Why on earth would anyone reject SPGS??

The days when you were more likely to get into Oxbridge based on the fact you went to a certain school are loooong gone. No school will “get you into Cambridge.” There is no inside tricks or advice SPGS (or G&L) can give you that is not freely available in the uni websites or online. From any of these schools, the student will be seen as ‘privileged’ and their string of top grades will be regarded as less impressive than somebody from a non-selective school. My son got into Cambridge from LU and he would say it was the things he did over and above the curriculum and had nothing to do with the school which interested the interviewers and what got him in. They contextualise everything. From a state school, three A* will be proof you are an outlier. From SPGS of a school like it, be prepared to do a LOT more - essay competitions; write a book; get something published; you name it - but you will need to be prepared to do significantly more to be competitive.

I was at university with a lot of ex SPGS girls. Not a single one of them had good mental health. Just saying.

I don't think it's helpful for parents to obsess about this stuff too much. You might not think that you're putting pressure on your dc, but they will almost certainly feel the weight of your expectations, and not in a good way.

^“Are you flat Earther who only believes what you see for Gods sake...? Or those ignorant dangerous knuckle draggers have never got Covid so concluded it doesn't exist?? “^

@newsibling123 I wasn’t name dropping my university (and as you have incorrectly interpreted what I wrote incorrectly I should clarify I am a Cambridge graduate but got my PhD from a Russell Group University), but merely providing evidence as to how I am neither of the types of person you accused me of being.

^”for many non-white students , students on bursaries from working class backgrounds, SPGS can be life changing as they are in the best position to receive an education that is recognised as first class. They need that extra reputational sheen coming from a disadvantaged background.”^

This comment leaves me slightly horrified too. Hard working students from poorer backgrounds NEED extra reputational sheen????? No. They need to be given the same opportunities to succeed in their academic life as every single other child, state or privately educated . Only those children with motivated parents are going to even think about the possibility of a bursary application. You are seriously disillusioned if you think that the bursary schemes offered by independent schools are helping the most disadvantaged. Those children who not only go to school but are also carers for younger siblings whilst the adults in their life are out working several jobs to just keep a roof over their heads. They don’t need bursaries at private schools, a long commute to get there and “sheen”. They need proper after school provisions for their siblings where they can receive a decent meal and free up time to study and have access to an actual desk and quiet place to work. Oh, and access to WiFi and a device to access it - something most of us take for granted.

I am moving away from this topic as you are totally out of touch with any kind of reality of the world of education or the issues faced by many many academically brilliant children.

Gosh what great advertising this thread is for the schools concerned.

By the way, I know for a fact there are loads of DC at Latymer Upper who were accepted at SPGS but obviously didn’t go for their own various reasons.

OP - can I explain it to tog like this -

• You do not get into university or get a job based on the % of A* or whatever in your school. Don’t worry about that. You get in based on YOUR results.

• Yes, SPGS gets a higher % into Oxbridge each year. But, all things being equal, those same girls would no doubt have got in from G&L (or for that matter, a whole range of other schools). SPGS does not have a magic powder they sprinkle over students to get them into Oxbridge.

• As universities are increasingly keen to boost their widening participation stats year on year, there is an argument that applying from a more prolific independent school such as SPGS, Eton etc is actually becoming a disadvantage (eg. admissions tutors rolling their eyes thinking, “not another one” etc). This will be true for most selective independents obviously, but some schools are particularly “known” and their elitist reputation is starting to work against them.

• Do you actually think there still be a tangible difference in teaching between a school that gets 97% A-A and one that gets 98.5%? It’s like splitting hairs at that level! Even if it was 80% A-A on a school, as long as your child’s results are within that 80%, then what’s the issue? The average school in the U.K. gets about 18% A*-A! All this fuss over a few percentage points between two schools. In the scheme of education across the nation, the difference is utterly meaningless.

• At SPGS there is no IB. G&L attracts a lot of Euro families who prefer IB because it’s more familiar to them.

• Of course, many families already have children at particular schools and that’s why another of their children may go there. It makes life easier.

Well that went downhill quickly

Still there’s nothing quite like a bun fight about blowing £30k a year on elite schooling.

With a sub-topic of 'London day schools'.

So many threads in 'Secondary Education' are about these, although they are a very niche area of interest.

I had an offer from Cambridge but chose to put Nottingham as my first choice. I only applied in the first place to please other people.

The open days (with overnight stays) we went to as I guess some sort of widening participation thing cemented the desire not to attend even if I was ambivalent before.

I think it is interesting to just look at the facts rather than opinions and secondhand personal experiences. SPGS has an acceptance rate of +95% on the offers that it makes. By way of comparison, Harvard's is 85% and Stanford is 80%. So, the fact is that 5% or less of SPGS offers are actually turned down. I'm not saying that's good or bad, it's just fact of what happens each year.

Should have said I’m also an Oxbridge grad with dds in private school

I think there are two things to be explored here. Firstly, it should be pretty obvious that a parent wanting an academic single sex day school for their daughter might apply for St P along with G&L, City, NLC, JAGS etc. Once they’ve done that, they begin the process of assessing the schools in more depth, as the schools assess their daughter. They’ll also see how their daughter reacts to the school.

As part of this process it’s easy to see endless points at which another school would be a better fit - particular subject teachers, teaching style, available subject combinations, cohort, ex-curricular stuff, atmosphere, whole-person building activities, sports, their daughter’s feelings, where her friends are going, where siblings are going, commute times etc etc

But secondly, it is a bit odd that you, as a presumably well-educated person in mid-life, need to ask this. Intellectually you must surely know education is a multilayered experience and thus it takes parents a while to choose, and that there are a multitude of factors within deciding on a school.. but emotionally this seems not to have landed with you.

This suggests to me that for you success maybe solely externally measured. Your thinking is very linear for someone of an age to understand that life isn’t simple. For your benefit and your children’s it may be worth you exploring what’s going on for you here.

I think where you are going wrong with this post is the all things are equal. They very rarely are equal and finding a school or university is a bit like house buying - you have to have that certain feel you get when you walk in.

There is no best school really, just the best for your individual child and many people do recognise this. Quite why I am posting I have no idea as my youngest leaving school this year and I don’t live in London but find these sorts of threads strangely fascinating.

@newsibling123 Actually a Cambridge graduate (Nat Sci) with a PhD who went to a bog standard comprehensive. Have chosen a private education for my DC as I feel it’s right for them and we can afford it.

Unfortunately I feel your mindset is the same as a small minority of SW London parents who cannot see past the blinkered notion that only SPGS is the best and cannot possibly comprehend the many and numerous reasons previous posters have given as to why it is not.

Take a look at Brampton Manor Academy. 55 Oxbridge offers in 2019 and it’s FREE.

I think that some people apply to as many schools as possible to increase the chance of success, to ensure a broad selection to choose from. Or, they may think 'no harm in applying, the worst they can say is no', and then if they get an offer, they decide that somewhere else is a better fit.

Or, they learn something about the school after they've applied that changes their mind.

An academic hot house doesn’t tick the boxes for me. As the mum of a very talented dd who has significant struggles with mental health we are looking above all for a kind and calm School.

I know two people who turned down law places at Oxford to do law at Nottingham and another northern uni. There are so many factors behind personal decision making

Cambridge is nothing even close to chilled

@newsibling123 To be clear I wasn't responding directly to your post. I was responding to the poster who claimed that Durham students were intellectually inferior to their Oxbridge counterparts. By and large, I don't think that's at all the case. Obviously there will be extraordinarily talented people at Oxbridge but the kind of people working hard to get a 2.1 generally in my experience are not a million miles away in terms of talent from the top half of people at Durham or any other good uni. They might be a bit more hard working and a bit more focused on their subject - but that slight edge doesn't always translate to greater success in the job market in my ( admittedly limited) experience.

@newsibling123 So the title of your post probably should have been, “I would really like my DD to go to SPGS as I think it’s great (even though I have never set foot inside there).”

As opposed to basically saying if anyone else’s daughter gets a place but doesn’t accept it then you’re bonkers.

@ForeverbyJudyBlume - I guess everyone has different experiences. I went to Cambridge and found it really chilled!

LOL at the chilled vibe of Cambridge - having been to Cambridge, it's not chilled remotely!

Things may have changed but in my day choral scholars - while they had officially been through the admissions procedure - were given a much easier ride, several I knew had missed the grades they had to reach by quite a way (ie Bs instead of As - no A* then - and Cs in other subjects) and still got in.