Can someone explain ISEB to me?

@NNat sorry I meant these are required CAT scores (rough guide given my the prep) which according to what Atom said on this webinar you are referring to would mean scores 10 points lower on Atom, which is why I felt somewhat reassured given the poor score DD got on Atom NVR mock test!

*tempted to register not attempted to register!

@stellagibbons that annoys me too, the 'absolutely no need to prepare' rhetoric. Maybe not, but we all know that virtually everyone WILL get DC to prepare!

@FlyingPandas I have to say, I'm watching what Alleyns are going to do - we may apply if they go to ISEB for that exact reason.

SCHS are saying that they will give the Maths & English elements of the ISEB more weight than the VR and NVR because they are aware that candidates may not be as familiar with those types of exercises (whilst in the same breath saying that no preparation is required). Plus the creative writing exercise and the Year 5 report. Although, I wonder how much use the Yr 5 reports are this year (ours was completely pointless).

I don't know about ATOM but for CATS my understanding is that anything 90-110 is average. For the indies we have been told roughly the following (for Surrey/SW London)

120-130 for selective (ie KGS)
130 - 135 for very selective (ie Hampton/LEH)
135 + for super selective (ie Tiffin boys/girls)

But how that actually plays out in practice, I don't know. The schools we are applying to have both said they will also use school references and interviews (whether face to face or virtual) and that those will play a part in the offer process too as well as the ISEB scores.

I wonder whether there will now be a flurry of additional applications to other schools who have stated they will use ISEB, given that DC only have to take the test once regardless of how many schools they are applying to? Usually parents are put off by making DC do too many sets of exams, so will limit to three or four assessment days on average. But if it's one day's assessment regardless then parents may be attempted to register for more!

Hopefully CATs since that would jell with what I wrote (itself taken from what Atom says!)

That's reassuring @NNat
Our prep said the selective London school are looking for scores ? 120-125+ and for the super selective it's more 130-135+

I understand that it works like this: 100 is the average score among the cohort (largely from a pool of prep school kids or those already top of their year, which is why they are considering the Iseb). A mark of 115+ is a good aim for the super selective London indies. 135+ would be top of the very top stuff (scholarship level at top indie).

How are your DC finding the ISEB mock tests on Atom, especially the NVR? We've just taken a subscription and her first NVR score was pretty appalling Above average but far off the 125-135/140 range I have been told she should be aiming for and she is getting in the other subjects (VR, maths, English). To be fair NVR has never been her strength (there has always been a noticeable difference between her VR scores and NVR scores) but I must admit I looked at some of the questions and found some of them were not straightforward (and I particularly enjoy NVR ). It was quite late at night after a busy weekend, let's hope she improves her scores...

Thank you Happy.

Allied to this: is there anything to be gained by going quickly? Eg harder questions, or an increased mark for answering x questions in fewer minutes (even if mistakes are made)? Thanks for any help!

No you can't go back. Yes it's a set number. Once completed you are done with the test.

For example; in maths you have 50 minutes to complete 36 questions. If you complete the 36 questions before the 50 minutes is up, you are finished with time to spare.

Hello, I have questions! I understand you can’t go back to check answers... is that right?

Second, are there a set number of questions per subject (e.g. 30 for maths) or are the questions endless (so if you answer fast, you get more questions)?

Thank you for any help!

We are state school and DD has ISEB pretest next week!

We have subscribed to ATOM and she's spent the last four months using ATOM for learning and doing Mock tests. Timing is more than adequate, she always completes with time to spare. The key is if after a few minutes she can't work it out then move on. It's all multiple choice and once you've answered all the questions you're done.

She's doing best at NVR; codes, cubes and patterns seem to click with her.

It is a standard aged score so like SATS scores are aligned to actual age so one person's score isn't directly comparable (someone younger could get the same result with less questions correct). We've not gone mad with practice nor mocks but being familiar with the questions and especially with English finding the words has taken time to sink in. Will she pass? No idea. Mock results vary from a score of 102 to 110 (100 being average ability). The school have not specified what the pass rate is (not highly selective) but we've told her it's ok to try and fail. We're really proud she's giving it a go and we have plenty of good state secondary options so this won't change her life.

I'm wondering about this: DD is registered for Latymer Upper and we got the email about the switch to ISEB today. I'll be delighted if the other schools she's registered for make the same choice, the thought of having Christmas unmarred by exam prep is wonderful!

If sources are correct I believe there are updates from numerous Selective schools this week. Whilst I can appreciate the safety and simplicity of logistics of adopting the ISEB, I dread the weight being placed on children for one test day. I would feel somewhat better knowing they could go back and check questions, or at least have two attempts at the Test.

How after all these years the schools have opted for their own exam to now rely fully on ISEB.

Sorry...got cut off.

Extensive months of tutoring are not required but a few sessions to familiarise with the styles of NVR questions a nd learn to work in tight time conditions are very worthwhile.

All of these kind of tests such as ISEB, CEM Midyis or Cats say you can't prepare but in reality you can to an e tent.

A child who has never seen NVR puzzles before nor worked in timed conditions will be disadvantaged compared to a child who has learned to work in timed conditions and learned some skills for tackling NVR etc.

I take the view that extensive months of tutoring are not

Neither of the schools we've applied to that have moved to ISEB have mentioned that we only need to sit it once (we're state applicants). Unfortunately, both are January dates, so no 11+ free Christmas for us!

Alleyns is still saying usual entrance exams apply - if they do move to ISEB I'm tempted to give it a go as it won't be any extra work.

@Stircrazyschoolmum DS is registered to sit for RGS and Hampton, and we received emails confirming the ISEB information from both schools today. My guess is that all the schools who have agreed this approach will be contacting parents this week, if they haven’t already. And as @Oceane11Plus says, schools will want to be seen as being as fair and flexible under the circumstances. Both emails made the point of acknowledging the disrupted y5 for all students, wanting to minimise anxiety and so on.

@Stircrazyschoolmum I think it's just a matter of time before they announce they will be dropping the written exam in favor of the ISEB or CEM pre tests. Otherwise it's a big risk they would be taking as it would effectively be betting on January being back to normal without much need for social distancing, given the cheer number of applicants to both schools in particular. Perhaps more importantly I'm not sure they will want to be singled out as being seen as unflexible in the current circumstances and potentially exposing applicants (and their families) to health hazard.

Yep we’re in this situation too, I think it’s about the most sensible thing they could have done under the circumstances tbh (though I take the point that if dc has an off day when taking the ISEB then that could be an issue if they can only take it once).

We are state too and dc definitely do online maths and English assessments each year which seem similar.

And a definite plus is the fact that they’ll be done by Christmas!