I need to talk really frankly about money and fees for private secondary

@Effzeh those state school stats are very interesting I think. I went to Oxbridge from a state school myself and the teaching was on average probably better than dds’ school.
I think dc who get to uni from state school haven’t had the spoon-feeding or sense of entitlement and have to have more internal drive to get the top grades.

I have only read ops responses, but if you haven’t been to private school/know lots of people who do, you may be underestimating the fees. There could be levys, some per child and some per family, up to 1k maybe, trips and camps, uniform will be 1k, train/bus ticket could be similar, books expensive too.

Both the private schools we have been at lunch was excluded but the school leaned heavily on you to avoid packed lunches.

You can afford it OP

However - you will always have people flocking to these threads telling you that state kids do better educationally wise

I’m glad my kids are in private the schools near me are dreadful

I suppose I just want them to go out in the world with that confidence and sense of belonging and ease in whatever situation you find yourself. To know that whatever obstacles you have the weapons of privilege/connections/education and family money to cushion you.

You can look at this the other way round though, and argue that successful state-educated kids have a sense of confidence and belonging from knowing that they made it in the same education system attended by the vast majority of the population, without needing to be defensive about having been given extra privileges.

At least that is my experience, and iirc there is data to show that at university level state-educated dc outperform privately-educated dc with similar grades, presumably because they have had to take ownership of their education and acquired extra resilience and perseverance in the process.

Op I get your reasoning on private. We have sent our kids private from 3 for very similar reasons, partly because one of our dds likely has borderline asd traits so is quite vulnerable. We picked a non selective private which has a focus on a really rich curriculum and isn’t very results focused. We can afford it, but don’t have a huge amount left over each month.

My kids are very happy and have made good friends. So in that way it’s been a real success. I have to be honest and say that sometimes I resent paying the money and feel state teaching is just as good. But kids didn’t have to do sats and got lots of music, art, drama etc which they really enjoy.

Are law firms not making lots of redundancies at the moment? What sort of law, I think most areas will be really squeezed.

Have you planned for university too?

Personally, having decent savings was more important to us in the end.

Disappointed in top private school www.mumsnet.com/Talk/education/4140193-Disappointed-in-top-private-school

Might be worth having a read of this current thread.

My brother is an equity partner in a large law firm and everything went to crap for him financially when the firm went through a bad patch. Basically the partners only get paid from profits. No profits, no pay. They had to move out of their big lovely house into a small rental for several years. His older kids went private but the younger ones are in a state school as he can’t afford the fees. They were starting to get back on their feet then covid hit. So he’s been earning nothing like his previous salary for almost 5 years. And he’s still working 12+ hours a day.

In theory it sounds easy that if something disastrous happened you would just make a change, but moving kids out of schools where they are happy is very emotive and most people try to avoid it. I know two families who’ve basically impoverished themselves to keep their kids at expensive schools after a parent lost their job or had a health crisis. And I understand why they’ve done it but the stress of money worries does weigh heavily on the kids as well. And you look at those kids post school and they are no better off academically or more confident than their state school counterparts. Just something worth considering when you are completely reliant on the future salary of one partner.

Some young people are desperate to stay within their tribe. It’s no different to a working class kid refusing to engage with a posh kid. They like what they are comfortable with and they don’t have the advantage of maturity. It usually comes and then they alter their views. All dc hopefully. I’m sure a working class person would be grateful to be attended to by a Dr who went to private school and vice versa. People eventually rub along but 17 year olds are still finding their way in the world.

I think you probably will have enough to pay for education. If he’s really bright I would aim higher and transfer to a prep and plan for 13 plus.

I have a Step Son that goes to SA boys in Herts he very bright and does well there but I'd honestly say he would have done just as well in a state school.
The teachers he has there are a mixed bag some are bad so like others have said just because you pay don't mean the teachers are top standard !
I think because he has gone to this type of school it's not done him any good with his social skills for when he goes into the big world and he's very immature for his age he is very clever and gets straight As but he has no experience with regards his view of the real world he will even look down on other kids that go to state school and he even said to me once that he would never date a girl that went to a state school as he thinks they would have nothing in common he is 17 btw !! and he has a very bad misconception of poor ppl so him calls them . His dad is nothing like this at all so I can only put these views down to the school he goes to and the kids he mixes with there !

I have a son that is older then him and went to state school a good one he did well there he is now at uni in a good one up north but the difference in them is worlds apart like a teacher has said a few post back if he has good work ethics he will do fine in a very good state school I know I'm only going on one boy but if that's the kind of snobbery that's installed in them from these schools I'd rather save my money

Go on less holiday? Then you can save £6,500 a year

@EmbMonStu what do you mean by smoothing the way? Bottom line is that there is nastiness and bullying in all schools and less than desirable behaviour. You will probably have less behavioural problems in a selective state school in that realkt poor behaviour will be managed out but you still get the smart arses, the ones with the big mouth, the ones who think they’re gods gift. That won’t change. There’ll also be plenty of kids who aren’t that nice and some who come from troubled, although affluent, backgrounds who have their own issues. Obviously, there will also be lots of lovely boys and good as well as poor teachers. Not all the teachers will inspire your son. Some he will love abs others he won’t and the feeling may be mutual. Not putting you off. I was educated at a too girls school and have a child currently in private education so do have a bit of an idea!

[quote EmbMonStu]@JabbyMcJabface 90% of that was lost on me I am afraid but he was paying into a pension until 18 mo ago and will start again in August. I hope that’s a bit better![/quote]
Loads!

I would still recommend a decent financial advisor though given be will likely not be able to make standard pension contributions. A decent one will model out various scenarios for you based on your DH’s potential earnings and incorporating various expenses included school fees. Plus your earnings and estimated pension. From that they’ll be able to come up with some forecasts of what the income will be in retirement.

Sorry, I know that’s not what you asked about at all! But it might help you make a more informed decision about school fees.

Assume 10% fee increases per year and don't forget that you may want to pay for university education
You don't mention your housing costs/mortgage situation

You lost me at DH doesn’t have a pension. Are you serious? Given his earnings/likely earnings progression he’s massively missed the boat on being able to pay decent amounts into a pension. He’s also missed out on his employer making contributions. Not sure on the position for salaried partners but most places don’t contribute for equity partners (it’s taking out of one hand to give to the other).

Does he have other provisions for retirement? If not I would get yourself a financial advisor ASAP before committing to any school fees.

Get him to set a pension up ASAP whilst he might be able to make use of some carry back allowances.

Think about your sons’ futures - for example it’s difficult nowadays to get onto the housing market. They could have a healthy savings account with the amount you saved each year for a good deposit when they needed it.
Dd is bright and went to the local comp and left a couple of years ago with 2 Astars and an A.
We are semi-rural and ‘up North’ and 99% just go to the one school on the doorstep.
London seems a nightmare as you have so much choice! Personally being 10 mins away is brilliant for after school clubs or seeing friends rather than stuck on transport to get there and back. I went to a private and a public school and taught in state schools and private. A good comp is the best solution if you are lucky enough to be near one. I would move to be near one for the lifestyle for both children and parents. Then it depends on their friends! For sports you can join local clubs. Which means another set of friends if friendship groups break down at school.

First off stop apologising. My husband was a lawyer and I know how hard he had to work to make partner. He got himself into Oxford, first in his family to go to university, and worked and worked and earned the money to send his kids to private school (eldest two started in an top rated state school but it didn't work for them, last two did not get in to the four nearest state schools due to distance - this is SW London). No way could we afford to go away every year.
So I have experience of five private schools. You will be less well off than some, better well off than others. I wouldn't worry about that aspect, it seems to affect the parents far more than the kids.
I do worry about your expectations that going to private school will allow your children 'ease, comfort and joy'. A private education will not provide that. If it's a decent school they will expect a high standard of work and discipline. The days are long (my kids day is 8.30-4.30 when in school, 8.45-3.30 online currently, with plenty of homework too). Sport every weekend. As for joy that is really fantasy. A child may be happy or not, that is not down to the school but who they are. Do not put the expectation on your children that you paying gir private education means your children must therefore have no problems. Because they certainly will, as much as any child.
A good education is a great gift for any child, and of the state option is not up to par then by all means pay for it - you seem to be grounded enough to have weighed it all up. But it doesn't absolve you from parenting your children- that is far more important in terms of their comfort and joy than what school they go to.

@EmbMonStu I just wanted to refer to the fact that you said you think private will smooth the way for a less tempestuous secondary journey for your DCs than you had and I would say that this is not necessarily the case.
I went to private secondary and a prestigious private boarding school for 6th form - I was from a very humble background and had the.worst. time. It was hell on Earth for me as I couldn’t relate to other kids there and struggled with the cliques terribly. I went to a top Uni as private education does afford you the grades, connections to do so but just found myself in the same boat as before.
My post grad was done at an old polytechnic, I found my people, thrived and got the best results of my entire academic career.

Think carefully about your reasoning for private schooling your kids, just because you had a difficult time in state doesn’t mean they will and private isn’t the utopia you think it is.

There is no automatic entitlement for salaried partners to be made up to equity. You need to talk to some people who were salaried partners in2007. What’s his practice area?

To be fair op dd got a place at one of the SW London "holy grail" state schools. It was an utter disaster due to appalling behaviour and a two tier system of expectations for the haves and have not. The teaching too was far from inspirational let alone excellent. We moved her.

London and surrounds are a different kettle of fish compared to other parts of the country.