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Original poster

Controversial Behaviour Policy changes

366 replies

Chattonnoire · 16/09/2018 15:05

I am looking to get some insight into the changes taking places at a number of Free Schools, especially London, that have been making dramatic changes to Behaviour Policy since Michaela Community School made headlines as being the strictest school in Britain:

time.com/5232857/michaela-britains-strictest-school/

metro.co.uk/2017/09/11/britains-strictest-school-bans-pupils-from-looking-out-the-window-and-smirking-6917747/

www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/13422769.The_secrets_of_Magna_Academy_s_transformation__Students_who_walk_silently_between_lessons/

I noticed, that the comments at the end of these articles were mostly negative from parents and students in these schools, and don't appear to be in line with the "hard sell" the schools are making it out to be.

The impression is that teachers are asserting control over the difficult and disruptive students at the expense of the rest; the average student is muted in these "silent transitions" to and from classes and expressed feeling unhappy and the environment oppressive and weird.

None of the students have the authority to question the new policy, too afraid of being given 90 minutes detentions on the same day regardless of any commitments they may have (Medical or Sporting...at the expense of either their health missing long awaited NHS appointments or financial loss for missed activities to lower income families, as many students on free school meals) for often arbitrary and minor and low level disruptions such as is listed on many of these schools behaviour policies.

So they are being taught not to learn any assertiveness, question authority at any point, to conform, never to speak out, contest or oppose injustice, and may in fact have long lasting emotional and psychological negative impact on these teen developing minds in the real world, where they may not be able to defend themselves from unfair treatment from employers, or even personal relationships.

I am concerned about how fitting and convenient it is for the staff of schools in managing the delinquents, but how damaging this can potential be for bright and able children to be treated with less freedom than correctional facilities. Mental health and self harm and teen suicides statistics are already depressingly high, and with high pressured expectations and penalised for low level infractions can sabotage a once engaged teen's self esteem. A friend's 14 year old son recently committed suicide. So this really touches a raw nerve.

I've seen how a hostile school environment can crush a student with so much potential too many times.

I can't help but thinK of Pink Floyd's "Another Brick in the Wall" with faceless children put through the grinder...sorry for the grim comparison....but I can't shake it.

Is this radical new Behaviour Control in developing adolescent minds a good thing, or setting them up to fail in the real world in order that the schools get "Outstanding" Ofsted reports as inspectors come and see automatons walking silently through schools for fear of punishment and exclusion?

Are any of you in these super strict schools and finding it great or awful?

*If you are a teacher or part of school staff, please indicate in your response, so an understanding of your perspective is made clear.

Thank you

OP posts:
Original poster
Chattonnoire · 18/09/2018 16:50

Called school, would't take my call, all SLT prepping for a beginning of term parent's evening for another year group. Told to email my request.

So far they haven't responded to previous questions put in my email, so I may just rock up tomorrow and ask for written policy, and HM meeting in person as well as in email now.

OP posts:
noblegiraffe · 18/09/2018 16:35

Maybe you should ask for a meeting. Say that you need to meet in person to discuss the adjustments that will need to be made for your DS’s SEND. Pin them down!

Original poster
Chattonnoire · 18/09/2018 16:29

I have contacted the school in order for them to explain the seated lunch breaks, and they are putting me off, deflecting, sending me emails of these other schools I added the links to in my original post as evidence to support their policy....but my DS literally just informed me of the no hands up rule after he returned from school.

OP posts:
noblegiraffe · 18/09/2018 16:25

Have you spoken to the school yet to ask what they’re playing at?

No hands up is a teaching tactic for when the teacher asks the class a question and doesn’t just want to pick the keen beans, it is not supposed to stop a pupil putting their hand up if they need help.

Original poster
Chattonnoire · 18/09/2018 16:20

OK, sooo.... things got even weirder today....

My DS came home after his second day of the new behavioural policy changes, and they are apparently implementing new rules and changing them as they go.

One of the new rules was that during class, where no one is allowed to talk or make any noise whatsoever, the students were no longer permitted to raise their hand to ask a question or get attention from the teacher (so silent transition isn't just about reducing the commotion in corridors to get the student to lessons more swiftly without any social interactions in-between, but an entire day of silence unless granted permission to make a sound).

Apparently, as explained to the students by the teachers, this is so the teacher can give a fair chance to all students to answer questions in class, but it effectively silences any students who may have a question for the teacher themselves. It is completely self defeating!

My DS and all the students and it appears even some of the apologetic teachers, are all dumbfounded.

The SLT is imposing this on the teaching staff who are obliged to follow policy.

So my DS can no longer, even in silence, raise his hand, in order to alert the teacher visually, he needs help with a task, or didn't understand something, has a question to put forth on the topic or needs to go to the toilet.

How Absurd is that!!!???

My DS got 2 warnings because he spoke out as he couldn't get his teacher's attention, and a third strike would have resulted in a 24h in school declass exclusion (so 24h no lessons in isolation until 5pm the following day) which would have meant he would have missed his sport's training and loss his place in the ranks for the annual competition. A direct negative impact on his out of school activities and achievements, for attempting to LEARN!

What is going on?

Can this be any more ridiculous?

OP posts:
Original poster
Chattonnoire · 18/09/2018 14:45

Spellcheck is not my friend today....

granted permission
Considered abusive

OP posts:
Original poster
Chattonnoire · 18/09/2018 14:43

I still can’t wrap my head around it all. I have never understood why an adult being hit by a colleague or employer is assault, but a Youth being hit by another Youth at school (or even elsewhere) or by an adult (say a parent) it’s not criminal act?

I don’t comprehend how forcing adolescents to remain in muted silence unless grated permission in lessons or the only 45 minutes of break they have during the day and remain in seats during their supposed “break” or else face punishment, isn’t considered abudive?

Regardless of trying to control the troublesome students, the rest are going to experience irreparable damage but these measures, as seen in GrimSqeaker DD and I can see beginning to become a problem in the home and real world (outside of school interactions) in my DS

OP posts:
BerriesandLeaves · 18/09/2018 14:31

Sorry, it says right there in the article i posted what age it is!

BerriesandLeaves · 18/09/2018 14:29

The school is kindergarten to 9th grade. Not sure what age that is

BerriesandLeaves · 18/09/2018 14:26

I saw that in the news too

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-45490196

EarlyModernParent · 18/09/2018 14:09

Welcome to Trump's America: civil rights being withdrawn in sneaky increments.

Original poster
Chattonnoire · 18/09/2018 13:39

Correction: LuluJakey1

OP posts:
Original poster
Chattonnoire · 18/09/2018 13:38

SenecaFalls That is horrific! Corporal punishment! Do you have a link to this US school? I’ll search it up, but it can be seen that those advocating these strict policies are struggling teachers and schools. Whilst I empathise with them, as does my DS, resorting to these measures and conditioning this mindless obedience in the stiludents, is surely going to have long term damaging impact on their ability to interact with employers, relationships, socity. As LuluKakey1 stated earlier ...Social engineering, not good for the developing adolescents surely

OP posts:
SenecaFalls · 18/09/2018 12:54

They spring up, or take over schools in deprived areas - and for me there seems to be a very uncomfortable undercurrent of drilling absolute total obedience into the working classes ready for a lifetime of working without any question or need for a break as they're so attuned to staying in place, eyes forward, do not speak, no arguing back - feels like churning out a generation of robots.

The whole time I have been reading this thread I keep thinking about a school that has been in the news recently in the US because they have instituted corporal punishment (19 states in the US allow corporal punishment in schools). People defending this have used arguments similar to some on this thread defending these super strict schools in England. Interestingly, study after study in the US has shown that corporal punishment in the US is used disproportionately against children of color.

Surely, we need to try to the extent possible to replicate in schools the humane treatment of people that we strive for in the greater society.

Original poster
Chattonnoire · 18/09/2018 10:49

GrimSqueaker I initially posted to hear from parents who had personally experienced this environment and how it affected their kids. I see my DS reacting as your DD. I haven’t seen many posts so far to give me a real sense of what the impact is on the students themselves, as even tigerparent Milkytea20 is more concerned about competing against Singapore and South Korea, who’s students do night school to achieve the results they do globally and also hive exceptionally high student suicide rates, as did Hong Kong, China and other South East Asian Countries that put Academic achievement above all roundness and student mental wellness. I can personally attest to the academic situation in these countries are not preferable or enviable in any way, having lived in all those mentioned and relocated to U.K. to remove my DS from that kind of academic environment. The wealthy from those nations have been shipping their kids to UK boarding schools for ages to ensure they aren’t in those educational systems, that’s a big indicator I think.

OP posts:
GrimSqueaker · 18/09/2018 10:20

What makes me profoundly uncomfortable is that you don't see these very very regimented boot camp schools springing up in affluent areas. They spring up, or take over schools in deprived areas - and for me there seems to be a very uncomfortable undercurrent of drilling absolute total obedience into the working classes ready for a lifetime of working without any question or need for a break as they're so attuned to staying in place, eyes forward, do not speak, no arguing back - feels like churning out a generation of robots.

I tried and tried to support DD1 in her primary that tries to go down this route - wanted it to work out as it was our local school and I believe in that... but watching her completely freak out and panic about walking down a corridor when school had long since finished for the day in case she was doing it wrong, and hearing about rules rules rules rules every single day from her and seeing how anxious she was becoming... couldn't do it to her. If the choice for secondary is a school like that, or having to explore other options like home ed (which I don't really want to do for my own kids) - I'll do the home ed option.

frogsoup · 17/09/2018 23:07

*appearance. I can spell really, honest Grin

frogsoup · 17/09/2018 23:04

I agree in principle but I think in the case of these new academies it is not just a case of parents up in arms about rules that are actually in place everywhere - some of them are genuinely pretty grim. I know the child of a friend had the misfortune to end up in one of these places and he literally had a detention every day, for months at a time. He wasn't wildly out of control either, it was just a miserably authoritarian place with no apparent sense of humanity or proportionality. Ditto those academies in the news recently with exclusion rates of up to 75% of pupils. That isn't just anti-authority parents with a bone to pick about reasonable school rules - it really is more than that. I think the school the OP is talking about is similar. I'm all for rules that enable kids to learn, but it's clear that some of these academies are all about outward apperance - improving failing schools certainly involves improving discipline, but as a teacher I'm sure you'd agree that setting up a productive and mutually respectful educational environment is not really just a case of sending home any child that dares to have their shirt a shade off regulation colour or take their blazer off without permission in 35 degree heat. It's focussing on trivia at the expense of what matters.

LuluJakey1 · 17/09/2018 22:41

It is social engineering.

MaisyPops · 17/09/2018 22:31

frogsoup
I agree approach is everything.

I guess it's probably a teacher chip on my shoulder but I find it really insulting the way some of those types go on like the options are either:

  1. Do it out way and we are the only ones who have high standards
  2. You clearly don't teach the students anything and your lessons are always disrupted.

It's equally annoying when blanket comments about how draconian some places are because they 'give detentions for looking out the window'. Reality is that in most schools if you repeatedly stare out the window and aren't getting on with your work then there'd be a sanction.

I think many of those places take what many teachers do anyway, codify it more, add a few more 'look at how strict we are' rules and then sit back and enjoy the commotion. Meanwhile those who seem to have a massive issue with rulea and how awful these places are get het up about all these awful rules and end up throwing the baby out with the bathwater because if more schools had higher standards and stronger discipline then some failing schools might stand a chance of giving kids more options in life.
Sometimes the nuance gets lost in behaviour debates (all generall comments by the way, not at you).

frogsoup · 17/09/2018 22:25

I think there is a difference of tone and in how they are applied though Maisy. It's one thing making it clear to kids that paying attention to the teacher and making eye contact when speaking is expected, but quite another enforcing it by lengthy detentions and isolation. A good school doesn't need to act like a gulag, and indeed most schools don't, even good schools in tough areas. There was a great secret teacher article in the guardian about how mutual respect was essential in teaching difficult kids, and that putting kids in lengthy internal isolation for minor transgressions was tantamount to denying them an education - essentially an easy way out for schools to cut loose their more difficult kids. It's a really worrying trend imo, particularly given the lack of accountability within the academy system.

MaisyPops · 17/09/2018 22:12

frog
I don't like the policing of lunches and breaks in places like these, but I don't think some of the classroom rules are that unlike many schools.
I'm always a bit Hmm when I hear people from certain schools acting like they are the only schools to teach knowledge, the only school to do 'drills' (I've called them starter quizzes for years), the only ones to expect silence when the teacher is talking etc. Some of it (to me at least) feels like there's the aim to cause a stir and develop a reputation as the super strict school.

I think the danger with some criticisms of school policies like these is that the focus on more excesive/unusual rules can lead to otherwise perfectly sensible rules being dismissed. (E.g. to look at the person who is speaking, showing you are listening and being polite isn't a massive ask. Most places just don't call it tracking the teacher and talk lots about giving demerits for not watching.)

SnuggyBuggy · 17/09/2018 21:47

To be fair our canteen is so overcrowded assigned seats might not be a bad idea.

SenecaFalls · 17/09/2018 21:46

You don't see adults in offices running around during lunch breaks!

Certainly not inside. In my workplace they change clothes and run on the streets outside our office. Then they come inside and shower, using a shower that was installed for the purpose. Many modern workplaces recognize that there is a benefit to staff having a real break in the middle of the day that can include exercise for any worker so inclined.

frogsoup · 17/09/2018 21:41

"You don't see adults in offices running around during lunch breaks!"

Um, I used to go to the gym at lunchtime in my office job. And quite often sit in the park to eat my sandwich. Name me an office which makes staff sit still in the staff canteen until their lunch break is over! Hmm Bonkers as conkers (both this school management and some on this thread!)

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