Latymer Upper-drug issues?

The experimenting took place out of the school. The issue is a disgrace. These children have literally been dumped , only one has a place. The other 5 are yet to be accepted anywhere. They experimented at a party. Where is the pastoral care. Where is the education about drugs and what drugs do. The school have literally ruined these children lives- forever damaged by the experience and yes I do know 2 of the children

I'm another LU parent, from higher up the school. From what I understand which may or may not be true the incident was inside school not outside, and the pupils concerned were asked to leave rather than being expelled. One has already turned up at another equally academic and sought after Indy in the area, where I have a child in the same year. Someone suggested to me that the schools have an agreement to take each other's "leavers" in these sorts of circumstances, and no doubt they are taken on with strict conditions attached.

Yes I would agree that LU is not a sheltering school - it can't afford to be due to its location. My DC say they can smell the weed on some people as they walk down King St! It's a volatile environment really and the school can't be too careful in that respect.

Both my London raised DC have had peers who died before the age of 20 because of drugs. They also know others who have had bad experiences. I did not mind paying for a school who were upfront about a no tolerance policy. FWIW I think the difference between LU and similar schools is that they have tended to be more open when problems occur. The same problems happen elsewhere and kids leave, but nothing is said.

I think there will be far far more than 20 at LU who have not been involved in drugs, and partly due to school policy, have felt under no pressure to join in. Dd has been saddened to see peers at University from more sheltered backgrounds getting sucked into quite dangerous drug use. Perhaps a London upbringing forces kids into making decisions early but also prepares them to be independent and stand up to peer pressure.

As I understand it, the expulsion is not one that will go in their school record, though it will be fairly obvious in the short-term, I guess, as they are looking for alternative school places.

My DC are not in that year group, but I do know that, within the last year, a guest speaker came in who was a mum who had lost her 15 year-old son to ecstasy. It was the first and only time he has taken it. The students were very traumatised by the talk. The boy was an extremely high-achiever, who just made one tragic mistake. The direct message from this mother had a real impact. I'm not sure if she had spoken to every year group though.

Seven, I was referring to the idea that a school would call the police on its on students for things happening outside school. Its happens at several of the London Day Schools now and somehow feels wrong to me. I was not commenting on the LU situation.

LU is a great school. Everyone I know there is VERY happy. I have my own opinions on expelling kids for smoking cannabis outside school but its not for me to say as I don't know the details or the history which are clearly V. important..

As an LU parent, the no tolerance drugs policy is made very explicit to all pupils. They would definitely all be aware of this and that it includes drugs being used / handled outside of school premises, including cannabis. I would not say the school has a drugs problem and I do feel sorry for the children involved. Possibly it was just one child handing it out to the others and they've all gone down together. The details as to what exactly happened have not been made public within the school, however, it must have been a clear breach of school policy for them to have been expelled.

SSP, I think its even worse. They call the police. On their own students. For something that happened outside school. (again, I hear this from numerous independent school parents not referring only to this one.)

Ignoring the specific situation as no-one seems to know the details, many private schools now seem to come down very hard on teenagers taking soft drugs/cannabis which I personally think is the wrong approach. Those let off with a final warning (including a certain former PM allegedly) often go on to great academic success.The farce of private schools expelling pupils was best exemplified a few years ago when it was reported that the headmaster of one of the country's top private schools who had expelled pupils for smoking cannabis had himself smoked cannabis as a pupil at the school decades earlier. Ironically as a state school parent I feel much more confident that my DCs would be given a second chance if they smoked cannabis or at least that I could successfully appeal a first strike policy. Indeed Department of Education guidance states "Exclusion should not be the automatic response to a drug incident and permanent exclusion should only be used in serious cases." Private school pupils whose parents have shelled out a small fortune on their education shouldn't have it ruined by a teenage mistake. After all they could be the next PM or even headmaster!

This thread has really stuck with me. The Latymer situation aside, is anyone else bothered by a head calling the police? About something that happened off campus?

I agree with londonista. Kids are trying pot. I don't approve but I've got two in uni and one in secondary and I hear about it all the time. I think she nailed it. All school have drugs and that is the problem.

Brut- I'm not talking the specific situation. I agree we probably don't know the details because surely the school would be looking to punish/catch whoever sold the drugs to a 13 year old.

Very true extinctspecies so I ought to explain that I answered in a London context because OP is actively considering a London day school. So I did rather assume that's the metropolis in which she dwells.

It's not just London schools which have issues with drugs.

At my DS' very rural school (day/boarding/independent) some kids were expelled for drug taking in the 4th form.

I'd say it's a feature of almost every school, everywhere.

It's how the schools deal with it that matters.

I agree with londinista

All, and I mean all, London secondaries have problems with pupils and drugs from time to time. The thing that matters is the school's response

So the sorts of questions you need to be asking are about the school's drugs policy (have you read and compared them for all your candidate schools?) and to perhaps when you visit ask someone with pastoral responsibilities some questions about drug issues in the school: how many cases the school has dealt with in the last few years, his many led to expulsion and how many to other action. How many drugs tests have been carried out on how many pupils? How many who were given a second chance were later asked to leave because of a further drug-related issue? When do they involve the police, and how often has this happened? If there are drugs-related expulsions, what do they tell other pupils when a classmate has to leave?

What do they teach the pupils about drugs, and when? Do they provide information on drugs and teens to parents?

If they threw out every pupil who had smoked weed out of school at London independent or state schools then there'd be a lot of schools with about 20 kids on their rolls come A level time, and I'd say any parent who thinks differently has their head in the sand.

While 13/14 is young even for London, there must be more to this particular story for it to be an instant expulsion.

It might be worth remembering that this thread is about actual children and families and that speculation is neither kind nor helpful. I am guessing none of us really know the full facts.

Neither of you know the details of what happened and nor do most Latymer parents. I am not going to "enlighten" you on what actually happened, I don't think it's remotely helpful to anyone involved to publish such things online.

stateschoolparent I do not see the possession of cannabis amongst 13/14 year olds as a minor offence or a trivial matter. It worries me a great deal. You are, of course entitled to your own opinion. However, my professional experience has taught me that cannabis is far from the soft drug many think it is. The Latymer pupils are very clever and very confident, and probably need to be reminded that rules are there for a purpose, and you break them at your peril. Certainly that's a clear unambiguous message to both children and parents and hard to argue with.

Brutneyspies I was also going on what a Latymer parent had told me which seemed to confirm the Sunday Times report. Perhaps if the report is ill-informed/ wrong you could enlighten us as to what actually happened.

Actually Brutney I was going on what a y9 parent at Latymer told me and not a newspaper report so I'll respectfully throw back to you what you said about not commenting etc.

(Has anyone ever used the phrase 'with respect' respectfully?)

"I can assure you that in my experience there is far less drug taking among MC pupils at London state schools than at London private schools where it has always been rife. "

Your experience is clearly different. Ours, as I suggested, is that it is very possible to go through London private schools like Latymer and not feel under any pressure to experiment with drugs. In contrast appears, if students DD has come across at University are typical, is that elsewhere (and as it happens outside the private sector) drug taking appears to be normalised to the extent that it is socially hard to resist. I mentioned to a friend whose daughter had been at one of these schools, who confirmed that the widespread party culture was a very big reason behind a decision to leave.

Yes, some drugs are more risky than others. But in terms of protecting relatively young children, I suspect it is safer to simply restrict all, with a "just say no" line. The problem really happens when kids assume that drug use is normal and acceptable. 13 years can't buy alcohol or cigarettes. Cannabis use should equally not be minimised.

To those moaning about harshness, you clearly have absolutely no knowledge of what actually happened but are picking up on an equally ill-informed newspaper report and some internet gossip. With respect, I suggest you don't comment on things you know nothing about.

I'm with you stateschoolparent, I think this seems terrifyingly harsh. These are seven kids who presumably worked hard to get into what's a v selective school thrown out mid term on a first-strike basis.

I've a child the same age and while I hope they're not smoking weed (and I'm fairly confident they're not but I'm guessing that these parents probably thought the same), I would hope that if they were caught once they'd be given a bit more compassion than this. These kids are left without a school aged 13/14 which seems wholly disproportionate.

Like I say, I'm pretty certain mine isn't smoking. However, they recently did something incredibly stupid which shocked us. Teenagers are hardwired to try to keep up with friends and to not think through the consequence of their actions.

chose latymer-although possession of cannabis is illegal in the UK it is treated differently from hard drugs and-under police guidelines- an adult caught in possession of cannabis for personal use is normally given a warning or (if they have already had one or more warnings) a fixed penalty fine of £90 . They wouldn't generally get charged/a criminal record until at least the third occasion.In other words society regards possession of cannabis as a very minor offence and obviously it is something you are doing to yourself and not to others (unlike harassment, bullying etc.) .
Needmoresleep- You say "Many parents will welcome and support a school that takes a firm but fair line in order to keep a lid on any nascent drug culture. This is perhaps something that attracts London parents to schools within the private sector." I can assure you that in my experience there is far less drug taking among MC pupils at London state schools than at London private schools where it has always been rife.

Latymer2018: The school expelled seven 13/14 year old pupils and reported them to the police according to the Sunday Times. If your DCs had been caught smoking cannabis, I suspect you would be very happy for them to have been at other nearby schools where the policy is "less clear". IMO the pupils deserved another chance although I accept most of you don't seem to agree so I'll shut up now..

I'm a Latymer parent too, and whilst I feel very sad indeed for the children and their parents, I have a lot of faith in the Latymer Head. Whilst I don't know him personally, he strikes me as a compassionate and thoughtful man who would not take such action unless he felt it was justified. I suspect that there is much more to this than any of us know. At least the school is seen to be taking a strong line on this, unlike some of the other top London schools which have chosen to avoid publicity in the past. Would I rather my DCs were at Latymer and weathering this storm than at other nearby schools where the drugs policy is less clear? Absolutely.

Stateschoolparent, parents will have different views on young teenagers taking drugs. It will certainly be important for some parents that a school does not allow a "drug culture" with the attendent peer pressure, to take hold.

Without knowing the details of this incident I would be surprised if the school did not use a good level of context before making decisions about whether to exclude or expel any pupil. Indeed I would expect both parent and pupil to be aware of possible consequences should they continue to push against boundaries. LU has both a reputation for "sparky" or "cool" students, and for strong academic and other achievements. I think they bridge the gap by strong pastoral care, and clear rules. A standard complaint is that they hand out detentions like confetti during the first term, calming down once students understand what is expected of them.

DD went through two London secondaries including Latymer, aware of the London drug culture but never feeling under any pressure to be part of it. She has been very surprised at how prevalent drug use is at University, how pernicious some of the peer pressure is, and just how dull and unmotivated some drug users are. Many parents will welcome and support a school that takes a firm but fair line in order to keep a lid on any nascent drug culture. This is perhaps something that attracts London parents to schools within the private sector.