difference between say 4+ (46%) and 4- (44%) then, which would change the outlook from a confident pass (hey, well done, you could potentially get a 5!) to a shaky one (need to push yourself to be sure of passing!). And that 2% could be, depending on the length of the paper (probably quite short in KS3), only 1 mark!

Wow, how on Earth is less than half marks a pass?? I need to wrap my head around this system before DS starts secondary. ABC was so much easier! (D or less was a fail right? I have at least one U so I’m no perfect student 😄).

You need to try to find out whether the grades mean “if sat GCSE now we predict grade X” or “if sat GCSE now in the topics covered so far only we predict grade X” or “based on what we’ve seen so far and assuming they keep putting in similar effort we expect grade X” or “based on their Y6 SATs results, we expect grade X”. Across two schools and years from 7 to 11, we’ve had all these meanings at different times and not always with explanations until we’ve asked.

DD is year 10 and has always had expected grades of 9s.

She may indeed do well, but in her eyes she fails because she can never exceed expectations!

Some of these systems make my DD's old school look positively genius. They just did vague grades such as 2-3, 4-5, 6, 7+. As in: 2-3 unlikey to pass, 4-5 likely to just pass, 6 solid pass, 7+ should do well.

What I think is criminal is 'predicting' 8s or worse 9s in y7. Talk about setting children up to fail.

English where you only need 85%ish for a 9 and that would vary depending on the difficulty of the paper. I hope it comes with severe health warnings (like 'hey, this is bobbins)

See also: grades don't exist until the work of half a million candidates at the end of a two year GCSE has been marked and grade boundaries set.

OP, giving GCSE grades in Y7 is nonsense, and if teachers are saying that grade 7s and 8s are average when in fact at GCSE they would be A/A* top grades, then either their grading is shite, or their expectations are mad.

Oh dear god. 2% difference between say 4+ (46%) and 4- (44%) then, which would change the outlook from a confident pass (hey, well done, you could potentially get a 5!) to a shaky one (need to push yourself to be sure of passing!). And that 2% could be, depending on the length of the paper (probably quite short in KS3), only 1 mark!

Aside from that, it doesn't even match GCSE grade boundaries for e.g. English where you only need 85%ish for a 9 and that would vary depending on the difficulty of the paper. I hope it comes with severe health warnings (like 'hey, this is bobbins!).

DC's school use a 27 point systems in KS4. not linked to percentages though. I think it's to give the students an idea as to whether they are at the top,middle or bottom end of the grade. Which is meaningless as deciding where the grade are is variable anyway.

In KS3 if you were a top student you would generally get "working below expectations", as the expectations were so high that you could only meet them if you never dropped a mark on anything. So basically I think KS3 gradings should be largely ignored :) Focus on effort - if your child is applying themselves to the top of their ability there is not much more they can do.

9+?!
What on earth is that?!

@spagbob it was a reference to how my DDs school grades for year 7: 9+, 9, 9-, 8+, 8, 8-, 7+, 7, 7-, 6+, 6, 6-, 5+, 5, 5-, 4+, 4, 4-, 3+, 3, 3-, 2+, 2, 2-, 1+, 1, 1- There are 27 possible grades.

So if you score 96% you get a 9+, 50% a 5, 32% a 3- etc

This is school specific and probably does not apply to your school.

So, 8 is average then?

Absolutely not.

@teendivided yep it appears so, we weren't given a whole lot of information but it tallys with the percentage grades DD reports achieving. I hope it's generated automatically for the teachers sake. Easy for a maths or science test perhaps but not so easy for history etc.

An 7/8 may well be 'average' in a selective school where they would probably be expected to get pretty much straight 7-9 grades at GCSEs. In a 'normal' school grade 4-6 would be 'average'.

@Single - so they have invented a 27 point scoring system?! Talk about implying ability to be accurate when they can't possibly be. Can't wait to see what @noblegiraffe has to say about that

At DDs school they are linked to percentages so the grades roughly work out as:

96% or more = 9+
95%. = 9
94 - 90% = 9-
86% or more = 8+
85%. = 8
84 - 80% = 8-
And so on.

Other schools may not use the 1-9 scoring system at all, some use Emerging, developing, secure and mastery for academic ability and 1 to 4 scale for effort other schools use completely different methods.

I examine. As I mark, I don't know whether what I'm marking is a 9 or an 8. Those grades are only determined by the performance of the cohort.
You're not ignorant: there is no "9" at GCSE until the papers are marked. So there is definitely no "9" in year 7.

Why was your DS frustrated? He is holding his own (ie average) in a selective school.

However, if he wants to be top of his selective school he'll have to put more work in I guess!