IB or A Levels

@Pippi1970
I tend to think IB parents will justify the choice and say their DC are better even though they cannot make a direct comparison . It’s not as if only IB students flourish at university, is if? Plenty do! Plenty get firsts too without IB! So I think the naturally bright do well whatever they study.

I would also say that no DC should be bored at a decent school that should offer all sorts of enrichment and clubs. Life isn’t about being taught subjects every day. It’s also what you can seek for yourself. As I explained above, bright dc can do a lot in the best schools and just doing exams is not necessary.

I think children have to make pretty staggering decisions about their long term careers ridiculously early in the UK. The broadness of the IB keeps options open for longer. Also, having to continue to study a broad curriculum for longer I think enhances your overall ability. Even if you are more maths oriented you have to continue to develop your writing and language skills which ultimately I think is an advantage in a child's intellectual development.

Friends’ DC who have already done IB and gone to university have mentioned that the transition to uni was a doddle compared to their A level counterparts as they already had experience of structure and workload so found their first year really easy

I think A level students often find their first year easy too!

You can do 3 A levels, then if you are worried about boredom you could add core maths, a language Delft or an epq.

Our school has dropped it and added a wider range of A levels.

"Even DC with mostly 9s at Gcse have favourite subjects. Ones they enjoy slightly more. My DD1 had stellar gcse results but could rationalise what she felt more comfortable with at A level. Most dc can project beyond gcse and look at where their overall strengths and interests lie."

That's definitely true but in my case (and some of my friends who did it with me) despite having favourites being able to do a variety of things is a positive in itself. I thought I'd go mad at sixth form with every day the same: English, Spanish, History. Having a varied curriculum stopped me getting bored (in a "poor attention span" way rather than a "this is too easy" way). My job now is very varied and involves turning my hand to many different topics and ways of working, so this preference continued. I think looking back I also benefitted from extra years of science and maths which I wouldn't have had otherwise.

My DD is doing an IB at a local state school. I agree what's been said about it being hard to run for the school - they are attached to a Secondary School, and can only offer a subset of all the IB subjects and especially languages, so the ACTUAL subjects offered by the school you're applying to may also affect your choice.

No regrets but it's hard work (although we don't have any experience of A Levels), especially organising the CAS - this took us/her quite unawares and our school only offers minimal practical support for organising these activities. This varies from school to school so do ask about this - another local school also offering IB is much more proactive with helping the students collect their 'CAS hours'. Lockdown restrictions didn't help... In our case however it was a good way to broaden her horizons.
She's academically bright (9s in GCSE) so is doing okay, and was able to pursue her interest in Maths and Science while keeping some breadth and a foreign language. However I should include that a) she also chose the school because it is quite small (as opposed to the local 6th form colleges with 1000 in each year), and b) I have a baccalaureate from another EU country so was receptive to the idea of keeping your studies broader. Around here, the IB by its nature also attracts students who are already considering studying abroad, and/or have already been to school in another country, so the specific cohort in her school includes (academically able) students from very mixed and international backgrounds which adds another dimension to the 'broadening of horizons' for my DD.
Applying to University is straightforward, I have no concerns there - all the courses she's looked at list nuanced 'requirements' that show they do understand how IBs work, and which Maths strands and subject levels are needed in the sciences for example.

My DD is doing the IB. It is a lot of work but you are taught how to pace yourself, plus as already mentioned it is great for an all rounder. Also I thought it important to continue with maths and Language and literature (either English or native language) as many non U.K. universities would expect it (we live in a country with a baccalaureate type of qualification, all core subjects right through to end of lycée).

Friends’ DC who have already done IB and gone to university have mentioned that the transition to uni was a doddle compared to their A level counterparts as they already had experience of structure and workload so found their first year really easy.

I would choose IB, but in Spain we had to do 10 subjects at that level, including three languages (PE and RE non-graded), and took exams in all of them. If my kids ever wanted to go to Spain for university it would be much easier to convert an IB qualification, same for many other countries which don’t specialise in only 3/4 subjects so early. It’d be harder to fulfill uni admission requirements with A levels only.

My DDs did it. It offers them a lot of flexibility when choosing uni courses. Mine scored 34 & 35. One went to Glasgow and one went to Bristol. Both graduated with firsts. Mine said the IB stood them good stead in the first years of uni as they were used to producing essays to a high academic standard.

The reason it is not offered more widely is the cost. It’s very expensive re staffing and most schools have to run if with A levels and some would have to run it with BTecs. It’s just one option too many when A levels are just fine for the vast majority.

43 points is a massive score. Few get this. The big problem has been that DC are coerced into IB because schools have invested in it but then DC find, at advanced level, they are not all rounders at all. So getting 30 points doesn’t feel great when you could have done better with 3 A levels. We toured a few schools offering IB and found students who admitted they had made a mistake and it wasn’t working for them and their likely score would be disappointing. Often they cited the maths/science element caused issues.

I do think many A level students are perfectly fine at university and engage with their study in a mature way. As the vast majority of students have A levels it’s a sweeping statement to say they cannot access degree level study in the same way. Of course they can! A levels in many subjects are decent prep and the personality of the DC and attitudes to study are also key factors.

I don’t think it’s worth seeking out IB these days. I also don’t believe admissions prefer it. Otherwise many top universities like Oxbridge and imperial would have lots of second class students who cannot do as well in their degrees. As Oxbridge is now accepting DC from state schools in very great numbers who won’t have got near the IB, I would say the IB doesn’t confer advantage. It’s merely stated by those justifying their decision to do it.

Even DC with mostly 9s at Gcse have favourite subjects. Ones they enjoy slightly more. My DD1 had stellar gcse results but could rationalise what she felt more comfortable with at A level. Most dc can project beyond gcse and look at where their overall strengths and interests lie. That is also a sign of maturity!

I think it is a shame it is not offered more widely. I think it can benefit girls especially, who are all rounders, who are torn on what they want to study later on at uni, who might otherwise limit their choices too early.

Someone my DD was at school with years 7-11, moved fire 6th form and did the IB and went on to study civil engineering. She wasn't headed in that direction at the end of year 11 and had she taken A levels was unlikely to have narrowed herself to the correct ones for engineering.

Some of the humanities A level subjects include a non examined assessment (NEA) which involves research, data collection and a short dissertation. DD's school didn't offer the EPQ, and her 6,000 word NEA has certainly helped her with how to tackle some of her university assignments.

From memory the A level subjects that include an NEA are: geography, history, English literature and Art & design.

I wish it was an option for my DD. She is a strong all-rounder, organised and self motivated. She doesn't know what she wants to do at Uni and so being forced to choose 3 A levels feels limiting. Unfortunately the closest state school offering the IB to us is 2 hours on public transport away. I can't afford the £15,000 a year for the closest private school. As someone who has taught at RG uni I can say being able to manage your workload, manage continual assessment (as opposed to end of course cramming) and reflect on your learning are really significant advantages.

I did the IB as I had no idea what I wanted to do in the future at that stage. Literally no clue, so it let me continue with the sciences (I chose another science in the flexible group option), maths, English and humanities until I had made up my mind.

The admissions lecturer at the uni I eventually went to favoured the IB students with high scores - he was under the impression a levels could be passed easily just by memorising the book, whereas IB you had to do some if your own research eg. The extended essay and Theory of Knowledge essay. Whether that is true I have no idea, didn't do a levels to compare.

Re university choice
Ds had an offer from all five of his choices and he chose Warwick. There were quite a few IB students on his course, especially those who had come from overseas. He graduated this year and is now a trainee chartered accountant.

My ds did the IB diploma: HL maths, chemistry, biology and SL English, German and Geography and achieved 43 points.
It is a great choice if you are a good all rounder and due to the CAS requirement you always have a lot of interesting activities/experiences for the personal statement on UCAS form. The workload is heavy and the course requires steady commitment and focus throughout the two years. It’s not a course for those who like to cruise and then cram.
The IB emphasises reflecting on your learning, experiences and how you learn and this approach seems to be increasingly popular both at uni and in the workplace. Ds had several pieces of work at university that required a reflection and he found this much easier to approach than students who had studied a levels.

What a depressing attitude from a deputy head. So he's dismissing a fantastic qualification presumably on the basis that it's mainly offered in the UK by independent and some grammar schools (though there are actually a number of all ability state schools that offer it too)? Sorry, but that sounds like pure knee-jerk inverse snobbery. OP, it's not for everyone, but if you've got a kid who's a relative all-rounder, who's self-motivated to work hard and who you feel has the resilience to handle the workload, then it's a great qualification.

Deluge!!! Deputy. My proof reading skills need to improve.

Shame a deluge head thinks that too! So much for welcoming a great education!

It’s also true to say that the IB is expensive to teach and I’m not aware of any grammar school where I live offering it. It’s mostly offered at independent schools but it’s worrying a deputy head thinks it’s pretentious.

Lol at a course being pretentious. I did it at a comprehensive with students from all backgrounds. Your husband sounds like he needs to open his mind.

Not pretentious at all! Lots of DC can stay interested at school by doing clubs, sport, music, mentoring, leadership, etc. EPQ even!

Lots of universities do not ask for ucas points. Most top courses where academic DC end up ask for A level grades or X points IB score.