Going from private to state in YR9 - reason to be picked on?

OP you say you live in Central London, and you have a place already. What I will say is that if the school in question is either Cardinal Vaughn, Oratory or Holland Park, there will be a smattering of former private school candidates, so bullying about that should not be a problem. I don't really know much about other schools where boys can be accommodated in the area. Not heard much about Westminster academy in regards with their pastoral, but I have heard they are really top achieving. Stay away from Pimlico Academy.

When you say '3rd tier' which private schools are you referring to? Because London is fast running out of 'back up' schools. Even relatively new 'non academic' schools like Wetherby senior, get a high Russell group intake - those who do not make it there are either at specialist schools or overseas. Some years ago schools like Emmanuel were back up, but now are actually first choice for some.

A lot of people have addressed the 11+ vs 13+ issue with state schools, I think your next question should be in regards with the specific schools your DS has been accepted to.

Except for the 3 schools I mentioned earlier, I have no Central London School to recommend for a prep school DC. What is the view from your current Head ?

Good luck

I moved my son from private to state in year 9 but the situation was slightly different in that he'd had an awful time at the private school and they refused to acknowledge/support his autism. The school got trounced in an inspection on safeguarding and equality shortly afterwards.

The other this that helped was that one local state school had a middle school system so he was joining at a normal transition time albeit as one of only 3 children not from the two feeder middle schools. It wold have been harder at a school that had started in year 7.

He was much, much happier in the state school although he didn't achieve what he was capable of.

I don't think it matters whether it is private-state, state-state, state-private, private-private, moving schools can be difficult and unpredictable and children can be horrible anywhere.

It is more to do with the fact that if OP's DC is leaving the private sector anyway, then joining at Y7 give them a better chance at getting a place at a preferred school and start afresh like everyone else.

There is not much benefit in staying at the prep for yr 7 and 8, unless OP want to try for 13+. Everyone else would have already got a 13+ place or prepping for it, the prep also probably doing different subjects and sports to most state schools.

Problem is that no one can say that your ds will be fine-and no one can say that he won't be.

Unfortunately it will depend on the children he comes into contact with more than anything else. The school's handling of the situation may make it better or worse, but that's hard to tell until you're in that situation. (if they tell you there's no bullying, run for the hills, it translates as "we don't deal with it so we can pretend we don't have any".)
I've had 3 go through the same state school and it varies on the head of year even within the school.

There are differences, like there are differences between schools, but if there are children who want to make an issue of it, then you can find something simple like standing up when a teacher comes into the classroom (we did when I was at school, my dc don't) makes it easy to ridicule him.

It will depend at least partially on whether he will respond to comments with being upset, or whether he'll be able to grin, laugh at himself and move on. That isn't necessarily something you can tell now.

This is true of any child moving between schools, of any time after the normal entry points.
However people do (you see it on MN) have a view of private schools that, from what I've seen, is often unfair. That then perhaps can mean that if people are aware that he's come from one, then there perhaps is something that some people will see as an excuse for thinking he is fair game.

I sent my ds from private to a good state school halfway through year 8 and he was absolutely fine. No one cared that he had come from a private school.

I echo everyone above though and would absolutely move over for year 7 as that is an option. Much better to settle in from the start rather than having to break into established friendship groups and to be following the same curriculum earlier too. I dont think you would gain anything from those extra 2 years at the private school and you would save a lot of money too.

Plenty of bullying in fee paying schools.

Oh and I second the person above saying what a horrible year year 9 is. All those hormones and drama, it's traumatic enough anyway without finding your feet in a new school with established friendship groups.

Many year 9s are horrible. They were lovely in year 7 and become great again by year 11, but year nine. Urgh. Tough year.

You might have trouble getting in to a half decent secondary school at year nine.

In terms of bullying it's hard to predict. Some kids can style anything out where was others will get picked on for the most unimaginable little things. It will be hard joining 2 years after people gave settled in and made friends, unless for some reason they admit a large number in year 9. That would be unusual in the state sector. I would either move at yr 7 or look at studio colleges and specialist academies that start in yr 10 if you're not planning on staying private.

I wonder whether y9 is actually the problem abd not necessarilymoving schools? Just giving it more thought now, some children did try to change friendship group around that age (exploring identity?) Again, that went badly. Girks ended up v secually performative to win a place and the boys bolshy and dare devil like.

You know those teenage years are hard they truly are!!!

I was at a very ordinary state school. I remember feeling v sorry for children who came in after year 7. It is much easier to be stereotyped (as friendship groups decide whether to admit them - i know that sounds strange, but it was just like that), and children often went for the 'coolest group that would accept them. Consequently things often turned bad (I remember one girl who was v naive and green who joined a group of girls who were quite 'mature in outlook. She came in y9 and left before gcses with a baby on the way). Boys were often very naughty. I imagine that social side of things would be similar in private schools, too. But yes, much less oversight in the average state school where grades are concerned.

I don't mean to scare, but I would avoid moving schools during high school......

having 2 DC in year 9 and above, I find year 9 a bit of an odd year, tricky too.

there isn't the enthusiasm and freshness of year 7 and 8, nor the maturity and the focus of year 10/11.
It's neither here nor there, they start the GCSE curriculum in the core subjects while deciding which subjects to drop further.
The friendship groups have been established by then as well and generally the big school effort for inducting children happens in year 7, even in private schools with intake at 13+

At our school, they start dropping one subject in year 7, then 2 more subjects at the end of year 8. So depending on how things work in your 2 schools (out then in), your DC could find himself in an awkward position with subject choices.
Yes children move in at odd (and various) points but generally it's because things have really not worked out in the first place or of circumstances changing out of the families' control. even if he doesn't sit the 13+ he will still feel off to move to state at that point, as opposed to move at 11+ with the enthusiastic bulge.

I fully agree that he should take ownership of his education, maybe have weight things up with him ?

but if you are going to move out of private I wouldn't delay, you know your DS, if you think he will thrive in year 9 why wouldn't he thrive in year 7 ?
Also it would be a direct consequence of the choices he made on the 11+. He may not like state and maybe decide he now wants to put the work for 13+ ?

Thanks @CrazyHorse what swung your decision when you were in this situation?

My DH told me I was being silly- and finances.

Yes, I totally spend thousands every year to make sure my DC have the “right accent “
Or maybe so they don’t attend the local comp which is in special measures and ranks as one of the worst in the country for GCSE results

I went from private to state in year 9 and really struggled. I didn't get picked on at all though, I was just used to a totally different level of schooling and facilities etc, and it honestly shocked me the difference! I begged my parents to let me moved back to private school so they did after only about 6 weeks. I didn't find the people any different really though, if anything the girls at my private school were a lot nastier and bitchier!

The main issue would be whether you DS will get a place for Yr 9 in your preferred school. Lots of popular schools run a waiting lists for all year groups. I guess you can apply for 13+ indie places as backup, maybe your DS would have been more matured by then. Do you live very very close to a good school? Even then you have get past the siblings on the waiting lists first. If you are happy with any school then it is easier.

Yr 7/8 is like Reception all over again where kids learn new routines, find their friends, get to try different subjects and activities. I have a friend who had a child joined a grammar at 11+ and another at 13+. The one who joined later didn't have as strong a friendship group as the other. Academically both did really well.

@thesunday
You sound like a lovely, thoughtful, engaged Mum so your DC is 99% there anyway, that is all any child needs.
Good luck to him! x

State school starts secondary at yr 7 so it will be easier to transition plus many schools start doing options for GCSEs at the end of yr 8. Far harder to make friends starting as the new boy in yr 9 plus less likely to get a choice of school. If you can't afford private through to yr 11 I would definitely switch at yr 7 (plenty of kids switch to state 6th form colleges at yr 12 so that's not as difficult)

I think if you are choosing to go state you may as well move now for Y7 as everyone is new
Y9 will be more tricky

I'm amazed to hear the "badly bullied" stories, frankly. Are they the sort of schools where bullying is rife anyway?

We had a state school back up for DSC1 who was actually very academic so it wasn't ever likely that she'd fail to get into the private school of choice. With her younger brother, DH initially proposed the same state school back up until I pointed out the difficulties in getting in and settling at a non standard time (DH, being familiar only with private schools, hadn't thought about the issues around mid year applications for over subscribed state schools and had assumed you could always get into your catchment school, which I had to explain to him you can't!) We eventually looked further afield and found a less selective privi one about 40 minutes drive away that ran a free bus service he could have caught. But in fact be got into the same one as his sister.

Having DSC and DC at both private and state schools I can see some differences and have seen kids move in both directions. I do think that Y8 in the private sector is really heavily geared around entrance exams and preparation for moving up to private 13-18 schools. Being pressured by taking entrance exams, failing them, spending the rest of the year with classmates all excited about their future plans while you have to wait until July before a place can be confirmed, then moving off where noone else is going wouldn't be the greatest experience. I've also found some alarming negative views of local state schools prevalent among a lot of private school kids - full of "chavs" who don't want to learn, full of kids not bright enough to get into the more desirable schools, etc. It might be hard to shield your DS from picking up some of that negativity during his Y7/8 experience.

So I'd either look around for a less selective private school backup, or move him at the start of Y7.

@rogueone the extra-curricular at my kids' comp is 5 times better than at the small private school I teach in. And as for prep school kids being ahead - also not always true. Simply a question of ability. A very bright child, perhaps, but sometimes the sheer scale of a big comp means there is more room for setting (so 7 sets in year group 'half' as opposed to maybe 3) and the very top sets absolutely fly. I think the idea of prep school kids being 'ahead' academically is one put about by prep schools to dissuade parents from moving their kids at the end of year 6 - it is not usually borne out by evidence.
Acquaintances of ours had a very bright, quirky son at a local prep school. They looked at local independent day schools but decided their DS wouldn't fit in as he would rather talk about politics than play rugby, would argue against all the pomp and ceremony, still couldn't tie his own tie etc. We suggested they look at state but they insisted he would be too far ahead of his peers. So he ended up in a very small private school for years 9-11 with a reputation for picking up kids who have failed to thrive anywhere else. Poor kid was miserable because there was nobody like him to talk to. The irony is the top sets in my kids' comp in a small university city are absolutely stuffed with fiercely intelligent boys doing additional maths and spending lunchtimes playing chess or building computers. This child would have fitted right in! But parents believed the propaganda they were fed. He's now at very academic state 6th form, loving the work but lonely again because of Covid limiting his ability to make new friends, and not having any established friendship groups, which he would have had if he had moved seamlessly over from state comp to state 6th form with the entire top set...

I actually considered doing this with DS1 - looking back I can't believe I was being so stupid. He started state secondary in Y7 and it was fine. If he's started in Y9 I think he would have struggled to make friends as friendship groups had already been formed.

Any kid joining in Y9 is going be a curiosity and if he's been to a prep school it is going to be tougher to fit in.

I would start him in Y7 or stay at independent until the end of Y11.

Really mybonnieliesovertheocean2, granted I’m not in London but our large comp offers similar extra curriculars.