Winchester, St. Paul's, or Eton?

St Paul’s does offer boarding and we seriously considered it but then and I’m pretty sure now it only had a very small number of boarders about 30 when we looked at it, the vast majority were in the 6th form. I’m not saying it’s not an option for your DS it would offer more flexibility for both of you especially if you lived close by, you can for example take your DS out for dinner or to the opera/theatre in the evenings in the weekday and of course he could come home every weekend but unlike Eton or Winchester it isn’t a 24/7 boarding school with all that entails. Those we spoke to at the school never claimed that the school offered the same ethos environment opportunities that a full boarding school does. I’m not saying it’s not an amazing school or that it doesn't have fantastic facilities and opportunities but when the vast majority will have gone home by 16 30-1700 at the latest your DS’s boarding experience will just not be the same as that which he would get at a school like Eton or Winchester. The staff were very keen that we understood that St Paul’s is a “day school with boarders” as opposed to a boarding school. Secondly the vast majority of scholars come from the junior school so you would definitely need a back up plan if your DS was unsuccessful in getting a scholarship.
I’m curious to know why your prep school head hasn’t suggested Westminster? It has more boarders that SPS.
You don’t say if your DS already has a place at any of the above or anywhere else for that matter as I said before competition for scholarships at all three is very fierce and it’s not a done deal however bright your DS might be. I think generally most boys only prepare for one school as well and I’ve got it in my head although maybe incorrectly that Winchester and maybe the others do require some sort of pre test to stop boys sitting it who haven’t got a hope in hell of getting it. Again your prep school if they know what they are talking about should be able to advise you on which scholarship exam would suit your DS best and if any pre testing is required.

OP you had a similar thread last year, your DS was in year 5 then despite being ‘11 turning 12’. If you have a genuine question about these schools, the relevance of any views that others can post will depend on your DS’s real age and year.

"We're in the same boat, because I don't need anything from you either!"

Yes, you do need me to tell you that you're a hypocrite and an actor! One who appears here on false pretences asking about 3 schools whilst clearly your mind is already made up on one long ago.

Why ask about St Paul's and Eton when your heart is set on Winchester?

Why ask about St Paul's when you're specifically looking for an all-boys boarding public school education?

To quote a poster upthread, "If you're already at a prep school you should already know all you need to know about the relative merits of the public schools in question."

There were at least 3 other posters - including YOURSELF - who talked about politics even before I had seen this thread. So what's your big idea about telling us Addington, a Tory Prime Minister who went to WinColl?

"I would love to hear your thoughts on the schools in question."

Right from my very first posting, and subsequenly, I had given more than enough on the school I know best, Eton, which you did ask about in your OP. It's just that you refused to listen and see because your mind is already made up.

Oooh OP you are being really horrid to posters on this thread, and you will find that bitesyou as it makes others like me who know these schools think why should we bother help?

"whereas Win Coll has a stiff, awkward rep."
Does it? Ive seen many comments about Winchester over the years both positive and negative but a "stiff awkward rep" I don't recall seeing regularly if at all.
I agree with Witchlight choose the one that suits you and feels right, we felt comfortable at Winchester we liked the staff the relaxed ethos the focus on academia, the boys we met, choosing your HM and registering with a house, the importance of the HM at Winchester, the lengthy personal admissions process etc we just. didn't feel the same at Eton other friends hated Winchester they couldn't see what they were "buying into" one said. others friends hated both and chose somewhere else.
Look at all three with an open mind.

Not all students get much out of art, drama and sport. Eton send very few to Oxbridge in STEM subjects. This thread alone would put many prospective parents off Eton! Realistically this is a disadvantage of all boarding schools and you would ideally want to allow your son to have as much choice as possible - being forced to engage in a very particular range of sports if he doesn't enjoy it will be hell. Much better he has the space and opportunity to actually discover his passions and pursue them.

I think reading this board should give you a good idea of where you want your son to go.

You can look at the pro Etonian posters and what they espouse. Are they measured, liberal and generally give a balanced view?

Look at the pro Winchester parents and apply the same criteria.

Who do you want your son to be like? Who do you want to meet up with for the next 5 years 🙂

Both schools select academically able boys and provide them with the environment to thrive. Both schools provide a good, but different flavour of soft skills. Both sets of boys will swear that their school is the best (as will the parents) for all the reasons that are most important to them. It is why they chose the school.

I (and my son) chose Winchester. It was right for us in a way Eton wouldn’t have been. DS knows lots of boys who chose Eton, they are all lovely, well balanced boys. He obviously knows even more from Winchester, who are equally lovely - but they “fit” him better. It’s not surprising they do. That is why you are unlikely to get the sort of answer you want on this forum, but it will give a good guide to where to go.

Eton is far better. Winchester is socially cut off from other schools and far too little emphasis is placed on sports and drama, art etc. There's a reason why Eton's got 20 PMs. It's cool but not socially very pressured compared to other places, whereas Win Coll has a stiff, awkward rep. Just seems Eton develops everything else far more.
St Pauls if London Day is what you want - they are two very different things to sign your son up to. Boarding's not for everyone - I'd make sure it was completely his choice either way. There are benefits of boarding but these can easily be lost if one really hates it.
Make sure he rly wants to board or is pretty keen on it and don't go for Winchester.

Well, PerditaPE, some people just because they think they are the OP feel bloody entitled and empowered to block another poster who has every right to post what that's really their own opinions. Particularly when they are actually responding to some earlier comments posted by some others regarding the directions old boys of particular schools take after leaving school.

Tell you what, OP, you should really thank your lucky star and feel honoured that I had given you some of my precious time today by writing those few messages as I really, absolutely do not need to because I do not need anything from you.

(Point of order OP - unless you're an MN mod you can't actually block anyone from posting on a thread.)

PGWo obviously there are some personalities at all these schools that may have a tendency to bullying but the pastoral care should keep that under control if used properly. IME Winchester staff certainly prioritise kindness and tolerance and I am sure the same is true of the others.
One comment from my DS, developing skill in banter is key to feeling part of it and enjoying it rather than a target of mockery. I think at all these schools the boys are pretty articulate and rapid thinkers and the style of banter reflects this.

"Like producing just 1 PM in 300 years vs 20, you mean?"
This may come as a shock to you but it's not just PM's who need to be exceedingly competitive I work with very competitive people (some I find very trying) on daily basis none have set a toe in Eton and some are about as sporty as an ironing boards but they seem to be climbing the greasy pole very successfully and as I say I'm not totally convinced being exceedingly competitive is always a desirable quality. Still everyone to their own.
OP go and look at the three schools they each offer something different, dont be overly swayed by the views of others we aren't all looking for the same thing, ask lots of searching questions and try and choose one that you feel will suit your DS and you.

"Now he dreams of being a Cambridge don. Last week he wanted to be a detective."

What makes you so sure he wouldn't want to be Chancellor or PM in 30 years time?

"And I want to add that all schools seem to have problems with bullying to a greater or lesser degree."

I see what you mean and dare I say, I might even agree with it. But as far as Eton is concerned, it's good to understand how the school is organised, its general ethos and attitude, etc. You're right to say it's a large school, in fact, the largest British public/private school. But with almost 600 years experience under its belt, the school is run like a well-lubricated and finely-tuned machine.

Although large, the 25 boarding houses are run, managed and organised in a similar way throughout with perhaps the exception of College. Each house has a similar number of boys - around 50'ish [College= 70] and similar number (of boys) from each yearly cohort. Each house has its own flag/colours etc and the boys are fiercely loyal to their own house. Effectively, the 25 houses are like 25 small individual schools scattered around the Eton village.

But it must be said, traditionally College is the only house that all the other 24 Oppidan houses would like to beat in all the activities. Rather like England is the only country that the rest of the world would like to beat in all competitions. But all this is done in a friendly and genuinely spirited manner; even the "bullying" bit when certain boys may be taking the mickey of a certain boy or even group of boys for a very short period of time; all done in a jovial and good-hearted manner. But be sure the "compliments" would be reciprocated in due course. I've actually seen with my own eyes how DS (physically a big fellow) being taken the mickey of by a group of very small boys - all for a laugh. DS just smiled the whole episode away totally unperturbed.

"I don't believe that sport is where you learn to be competitive (or that it's a particularly attractive trait) or where Boris et. al. learn their trade, I know plenty of non sports players who are exceedingly competitive so have obviously learnt somewhere elsewhere."

Like producing just 1 PM in 300 years vs 20, you mean?

"the bullying? It hardly exist!"
I think this is about of a rash statement bullying exists everywhere in school work clubs etc. Also what one person brushes off as harmless bit of fun another feels is bullying (no criticism of either intended). I remember once a deputy head at a boys prep once saying to me boys push jostle roll on each other usually its just harmless fun but sometimes they overstep the line between fun and unkindness often unintentionally and sometimes intentionally, it take a clever person to sort which one it is and then deal with it appropriately. As they get older boys "banter" amongst each other most of the time its harmless and the person doesn't mind but other times its not. It's inevitable if boys live together in a boarding house that this will take place (as it does between siblings at home), a good HM who has good grip of what is going on his in boarding house will again be able to see the difference between unintentional unkindness and deliberate nastiness and act accordingly.

Winchester didn't when my DS was there (don't know what happens now) have a major and minor sport this is great for the non team player because you can choose fro a huge variety of sports one that slightly appeals to you and do it to the level that suits you.
"when you say your son doesn't like sports which is exactly where one learns to be competitive. This is where all the Boris Johnsons, Duke of Wellingtons, etc learn their trade!"
I don't believe that sport is where you learn to be competitive (or that it's a particularly attractive trait) or where Boris et. al. learn their trade, I know plenty of non sports players who are exceedingly competitive so have obviously learnt somewhere elsewhere.
Lastly yes the stats show that if you're an aspiring DS PM then may need to go to Eton to be in with a good chance but personally I wouldn't wish that job my worst enemy but it's everyone to their own.

Eton is large, at 1,300 pupils. Also very spaced out, like an entire village. I recommend you visit it before applying.

Winchester is smaller at 670 pupils and far more compact than Eton. I personally would prefer this.

St. Paul's Boys' only has very limit boarding capacity and probably also has fewer facilities for boarders.

I have to emphasise that sport seems to be a very important part of the curriculum at most boarding schools and I think it's unlikely your son would be exempted. A local state school is far more likely to be flexible in this regard.

And I want to add that all schools seem to have problems with bullying to a greater or lesser degree. The problem with a boarding school is that there are more opportunities for bullying to take place and it's harder to parents to get involved to prevent it's escalation.

"....no Chancellor of the Exchequer came from Eton..."

OK, I did note you also said in the past 40 years but the headline message and the gist of it is misleading, to say the least.

Of course, there had been many OE's who were Chancellors of the Exchequer in the past - at least half-a-dozen or more: Walpole, Grenville, North, Canning, Gladstone, Randolf Churchill and Macmillan, etc. Most of these gentlemen went on to become Prime Minister, of course.

"It looks like you can be groomed to be a PM...but not way you can pull it off if you don't have what it takes to be a Chancellor. Thanks god some things in this world are more than merit than privilege..that tells you the profile a bit.... just saying."

We know what you're insinuating but please be assured privilege alone won't get you everything you want. Boris Johnson didn't exactly get to where he is today just because he's "privileged". He was challenged all the way through last July when Theresa May resigned as PM. And again in December but this time on a national scale in a general election. The Premiership wasn't exactly handed down to him on a silver plate.

Oh, btw, modern Etonians are much smarter than you think - who wants to be 'The Chancellor' when you can be his boss?

OK, jokes aside, but OP, given your circumstances I think by concentrating more on the Eton King's Scholarship is the best way forward for your child. I've discounted St Paul's because it's not a traditional full boarding boys public school that you want. WinColl is just too inward looking. Only thing I'm worried is that Eton is too competitive when you say your son doesn't like sports which is exactly where one learns to be competitive. This is where all the Boris Johnsons, Duke of Wellingtons, etc learn their trade!

And no, I'm not worried about the academics, bullying, etc at Eton at all. Academics, you just have to refer to the last few years league tables to see where Eton stands; and the bullying? It hardly exist!

Ah. Well, in that case, OP, I'd suggest you concentrate on the general application process (assuming you're well on the way with these) and see if your son is offered a conditional place in the normal way. He'll then work towards the yr 8 scholarship exams alongside his peers.