GCSE options

@jackstini: To be honest, following the GCSE reforms of the last couple of years, there aren't really any easy options. They are mostly based entirely on an exam or two and require a lot of rote learning. Welcome to a meaningful education courtesy of Mr Gove!

Following as dd due to pick options and currently thinking Geography, History & German. Still deciding between triple/double science or another option

We have an options evening in a few weeks so will be asking lots of questions then about coursework vs exam etc.

She is academic but I am concerned it's a lot of work...

Pleasure @pisspants. One last thing I will say is that the school should have a careers advisor (sometimes of varying quality, but hey ho) who can help out, or the subject teachers of course.

Thought I'd post here and try to offer some help. Up until recently I was a Science and Maths teacher. While teaching I have also been a head of Physics and 2ic of a Science department with some input on combined vs triple, foundation vs higher papers and so on, so thought you might find what I have to say interesting. This will probably be a long post, so I'll put a TLDR below for those who don't want to read the whole thing.

TLDR: If your child is really into and good at Science, triple is the way to go. For everyone else, combined will do fine.

1. I did combined Science when I was at school in the early naughties because my school did not offer triple science. I then went on to do A-levels in both Chemistry and Physics, get a first class integrated masters in Physics and a PhD in Space Physics. Not saying this to brag, but to illustrate that you can go to University with either even to study a Science subject. People aren't snooty about it in my experience.

2. Triple Science does prepare the student a bit better for A-level as it covers more content, however the skills used can often be quite different. For example, in Physics at GCSE students have to memorise a long list of equations; at A-level they are given them in a formula booklet. Go figure. This is true for both combined and triple.

3. How does your school timetable triple science? Some don't give it extra lessons and just expect the students to work faster. This means the student has to be good at the subject to start with. It sounds like your school does allow more timetable space, which is great, but comes with two downsides. Firstly, it will take the place of another subject. If your child really wants to do the other subject, then triple may not be the best for them. Secondly, it means your child will spend a LOT of time in a science classroom; torture if they don't like the subject. From the sounds of it, Science isn't your child's main passion, so I would recommend combined. Neither option is easy though.

4. On the subject of languages, yes if your child can (and is willing) to do one, that would be great. However, if not then don't force them. Doing a subject that they don't enjoy tends to have a predictably disappointing result. As an aside, to the people asking why languages are not taught as much in schools anymore in the UK, MFL (modern foreign language) is a shortage subject. This means that there aren't enough teachers to go around. The result is that schools often end up cutting on the amount of it offered. Science is in a similar boat, which brings me on to...

5. How well staffed is your school Science department? Is it full of experienced, enthusiastic teachers, or (as with many science departments in the country) is it full of inexperienced staff with a high turnover? Like MFL, Science is a shortage subject. Unlike MFL however, it is also compulsory. This means that there are a lot of bad science teachers out there and a lot of understaffed departments. If your school has a well staffed Science department, then happy days. If not, they will tend to put the best staff with triple science (because they want that extra GCSE for the department/school statistics) and those classes where the students are borderline grade 4 (old C grade), again because of stats. More on that in a moment. Not sure how this helps you decide between then exactly, but worth bearing in mind.

6. Right, pathways. The idea of a pathway is that you have a group of subjects put together so that they have a common flavour. For example, at one school I worked at we had the academic pathway (intended for the brightest students), technical pathway (aimed at those looking towards engineering, btec, vocational training etc) and the arts pathway (everyone else). The advantages from a school's perspective are basically threefold. Firstly it eases timetabling. Believe it or not, but in the 21st century there are still schools that assign some poor schmuck each year to make the timetable by hand. This is as tedious and difficult as it sounds. Made all the harder because these days staff changing is common and so are timetable changes. One September we have about 3 timetable changes before the students had even come back from their summer holidays. Secondly, it makes the process much easier to understand. You (as the school) recommend a certain set of subjects for a student to pick from rather than the whole range. This tries to avoid the situation where you have a kid on a subject clearly unsuitable for them (it doesn't solve this problem at all, but some claim it can...they're wrong IMO). Finally, it makes it easier for the school to manipulate which subjects students take, allowing them to spread teaching duties more evenly among staff and try to put students onto subjects they are more likely to do well at. This might sound sinister and manipulative (and it is) but try not to be too harsh on schools. They operate in an environment where they are judged on the number of students who get a grade 4+ at GCSE (old C grade) and if there aren't enough, people's jobs are on the line. Little Timmy choosing to do Business Studies instead of the Drama the school wanted and bombing out can literally be the difference between a head keeping their job or not. Education has become a rather cut throat world. If you find your child on a pathway they don't like, my advise as a parent is to dig your heels in; the school will usually relent if the timetable permits. Just don't judge the school too harshly for it; many of them are just trying to survive in the modern education landscape. Notice I said at the beginning that I USED to be a teacher.

Anyway, sorry for the wall of text and I hope at least some of it was useful to someone.

Ds1 did combined science, there is no room on the timetable for triple so the student is expected to do all the extra work at home. Doing the combined meant he aced it with a 9,9 and now does physics A level.

He said that a lot of the other A level students have done triple but my son is not struggling at all. I think the issue with A levels isn't to do with whether you did the combined or the triple but the grade you achieved.

Obviously if you are sitting the triple then school expect you to do well in it. The minimum required grade for any of the sciences at A level is usually a 6 as a general rule of thumb.

Re universities looking at GCSEs, only Oxford actually consider your GCSEs, Cambridge want you to sit an entrance exam ie STEP for maths. Cambridge felt very strongly that attitude to learning is best demonstrated through AS level results, as these have now been scrapped their entrance test came in. This is information I have gained from MN.

Ds1's predicted grades for A level were based on his GCSEs so his grades are high. His friends only put effort into those subjects that they were going to take at A level, so they got 9s in maths/science/History etc but 6s in English and French. Surely if you are looking at grades then their A levels will reflect a better idea of how well they are doing.

Re work load, History GCSE is heavy, as is Geography. They tried to persuade Ds2 he could take both but he had seen the volume of work for History from his brother so it was a no from him.

Re language. We tend to hate the things we are not good at. Ds2 was asked at parents' evening if he had done French at primary school. No not really but he does do a language app daily and has done since year 7. HTH.

Or some Physiotherapy degrees also accept PE A level rather than biology. Point is, she doesn't need to do triple.

If she wants to do sport later at degree level then A level PE is fine for most unis. A level PE and A level Psychology are often accepted instead of a more traditional science. There's more human biology in PE A level than there is in Biology A level!

My ds did history and geography GCSE and didn't find the workload a problem (and he definitely not a hard working studious type, he winged it). He did double science as he knew he didn't want to do A level sciences from early on and because he wanted an easy life. If you have an interest in, and an aptitude for, science, I think it is worth making the effort to do the triple. But as others have said, it's not a requirement.

Student here. I did triple science, art, and French alongside Further Mathematics as my non-compulsory subjects. I went in to the GCSE years hating all my sciences, but my family insisted that I did them. Despite this, I still ended up really enjoying my GCSE Triple Science years, even if there was a lot of time spent in the classroom.
Personally, and from what I've heard of my peers, there isn't THAT much of a work gap in between Double and Triple. Triple isn't necessarily easy, but if you have a decent work ethic, it's not difficult to come out with three good grades. Most of my peers only did Double because they really wanted to do something else; but unless she has a desire to do something really badly, I'd do Triple Science. It looks good on UCAS forms, and it's easier to jump from GCSE Biology to A Level Biology than from Double Award to A Level.
But, unis don't really look at GCSEs as much they do A-Levels, which is something to keep in mind. You can easily do Double Award and still go down a sport science career path. I just think not having the GCSE Biology may make it harder when she hits A-Level (happens a lot in my school - DA kids do A-Levels in science and then drop out because they can't handle the workload due to gaps in their knowledge from GCSE).

Science teacher here. If she enjoys music and wants to do it she should. Triple science is more work than double, but if she's still undecided about what she wants to do then keeping her options open is great. Completing double science instead of triple won't stop her continuing with science at a higher level in the future if that's what she decides.

As for triple or double science - if she is not very strong academically i would go for the double. The jump to GCSE is huge. My twins are academically very strong and can't believe the difference!

A lot of people say GCSE'S don't matter when applying for uni but i am certainly aware of a fair few who lost out on their first choice; the course was over-subscribed so the uni looked at their GCSE'S and offered places only to those who had a language even though it wasn't a requirement. Also know someone who didn't meet the required grades but was accepted because they had a language at GCSE. If she is capable she should do it - learning a language is a great skill which will help in later life.

Another thread with DC hating languages. How do we get to this regrettable position? Everyone should take a language. We are ridiculously insular. How is any child doing Business Studies and Engineering pre GCSE? I am confused. GCSEs should be broad. I understand no one cares about languages but it is perfectly possible to study them if you work at them.

Hi! Definitely talk to the school - it'll be in his best interest to pick subjects he enjoys so that he'll be more likely to study and get good grades. I don't think it is particularly fair to dictate what choices each child has but some schools do. I'd be shocked if the school doesn't change their minds about his option choices if you make a good case as to why he shouldn't take a language. The only restrictions we had (I did GCSEs in June) was history or geography and then a BTEC option.

Hope everything works out!

Hi there! I sat my GCSEs in June and got a 98 in combined science. Universities and colleges will not discriminate against double vs triple at GCSE and most unis don't consider GCSEs at all (some top unis may use maths and English grades if they're not taken at A Level). My school didn't offer it - I'm sure I wouldn't have picked it anyway as I would have preferred to broaden my options a bit more by choosing another subject. If she is significantly worse at a particular science then perhaps triple would be good, she'd only need to do well in biology as opposed to all three sciences to get into college.

Whatever she decides, just make sure you're both aware of how stressful GCSEs can be and how much content there is in all the subjects so you can plan ahead.

Good luck!

I teach at Avery academic school and lots of bright kids choose dual science to free up an extra choice. Really not an issue for uni either.

Yes he is very bright but has grades already off the chart in computer science, engineering and business studies, all the teachers at parents evening where saying how it would be stupid to not take these subjects but now it seems unless I can get them to change his pathway that he will have to choose two of the three he lives to do a language he really hates. It seems a shame if that’s the case, I have already told him I will speak to the school to ask but personally I don’t think they will let him not do a language

Op I think unless she loves science do the double. If she is thinking of a degree in sport science she will need a science A level most likely, but that is a major step up from GCSE. What sports related career is she thinking of? Google the subject and see what A levels they are looking for.
However, as much sense it makes to be mindful of eventual degrees and careers, she should do what she loves - does she love music? Universities like diversity too.
My daughter will most likely do art at degree level, but has a passion for science too and is doing triple science, but she had to forego computer science to do it. Also taking history, German, Art and Art Award as well as the math and English courses. I think she figured what interested her in computers might be covered in her Art Award (animation project).

My daughter had to make a similar decision and in the end went with double science, she is doing really well in it and is predicted a 7-7 but is working above at the moment. This gave her the opportunity to choose more options and she is glad she did as she is enjoying all of them, I think if she had chose triple it would have been too much science for her.

And psychology.

Sorry to jump in but I’m a bit worried now, my daughter is doing triple science, a MFL, geography and history as well as the usual.

Would they have said if it was too much? I would say she is fairly academic.

One of the things schools are measured on is the percentage of pupils who get the "EBacc" - which is good grades in Math/English/Science/a language/a humanity. Some schools therefore put a bit of pressure on those who are capable of getting it to do both a language and a humanity.

Do challenge it. If they try and tell you it's advisable for his sake, take that with a very large pinch of salt. I know a youngster whose school allowed her not to do it, because at the time she wanted to go into musical theatre, so she wanted to do drama and music. She changed her mind later, but Cambridge were happy to take her for law without the EBacc.

The only thing you might want to check is whether the pathway will affect the sets he ends up in for maths/science/etc. Hopefully not, but worth checking.

So they obviously think he is 'bright' as they have put him on the 'Ebacc' pathway.

If he gets 2 free choices how come he is stopped from doing something he is 'passionate' about? Can it not be one of his 2 free choices? Or are you saying that with that pathway that subject is just not permitted?

How flexible they will be depends on the school. Our school said everyone choosing to do triple science had to do a language, but it doesn't mandate pathways.