St Albans Boys or Watford Grammar Boys?

@Smilingapple It's habs vs QE boys for us. I wanted to accept grammar but I also don't want a childhood of pressure. My friends son is in Watford and they were happy. Distance wise it's same for us. I think I am worried about the pressure although he has done well without much tutoring. (We did do an hour a week in the last 6 months to focus on exam format but never had any pressure and took time off for holidays etc)

@redferrari

It's so difficult isn't it? I'm like yourself more towards Pvt, however DH is more leaning towards state. But my DS went to state primary so in terms of adjusting to bigger class etc he's fine. The state school we're considering is WBGS which feels like a private school in terms of facilities, clubs and teaching ethos. My DS doesn't have a preference and says he's happy with any school. But it's the small class size and the pastoral care that I'm in dilemma about. Also the overall calibre of the students is different too, as the state we are considering is partially selected not 100%. However majority of the non selected intake are through siblings and the extremely small catchment area of the school, where families are all bog standard middle-class. However it's hard to justify the fees for just that. Plus we've a younger son so the cost will be double. See? My heart says pvt but head says state. Do you have the same school options??

@Smilingapple I am in the same situation and I although I like the pvt option I can't bring myself to say no to the grammar option for so many reasons. My son has been in a private prep in primary and I can see the how much that has helped him (class sizes and extras). But the grammar option is highly sought after too.

Hi I know this thread is old but just wonder if you are happy with WBGS? Because now I'm in exactly the same situation and scratching my head! Thanks!

OP, glad you’ve made a decision.

@Cuddlysnowleopard - DH and I were talking about that exact question yesterday (post allocation day, and we also know a boy who got into St A school but not the top choices in the SW Herts consortium. I don’t think it’s posible to really compare - although St A does maths and verbal reasoning, they also have an English paper and “short interview”, then some boys get invited back for a round of group activities. They also audition for music, choral, art and sport scholarships.

WBGS just has the SW Herts consortium academic test and music test, and to be honest I think they are fairly blunt instruments in determining either aceademic or musical potential. So I can well see that the same child gets in to St A but not WBGS. I guess WBGS probably also has a far greater number of applicants per place. However, ultimately St A has really stellar academic results (presumably due to 100% selection, small classs etc) whereas WBGS has just excellent results.

Although as DH pointed out, what would be really interesting to know is the true added value each school provides in terms of teaching making boys exceed their potential - if you admit very clever boys you churn out very good results...

Once a decision is made it can be a huge relief. Hope he does really well and enjoys the next part of his educational journey (without the 2 hours a day commuting....!) Plus when it comes to study leave, snow days, being unwell etc,which happens at some stage to most kids, at least he won’t be reliant on coach timetables (or parents going to work late / leaving work early) to get home or to get to school for an afternoon exam having revised at home. I speak as one who had a DC in private education a coach ride away, and a DC at the local grammar down the road....

Good to know that you've made a choice.

Re: the selective element, I know boys who didn't get Watford Boys because their score was too low, but were offered St Albans and MT's which they were holding as reserve. If they'd been offered the Boy's, they definitely would have taken it.

Can only assume that Watford is harder to get into?

So glad you've come to a decision you're all happy with EmilyBingo, a friend of mine likened the process of changing school plans to "turning around a supertanker"! Hope your DS gets on really well at Watford.

St Albans is a good private school, Watford Grammar is an excellent state one. Wigeon makes a lot of really valid points here. £18k+ and 2hrs' journey a day? From an external perspective it's really hard to see why you would turn down WG when it's on your doorstep.

Hm, are you more Garston end or Croxley Green end? As you probably know, the traffic will be absolutely horrendous at school drop off /pick up times. Have you seen the St Albans Rd (in Watford) or Holywell Hill (in St A) at those times? A big traffic jam...Do you know anyone who does that journey and can say how long it def takes?

Watford Boys gets excellent results, but not as outstanding as St Albans. It’s heavily over-subscribed. Altho it’s 25% selective, the other places are 10% music, and almost all the rest siblings (who may well have got in on academic ability but don’t need to, because they’ve got a sibling at that school or the Girls’ Grammar) and distance. The distance maximum means you’ve got to live in the most expensive, nicest part of Watford, where a 3 bed is £800k+. So 25% selective is somewhat misleading, as the other 75% are by no means deprived kids from the local estate.

I have two boys at St Albans and our experience is that it is an exceptional school with excellent behaviour. We also thought carefully about the financial implications but felt at the time and also now, that private school would give our sons the confidence and edge that more mixed schools couldn’t. We feel that the investment in their future is relatively short-term but that it will help shape the rest of their life. Having said that, I know little about Watford boys but if they are only 25% selective then I can’t believe that they’re comparable.

APere - Watford Grammar isn’t a true Grammar as it’s only 25% selection on academic ability. But they have a huge, extensive extra-curricula programme, so it’s just not true to say that they are only about the academics, not sport and music etc.

I’m not sure how WGSB being an academy is a factor? That means they are responsible just to their governors, not the local authority, and have more freedom.

Re behaviour - I would be astounded if behaviour is better at St Albans school. Selection/intelligence does not automatically equate to good behaviour. WGSB is full of frankly middle class, well-brought-up young men. And altho only 25% is on the academic test, younger siblings are obviously from the same families, 10% are selected on musical aptitude, which IMO is largely a selection of socio-economic privilege too. An intelligent boy would thrive at WGSB.

Did you not visit both and get a sense of which you preferred? Do you think St Albans School offers £18,600 more value each year than Watford Grammar?

With private schools it’s not just the fees it’s the additional uniform costs including sports kit which can be more, the extra activities, the School trips, the travel to get there, the fact that his friends may live miles away from him and you will be the taxi service for him to meet up with them. I am not against private schools but Watford Grammar is a good school and still maintains a good reputation. FWIW my DC2 (many years ago now) got scholarships to a number of private schools for secondary but chose the grammar school on the basis it was the closest to home. There’s a lot to be said for not spending what amounts to several hours a week in the car or on the train commuting to school on top of the other considerations.

Ask your son which he prefers. His opinion must count too. I know about St Albans boys and that it is a fabulous school, though worth the money? Possibly it would open up a world of opportunities for him for the future.

If you’re not willing to spend the money, you could put that away for a deposit for his first property purchase in the future. It all depends how you think your ds will apply himself at Watford grammar. Whereas somewhere like St Albans boys it’ll be very involved, and full on. If he’s behind on a subject or there are any issues they will pick up on it quickly.

Where do you live? The commute between Watford and St Alban's is a pain. I think that would be a factor to me.

Watford Boys, yes there are the usual handful of troublemakers, same as any school. But enough hardworking students to level it out, imo.

Which did your son like best?

Sometimes, I hate to say it, I think children from private schools get preferential treatment when it comes to grad schemes in the city...
Categorically not true at the top firms in the City. Possibly true for private wealth management jobs where the people you know drives business.

Please excuse the typo’s - going to private school myself has obviously only given me no attention to detail!

Exactly! I’d go for Watford Grammar. And as for private schools giving their pupils an extra edge, that honestly depends on where they want to go in life! They get good advice in terms of what Uni’s to go for but he’lol get that at Watford too. I’ve worked as Recruiter for over 20 years, I don’t recruit for City jobs we’re going to a Public School would help. Conversely in the sectors I work in, a privileged background is often down played to fit in culturally. What Uni you go too though with various of my clients matters though & on that basis both would set him up well!

And siblings of children from families who want the best education for their children and who are prepared enough to tutor at least the eldest and distance .... of children’s who live within about 200 metres of leafy cassiobury where houses go for nearly £1m. I wouldn’t give too much concern. The children at both schools will be broadly similar