Impossible question - but do you think children in private schools are ‘happier’?

And to you & yours @flourandeggs x

And an awesome book for the teens to read it YESSSSS! THE S.U.M.O Secrets to being a Positive, Confident Teenager by Paul McGee
Took on board lots of the ideas for myself too (maybe I have never grown up!)

@SJaneS49 sorry you had a pants (and poo filled) day. Here is to 2021 (from Spring onwards maybe! ) x

I’d quite like a book recommendation too! Ditto @Diddlysquatty re dance -DD2 goes to a Performing Arts specialising school, dance classes are obligatory and she’s disgarded her leotard for her baggy black drama top.

If only they could see themselves as we see them - but then did we?! I look at the pictures of the size 8-10 teenage and twenty something me who was very self conscious about her body and I would kill to still look like that!

Also ‘Brainstorm’ which is a short play by Ned Glasier. Somehow it was if the teens were talking to me and it made me really emotional- would love to put this play on with some teenagers!

I loved ‘Inventing Ourselves’ by Sarah Jane Blakemore - it is quite sciencey but done in a way that even I could grasp!

@flourandeggs, I’m sure I stereotype too and like you, find some of the language about State school pupils and how Private is infinitely better from some quarters pretty annoyance inducing and at odds with our lived experience.Judging by titles of the posts here on the Secondary section, there is a predominance of Private parents and I’d agree whole heartedly with a comment you made up thread about how some of the comments are driven by justifying the spend (a London friend of mine is paying an eye watering just over £90K a year for her 3 on top of their large mortgage). I’m quite sure I’ve done quite a bit of justifying of our choices too! Thanks for the best wishes - a bad day after I lost a big work contract and DDog (who has IBD) was in pretty continuous explosion at both ends. Roll on 2021!

@Diddlysquatty, DD2 has actually had a good term since deciding to branch out very early on and spend her time with this new group of girls. In an ideal world obviously our DC would make a good group of friends in Year 7 straight off but that so rarely happens and they have bumps and wrong turns along the way - as parents you live that a bit with them which does play into the inner ‘have we chosen the right school?’ monologue. I agree with @MsTSwift re is anyone happy at this age? Or at least continuously, confidently happy. DD2 seems happy at school but less happy in this change from girl to woman, not wanting to go out in public without hugely voluminous clothes at the moment. I do prefer these clothes to tight fitting and revealing ones for sure but wish she felt more secure and less in need of armour (if that makes sense!),

It's going to depend on the child, the school, and the particular year they move into.

School I was at, our year was regarded as very sweet friendship wise. You could divide the groups of girls roughly into 3 groups, and within those groups they divided further.
But the groups were generally nice to each other as well. Yes there were nasty moments and fallings out, but on the whole the girls got on well enough across the year group. There were 3 or 4 girls who were very good at looking out for new people/people on their own and making sure they were okay and inviting them in.
Dsis' year, a couple of years older, was a nightmare. The girls swapped friendships with lots of drama, and a couple of really catty ones who really did like to play "Wendy" and divide up any friendships, and pick on anyone they perceived as different.

I think if you ask around there will be an equal percentage of happy/unhappy at private or state.

I agree with flourandeggs about friednship groups.

ds switched groups twice in year 7, then again in year 9 and finally in year 10 or 11 found a really good group of friends that he is still friends with now.

dd1 is in year 11, she told me that she didn't really find her group until year 8, when she finally fell in with some nice kids. They have stayed a pretty strong group.

dd2 is year 8, so they only had 2 terms to try and go through that friendship exploration. She didn't feel as if she had a group going into lockdown. Got friendly with one girl in her class via social media dn then when school restarted in Sept, fell out with her. She has really struggled through sept-dec as she wasn't friends with anyone in her class and they were in tutor group bubbles. Finally she has started to make some connections. Now they are shut down again.

and the period thing. dd2 turns into a complete horror for a few days every month. She started in year 7, but I have only just connected her outrageous behaviour to her cylce, and I am now keeping a track so I can see when it is hormone based. It is a mix of misery and lashing out.

I got into a local Private school after winning a scholarship and it was fantastic.
Wasn’t bullied once, was never made to feel like the poor kid, no peer pressure and made some amazing friends who live all over the world now and I have had some great holidays going to visit them.
Just goes to show everyone’s experience is different

we should not stereotype any school or set of kids. It is not helpful.

I remember the head at our secondary school saying at a parents talk the first week of year 7 not to worry too much about the first few years of friendship groups (easy to say less easy to do!) “we’ve seen it all before” he said “year after year. Eventually after lots of wiggling they find their friendship path” My year 9 is testament to this - she is happier in her own skin this year and you can almost see that physically - posture less hunched, smiles more, engages with us and teachers more, is excited about the world again. She has worked out the ‘mean girls’ and how to deal with them (arms length, don’t provoke unless you have to stick up for a friend) she has worked out the ‘friends for a week and move on’ type and can enjoy them but not expect life long commitment from them, and she has found a little group of like minded friends - they have had issues of course but they like each other enough to sort them out and move on. I am always adamant they don’t use the ‘best friend’ word as it only seems to cause them heartbreak, I say keep it as wide as you can, have lots of friends from clubs outside school (hard at the moment) your old primary friends and don’t put all your eggs in one basket. I also say to all my girls that female friendship is a life time of learning, even granny struggles sometimes with feeling FOMO and hurt by friends! I certainly haven’t got it nailed yet but am learning about myself in friendships all the time. I am worried I have stereotyped friendships in this post and not everyone fits in to these categories and actually I think one of the loveliest things in the world can be when someone we think of as fitting in to one of our own internal stereotypes surprises us... the ‘mean girl’ who isn’t mean at all, but desperately insecure and clinging to her ‘meanness’ as a piece of armour and who we finally understand. Finding out other people are 3 dimensional and not 2 dimensional is one of life’s wonders. One more hormone anecdote...my daughter started her period in year 8 and it has taken her cycles a year to settle down and now she is more confident, happier, calmer ... she also knows to give her friends a break the week before their period or during it, and tries not to take any snipping to heart if it might be hormone induced!

@SJaneS49. Hope you are ok you said you had a tough day. You are always a good voice of reason and a reminder to me not to stereotype, I do fall in to that trap sometimes as a defence mechanism when state school kids are stereotyped. Basically we are all blessed to have children, to live in a country where we have options, where vaccinations will be free and sooner rather than later and where our children can have the expectations of good lives. I often come away from these threads thinking we all want the same thing - happy healthy children, and what a shame we are divided as we are all intrinsically the same and our kids are the same. Thanks for the reminder to keep it ‘nice’ on here. @Diddlysquatty I think all parents in all spheres of education question their decisions occasionally, it’s part of the brief! You sound so lovely and thoughtful I think your daughter will be just fine whatever you decide as you ‘have her back’ as my teen would put it! I hope 2021 gives you and your daughter many more smiles.

I got in to a local private school after winning a scholarship.

It was the worst time of my life.

Bullied by both teachers and other pupils relentlessly. If your face/clothes/accent doesn’t fit neither will you. To this day I am annoyed that I didn’t expose them, some of my teachers school reports were full of appalling classism.

Strangely enough I did go on to a ‘prestigious’ university and people were much nicer, my ‘poor ness’ didn’t seem to matter anymore.

Is anyone happy in year 8 though? Am mid 40s and looking back the first 3 years of secondary a low spot of my life and I was fine at school generally. Being13 is pretty shit for everyone.

Honestly, maybe some aspects of the semi rural and play a part, I imagine it's harder to meet up with friends etc but we live in London and within a 3 mile radius have 10 secondary schools. You get the one you're closest to and pray you're not in a black spot. Even with an EHCP it's hard to get into the good ones, many kids appeal for spaces and most people who want schools that fit their kids are either lucky, pass a grammar, move or pay.

And having just read all your posts now I can see that actually you are already encouraging her to branch out of this rather catty little group! Is there any chance she could move class? I appreciate Covid and Bubbles would rather complicate that as an option potentially though.

Added onto all the Covid rollercoaster our Year 8s have had, throw in the hormonal changes too and changes in body shape. This is a tough age for girls! DD2 is currently wearing huge hoodies and jumpers as she is desperately uncomfortable with the fact she’s developing a chest. The first set of girls she was friendly with she compared herself unfavourably with as they were image conscious and popular. Her new friends are definitely geekier and more her. Basically, i think they’re all at six’s and sevens with themselves, who they are and where they fit.

Apologies OP, it’s been a tough day and perhaps I’m feeling more strident than usual - I do find the arguments that one type of school produces a type or a guaranteed happier/more successful ultimately better child a bit tiresome. We’ve chosen State as that’s what we felt was best for our child and we don’t regret it but how happy any child is
can’t be simplified into ‘State’ or ‘Private’ . but you obviously know that.

I’ve a Year 8 DD too and can completely understand your dilemma. Essentially they only had 2 terms of Year 7 before lockdown, a big gap and yet more time off now. DD’s friends from Year 7 she didn’t particularly like or feel she had much in common with. Like your DD the academic side isn’t an issue. She took the decision at the start of Year 8 to ask her bus friend if she could instead mix with her and her friends, broke away from her original group and has subsequently been a lot happier, they are just more her type of people. So perhaps the solution if your daughter isn’t feeling confident in herself is for her to break away from this toxic little group & explore other friendships rather than the more drastic change of schools? It sounds like you have been proactive about this all and the school have been helpful and responsive too? DD1 (aged 26) did flit across a number of social groups at Secondary till she found her people. Friendships are far from static at this age. Best wishes with whatever you decide - it’s an impossible thing to know at school selection stage if you are making the right choice but perhaps give DD a little more time (and if she is still unhappy after the end of the Year, look at moving her then).

I have no advice re the private school as my Y8 DD is in a state and not moving. However, she, and a lot of her friends are miserable at the moment. It is constant tears, she had her 12th birthday in quarantine and will probably have her 13th too, she has quit all her dance, drama and one instrument as she couldn't bear the online lessons. There are no practical lessons in any schools I know of and the only thing she has kept up with marginally is Art. I got rid of all social media and laptop and she seems to be better now but its a really really hard time for a lot of kids at the moment and I wouldn't really be moving my child now to be honest, as it is hard to know exactly what the source of unhapiness is.
If the school was working pre Covid I would stick it out and revisit once this is all over, especially as a lot of the value in private is small classes and extra curricular, which they won't be benefitting from now. She is also unlikely to get as many options for GCSE's as she would in a bigger school.

Indeed .. so perhaps time to drop stereotypes and generalisations of all kind

That would mean deleting 70% of this thread. So much spite.

@MrsMiaWallis
“ More drugs, more mental health issues, more eating disorders.

But heaven forbid you say that your dds state school friends spend too much time on their phones hmm”.

Indeed .. so perhaps time to drop stereotypes and generalisations of all kind.

For those who haven’t been in Tier 4 for weeks (and what feels like months)you mean @MsTSwift!

Mind you, judging by the groups of teenagers I still spot out at least once a day when I walk the dog, perhaps it won’t make much of a difference to their plans for some of them.