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Original poster

STEM degrees (without A level chemistry)

63 replies

BlackBrowedAlbatross · 30/01/2021 21:57

DS is in Y12 and doing maths, physics, biology A levels. He was planning on doing physics at university, but really only loves the bits about space, so is not particularly enjoying the A level (and not doing that well at it either).

When I suggested that he could look at other degree options if he wasn't sure about physics he just sighed and said, but what else could I do?

Slightly dramatic I know, but I think he's a bit sad that things aren't turning out how he thought they would. So any suggestions that might perk him up would be gratefully received. And despite the thread title, doesn't really have to be STEM. I'd just like to show him that there are loads of options for him to explore, things he's never thought of or maybe even never heard of. 🤞

OP posts:
3aday · 31/01/2021 23:54

He can always take a year out... this year?

What's worrying is that if he's been letting things slip that his teachers might just give him bad CAGs this year. Are they putting anything in place for him to be able to show an improved performance? Normally students can totally mess up in mocks then pull a blinder in the real exam and so the school need to be able to let him show a turnaround if he is capable. He may be feeling totally despondent if he thinks there is no way of upping what they have already decided for him.

Sounds like you need a good chat with his teachers, not just a shock report

EwwSprouts · 31/01/2021 21:04

I keep sticking Scottish university links on these threads due to the broad nature of the first year.
www.st-andrews.ac.uk/physics-astronomy/news/title-113265-en.php

DS is doing the same A levels. Oceanography does look interesting & has a high physics content apparently.

SabrinaThwaite · 31/01/2021 21:02

Earth sciences / environmental sciences could be a good fit and a growth area (DH and I are both earth scientists - he did exploration, I did ground / environmental engineering).

Civil / mechanical / design engineering could be options?

Original poster
BlackBrowedAlbatross · 31/01/2021 20:46

@SquishySquirmy

Biomedical engineering is a very interesting field, and I think it will get even more interesting in the near future.
Thank you @SquishySquirmy this sounds very interesting and I had never heard of it as a branch of engineering.
OP posts:
ErrolTheDragon · 31/01/2021 18:14

@geophys

I'm a geophysicist who did a geology degree. The undergrad included everything from: fossils, evolution, atomic physics, fluid dynamics, evolution of the solar system, oceans, chemistry. And lots of running up and down mountains.
I know an astrogeologist. A bit niche and I don't think she gets to go on many field trips. Grin
SquishySquirmy · 31/01/2021 17:52

Biomedical engineering is a very interesting field, and I think it will get even more interesting in the near future.

SquishySquirmy · 31/01/2021 17:49

I did those A levels and went on to study Engineering.

So many different disciplines possible without chemistry- mechanical, civil, electrical etc, plus some which sound quite niche but actually span several engineering disciplines such as Biomedical, Aerospace, automotive etc.

Original poster
BlackBrowedAlbatross · 31/01/2021 17:44

@geophys

I'm a geophysicist who did a geology degree. The undergrad included everything from: fossils, evolution, atomic physics, fluid dynamics, evolution of the solar system, oceans, chemistry. And lots of running up and down mountains.
Oh this sounds like a lot of fun too! So glad I posted, you have all come up with really useful suggestions that could potentially be more appealing than physics.

The state of aviation is a good point. He won't be starting until 2022 or 2023 so that gives a bit of time to see what happens in the sector but I wonder whether it will ever be quite the same.

OP posts:
Murmurur · 31/01/2021 17:37

Fair point @ErrolTheDragon , I have mainly dealt with the aviation side.

geophys · 31/01/2021 17:33

I'm a geophysicist who did a geology degree. The undergrad included everything from: fossils, evolution, atomic physics, fluid dynamics, evolution of the solar system, oceans, chemistry. And lots of running up and down mountains.

ErrolTheDragon · 31/01/2021 17:19

Yes, I don't know how much the space-type divisions will be affected or if they're somewhat separate from aviation as such. I wouldn't have thought the demand for satellites would be reduced.

Murmurur · 31/01/2021 17:02

I agree Herts is good for aviation but it's an industry that has been very hard hit by covid. It's not going to be the most secure of sectors for some time.

Decorhate · 31/01/2021 16:53

You’re welcome. I’m sure there are other unis offering similar if he feels his grades warrant trying somewhere higher up the league tables - maybe Bristol as there is/was a strong local aviation industry there too.

Original poster
BlackBrowedAlbatross · 31/01/2021 16:07

I actually think those courses at Herts are right up his alley so thanks again.

OP posts:
Original poster
BlackBrowedAlbatross · 31/01/2021 14:46

Ooh that sounds very interesting thank you, and the secrecy adds a certain je ne sais quoi 🐿

OP posts:
Decorhate · 31/01/2021 13:58

😉

ErrolTheDragon · 31/01/2021 13:45

Hertfordshire is not one of the top unis usually but I think is very good in this area (perhaps because there used to be lots of aeronautical industry nearby).

Airbus Defence and Space is in Stevenage .

Decorhate · 31/01/2021 13:13

When your Ds feels more positive about making plans for the future he might want to look at this range of www.herts.ac.uk/courses/undergraduate-courses/undergraduate-subject-areas/aerospace-engineering

They sound like they might suit his interests? Hertfordshire is not one of the top unis usually but I think is very good in this area (perhaps because there used to be lots of aeronautical industry nearby).

I know someone who is currently doing their post grad there part time (their day job is some sort of secret squirrel satellite stuff)

Original poster
BlackBrowedAlbatross · 31/01/2021 12:12

Thank you @MrsAvocet I really appreciate that and your DH's story is inspiring!

I think at the moment we'll try to focus on the small wins, getting up on time, attending all the lessons, getting work in on time, doing a bit of catching up in his free periods. It's hard sometimes to walk that fine line between the kindness but also the boot up the arse that he needs. Confused

OP posts:
MrsAvocet · 31/01/2021 09:45

I think it is also always worth remembering that it isn't the end of the world if you don't get things quite right first time BlackBrowedAlbatross, though as you say, when you are 16 or 17 it is hard to see that. And to be fair, sometimes schools reinforce those thoughts.
My DH is a good example. After a very good set of O levels he got complacent, messed around in 6th form and did very badly in his A levels. He certainly felt he had ruined his life when all his friends went off to University and he didn't. But he went to the local college to resit and did much better, but still narrowly missed the grades for his University offer. He admits that by then he was just desperate to get away to do anything, anywhere so he took a place on a slightly different course at an institution he'd never even heard of before. And to cut a long story short he has ended up as a respected expert in his field, representing the UK on several international committees. It's not a job he even knew existed at 17, but he turned out to be very good at it!
Not that I am saying that A levels don't matter - but that many roads lead to Rome and that you're not doomed if you don't have your life planned out by the time you are a 6th former.
I'm having exactly this conversation with my year 13 son at the moment in fact. He does have some offers but isn't really certain what he wants to do, especially as Covid has messed things up so much and he's not been able to visit anywhere. It's good he has options open but if he wants to take a gap year and think things through more that's fine by me. Everything is so weird at the moment, and being a year "behind" really is not a big issue. There are so many options out there and the conventional pathway of straight to University after school and then straight into work is only one of them. I think a lot of young people are feeling confused and a bit disillusioned right now, and it is very early days for your DS so whilst it is much easier said than done, don't worry too much.

Original poster
BlackBrowedAlbatross · 31/01/2021 05:53

Thanks @Thack that's interesting about physics. I think it's space that he's interested in really. He says he wants to study physics, he just doesn't really like physics A level. Absolutely detests electrical circuits.

He definitely wants to go to university but I think a year out would be a good idea actually, he's quite young in some ways and obviously a bit behind his friends in terms of being able to manage his work and motivate himself. Plus he could apply with grades in hand if his predictions aren't too good. I think six months of work and saving up and then six months travelling, or volunteering abroad somewhere would be amazing for him.

Apprenticeships look interesting too, thanks @lovelemoncurd, I will have a look.

It's hard at that age isn't it, when everyone else seems to be doing ok but you think you're messing up your whole life Sad

OP posts:
Original poster
BlackBrowedAlbatross · 31/01/2021 05:34

@ErrolTheDragon

It's so tough for them at the moment, isn't it? But it sounds like he's got good support. He has always wanted to do something where he can discover things, or make some kind of breakthrough, so I think something cutting edge sciencey, whether that's space or neuroscience or nuclear engineering or mapping oceans (really plucking things from the air here!) would probably suit him better than eg accountancy or business

The reality of science is that there are lots of incremental 'breakthroughs', a lot of teamwork, and a good deal of of serendipity or sheer luck in whether you're in the right place at the right time for the sort of thing that make headlines! But it all adds up.

I think / hope he knows that big scientific breakthroughs are usually the result of lots of people working for years and years and that work is not going to be like Back to the Future 😂

(Although when he was younger he used to say things like "when I invent time travel or how to mine asteroids, I will get you another dog Mum" NB another dog is the last thing I want or need Grin)

I think he wants the feeling of doing something important, which is a great ambition to have I reckon, even though most people do end up doing something a bit less exciting than mining asteroids and even Elon Musk probably has quite a few boring days.

OP posts:
lovelemoncurd · 31/01/2021 05:31

It sounds like an apprenticeship may be more his thing. There seems to be a few space ones when I looked for my daughter.

Original poster
BlackBrowedAlbatross · 31/01/2021 05:14

Very grateful for all these suggestions and will definitely just frame it as: hey look, there are loads of other interesting things you could do if you decide in the end that straight physics isn't quite right. And then leave him to explore some ideas if he wants.

I don't want him to abandon the idea of physics, which has been his plan for ages, and then feel like there's nothing in its place and no point working hard iyswim.

Thinking about it, this started last term so it's not just a lockdown thing (although online school has made it much worse). He does have a lot to do. There is time and it would be great if he could start Y13 all square and with some decent predicted grades, but it's a big step to go from not doing the work to not only doing the work but also catching up, isn't it.

Love the idea of meteorology!

OP posts:
Thack · 31/01/2021 05:06

Agree with murmurur too. V difficult to know what to do when you are 16-17yo and the pressure of making a decision that sets out the rest of your life is daunting!

Is he set on going to uni? The world is going to make it difficult, but maybe a gap year or work placement might help. Deferring one year, if he can find something to do with it, might let him see the working world and give a break from the pressure.

He's got a good set of subjects, a difficult mix. He can probably pick any dregree!

Why did he initially pick physics?
I did it at uni. The A level exam was awful and I worried I'd failed or made a mistake picking physics. Got an A. The first year in uni was mostly catching everyone up to the same level, it was relatively easy compared to a levels. There is a common first year too so easy to switch between the physics degrees (astro, bio, theoretical, acoustic). He could maybe mix degrees too and stick to one subject after first year (my physics classmates did joint maths, music and chemistry).

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