Talk to me about CAT scores and private schools

1. Your child’s scores are way above average.
2. You are placing way too much importance on the CATs.
3. If your child can secure a place at a certain school then he is clever enough to be there.
4. It sounds like you and particularly your DH have unrealistically high expectations of how your child should be doing academically. The average child is CAT 100. Grammar schools intake around 113. Super-selective grammars such as Judd (in top 5% of country for results) take around 125-130. Your child is way above average. Start appreciating him!

Hello, My sun did a CAT test in Y6 in 2021. Does anyone know what the number of questions were in that year? His mean score was 121. Does anyone know what 'PTE' (score of 130) stands for. And what PTM (112) stands for?

Many thanks for any insights.

Hi what do you think about St Albans. We have been told 128ish +.

@Globaliser
thank you

Hi all, thank you for all your input so far, very interesting and helpful!

Our son is in year 3 and took his first CAT assessments in September 2020 and all of his scores fall in the average range. We have since found out he is likely dyslexic. I wondered how accessible the CAT assessment is for a dyslexic child and if it isn’t, are there are any access arrangements that can be made? Or, is there a more reliable indicator of potential at 11+ for secondaries to use? New to all of this, so thank you for any guidance.

Hi@thesunday

CAT scores can move through practice - but the 13+ is far more well rounded, so I think this will be less of an issue for you.

I think the main issue you will face is that the 13+ now is usually offered through the PreTest - that takes place at the same time as the 11+. As you have missed this - you need to check if you can still apply for the 13+ or whether it will be an occasional place. If occasional place you will need a back up - as this is not guaranteed.

Good luck !

Averages.

NHEHS 115
SCHS 115
FH(SS) 120
PHS 120
WHS 120
G&L 125

@LondonMummer @Globaliser
are those scores average or minimum for each category ?
do you have any scores for GDST schools by any chance ?

The scores I have given are the approximate scores that DC's entering those schools have achieved. A higher score for the school does not necessarily translate into higher A level results for an individual child. A child scoring 130+ might be better suited to a school where the children joining the school average 120+. On the other hand, there is little point applying to a school where the children joining the school average 130+, if your DC is well below that figure.

There seems to be some confusion here. The scores I gave are for the CAT4 Digital Test, based on Y4-Y8. These test verbal, non-verbal, quantitative and spatial reasoning. They are a predictor of performance in exams, which is why they are helpful to prep school heads advising on which schools to apply for. They are not the basis on which an application is judged. Performance in music, sport or drama will be important as well. They help to guide the parent and the head to apply to an appropriate school. They might have more importance if schools abandon their entrance exams permanently. The scores given to each DC's parent are Standardised Age Scores. These are based on each child’s raw score in each test which is then adjusted for their age and placed on a scale that makes a comparison with a nationally representative sample of pupils of the same age across the UK. The mean score on each test is 100 for the national sample. The mean score for independent schools is approximately 110. The maximum score possible is 141 on each test and for the mean SAS.

DH thinks CAT 119/120 is state secondary level and that's where DC is meant to be

What a bizarre perspective from your DH! What on earth does he mean by "state secondary level"?

FWIW, my dd's CAT scores have consistently been in the range that, according to this thread, would have comfortably secured her a place at a super-selective private school. We did consider the independent sector but concluded it really wasn't worth it in our situation. DD is positively thriving at her state comprehensive, because frankly, she is the kind of child who will do well wherever she goes.

I'd have thought that a slightly above average but not outstanding dc like your DS would be exactly the kind of child who would benefit most from what a private school has to offer. Far more than the kind of kid who would excel academically and socially in any environment!

Also please don’t choose a school on CAT scores. Choose where he will be happiest and best in the long run. That takes into account affording family holidays, putting aside money for his house deposit, the hours spent in a car/bus each day when he could be relaxing/studying, mates nearby he can go round to. Some of the pupils with higher scores than my Dd didn’t do well because of family problems. Or anxiety/pressure. A lot of pupils at both the private school and comprehensive have mental health problems often with drug use.

My daughters northern comprehensive state school is average. She had a CAT score of 131 in Year 9 and was 6th in her year for CAT scores (year group of 240). She got AstarAstarA at A Level if you want to know what that translates to in A Level terms. I would expect a comprehensive to follow the normal pattern of CAT scores like it did.

I have to smile at the idea that state school is a better fit if you're not as bright!

CAT are standardised scores, 68% of the population will score between 85 and 115. So your dc score is slightly above the average range.

I'd caution reading too much into them, they are 95 % accurate within a certain range, but that means 1 in 20 scores are out. The only represent ability in the test in that moment and should always be considered alongside other information about a child. I'm really not convinced they could tell you what school to send your child to.

Also bear in mind that individual CAT scores are accurate with a range of +/- 6 IIRC, so there could be a considerable variation in the scores of pupils with the same ability.

Also interested in this, although our prep head has indicated lower for some of these schools - 120+

These are approximate scores, designed to show roughly where each school fits, not a minimum, so for example your DC could get a place at St Paul’s Girls’ with an average CAT score of less than 130.

Do people expect the MiDYis tests that senior schools do on Yr 7 entry to deliver the same results as CATs? Some senior schools also take CATs, but more use MIDYIS these days.

I wonder if when they compare the Prep school CAT scores, to ISEB entry exams which are also reasoning tests, to some of the other adaptive reasoning tests independent schools buy and use as reasoning tests (from CEM or GL), to MIDYIS, if they are broadly delivering the same result or within the same range?

Senior schools usually test within the first half term, I guess because not all entrants have done CAT tests at their previous school. If they use adaptive reasoning tests as part of their entrance test info, they have that for all candidates, but often they have been prepped. When they do Senior School reasoning tests in Sept/Oct it is often unannounced and they have not prepared for them. Would be interesting to know how much they differ.

[quote user149799568]@LondonMummer fwiw, the Westminster score is almost exactly what their former head told parents the average was several years ago.[/quote]
That's really good to know. Obviously CATs mostly indicate potential and ultimately it comes down to how they perform in the exam with regard to syllabus based questions but I'd say it's been a fairly robust indicator for my elder son and hoping it will be for my younger who is about to go through the 11+ journey

@LondonMummer fwiw, the Westminster score is almost exactly what their former head told parents the average was several years ago.

@user149799568 no unfortunately not, and it may not even have been an average just "these are the kind of CAT scores achieved by pupils who have been made offers in the past". Interested to hear anyone whose kids got into these schools can share their CAT scores

@LondonMummer that's really good information. Did the school indicate any sort of range, e.g., very few below X have ever received an offer from this school?

@Globaliser I strongly concur with this. My son's Prep school shared details of the average CAT scores that boys who had been made offers had achieved.

Westminster 132
St Paul's 131
CLS 127
Habs 125
UCS 125
MTS 125
Highgate 124 (I think this one is pushing upwards at the mo)
Mill Hill 118

Your Prep Head should give you a realistic indication of what's possible which may be a selective school but not a super selective one - though remember there will likely still be children achieving top grades at any school and best not to push a child into a ferociously academic environment if they will struggle to keep up.