Worried we made the wrong choice about grammar school

mountford100 with the greatest respect, some DCs don't need to spend 1.5 hrs a night, every night, on homework. I don't often see my DC do any homework as they complete most of it at school. So far they are achieving very high grades and I doubt those grades would increase with an hour and half more work each night as grades are capped. Granted this may change when they are studying A levels though.

DDs school gives 3 HWs per night for all year groups. Year 7 are expected to spend 25 minutes on each piece 75 minutes in total by the time both had finished it ended up being 90 minutes !

Year 8 are expected to do 30 minutes on each piece of home work and because pupils are more organised it ended up being the same time taken as year 7.

DD2 is in year 9 and should be spending 40 minutes per subject per night . However, is being a bit lazy at the moment and doing the same 1hr 30 minutes per night !

DD1 Yr12 is spending about 2.5 hours a night on homework on top of her study periods.

In fact its the focus on "hours spent" that i think I'm at odds with educationally. It's a bit like a work culture where arriving early and leaving late is praised but little gets done.

I'd rather focused tasks which may take varying time rather than work for the sake of it to fill a certain time slot.

Spurtions it wouldn't happen to be a a comprehensive in name only with 30% selected via ability !

Otherwise it is statistically impossible to achieve those grades with a random group of 150 pupils at GCSE .

Gosh I think I'd actively avoid any school doing 1.5 hours of homework a night from year 7 though! (The grammar I taught at didnt). I want time to be children and to do music and sport and to read etc. Thats far too much.

Bertrand with the greatest respect, if you have been spending at least 1.5 hrs a night on home work from year 7 on-wards you are more likely to achieve better grades.

Both my DDs have never spent less than 1.5 hrs a night on homework since starting secondary school. (disclaimer with the exception of a couple of months ago when no 2 tried to get away with doing 20 minutes worth and quite rightly got taken to task ).

I posted about that...

I think is because i used grammar school if i had said my children went to a comprehensive , there would have been no outrage for suggesting more homework = better grades.

Cappuccino you are quite right i know of some high achieving 'comprehensive' schools that expect 2.5 hours a night homework in year 11 !

"This being when her 20 minute a night homework Comp friends are sweating over DDE grades at A level !"

Our comp had 90% A-B last year and nearly 60% A-A. Obviously a really rubbish comp, if my DC’s get those grades from the comp they’ll be crying all the way to a rubbish university. Don’t be so assumptive and snobby about comps.

The local comkp here is one of the "self quizzing" every night as homework ones. Far more homework and far more detentions for seemingly every thing than the grammar school.

Yeah I agree Bertrand

Fwiw my oldest dd didn't learn fucking Chinese in year 7, didn't have hours of homework and yes, got DDE in her a level mocks. She's bloody lovely and is retaking different a levels and will go to a, probably, non Russell group uni. She'll have a great life. The snobbery on here is unfuckingbelievable

"This being when her 20 minute a night homework Comp friends are sweating over DDE grades at A level"
Fuck me, there are some ghastly people in the world!!

Lilly, the envy will be on the other foot when your DD gets her first choice University . This being when her 20 minute a night homework Comp friends are sweating over DDE grades at A level

How insulting and ignorant. Our comp sends loads to Russell group every year. Dd in year 7 has about 30mins a night, occasionally an hour but very rarely. She is in top sets and doing very well.

Revolving around...

Where did i say it was inevitable that comprehensive educated children would get poor A level results !

What i did say was a comment about deferred gratification evolving around the amount of homework the OPs daughter was getting.

This was to point out that the 'envy' regarding the limited homework expectations of the OPs daughter , will swing full circle the other way at 18 .

If he has trouble with organisation it's good that he is in an environment where there are consequences for being disorganised or not putting in enough effort. He can't keep going like this forever and it's easier for him to change his ways nowvthan later on.

Plenty of year 7 pupils only spend around 20-30 minutes on homework each night...

I guess i am very old fashioned but i find it very reassuring if a school puts a child in detention for wearing the wrong socks etc.
This means the school has limited serious issues to deal with..

At my 2 DDs grammar school nothing short of a note from a 'coronary' prevents missed homework's, initiating an after school 45 minute detention .
Both my DDs in year 9 and 12 respectively, have both acquired 10 after school detentions in their time there.

Like Stanley Fletcher from Porridge , the girls understand Detention to be an occupational hazzard !

Mountford100 your comment about "comp friends" inevitably getting poor A Level grades is insulting and ignorant.

As a comp kid myself who got AAA and my first choice University, and as the mother of a comp kid who is also on the same trajectory, I can confidently tell you that your assumptions are completely wrong.

A bright, hard working, well supported child will do as well at a decent comp as they would have done at a selective school.I suppose that a not so bright, less self motivated child might do better at a grammar than they might have done at a comp, but please don't write off all comprehensives as dire and all the children who go there as doomed.

"This being when her 20 minute a night homework Comp friends are sweating over DDE grades at A level !"

Do, please, link to this school.......

It is true, OP, bright kids at comps do not 'bobble along': they are in top sets with high expectations of them. They are on 'pathways' or however the school expresses it, that are academic and challenging.

And they are under the same pressure about handing in homework, forgetting stuff and having their buttons done up!

Lilly, the envy will be on the other foot when your DD gets her first choice University . This being when her 20 minute a night homework Comp friends are sweating over DDE grades at A level !

I know at 11 they don't get the theory of deferred gratification but that is what it is about !

DD started grammar this September, similarly not much prep, very bright but not a massive crafter, quite social and she's struggling to adapt and is asking to go to the comp. I'm not sure comp have less detentions but they have a fraction of the homework by us in y7 which is causing some envy. I'm trying to get her to stick out the year but its a bit difficult.

Nothing wrong with getting detentions, in-fact i would suggest it is about adapting to secondary school.

I would also say until you have had at least 2 after school detentions, you really have not lived !
All kids need to be 'cheeky' ,forget homework 'disrupt' the class, otherwise they don't learn about barriers .

The consequences of never pushing the boundaries at school , means the first time they do at University shit happens...

OP it's completely unexceptional, don't worry about it. I've had eight DC incl four boys at a superselective grammar and DS2 was the proud possessor of the first detention to be handed out in his own Y7 but has graduated this year with an Oxford 1st, Captain of Rugby etc and is majorly chilled. It's fine, your DS will find his feet - just be relaxed about detentions, black marks etc until there's something really extreme (eg threat of expulsion).

Exactly the same here, five detentions in the first half term all for homework forgotten at home and so on. I do wonder if mine would otherwise be flourishing at the top of the comp, but his organisational problems would still be causing detentions and he might equally not have been pushed. We had a real wibble at half term. But mine is really happy there, despite getting some poor marks for attitude to learning (he did have a particularly chatty primary), and he is proud of the school and sometimes of himself too. I have started giving much more organisational support - I thought I was already doing loads! Timetable taped down where he packs his bag, calendar at home with long-term homeworks written in, and daily discussion of behaviour in lessons. It's definitely getting better. School have also been helpful in giving some mentoring - don't hesitate to ask for support.

", and he would have been happier bobbling along at the other school."

Presumably he would have been top set at the "other school"- so why do you think he would have been "bobbling along"?

I do think a lot of children need a much better introduction to the expectations of secondary school. Small village schools tend to be the worst at this because they don’t always have high expectations on remembering “stuff”. At a bigger school we did find in Y6 that handing in homework on the due date was expected, not optional. Revising for a test was expected. Remembering sports kit and musical instrument was expected. Mum didn’t pop in with missing kit etc!

I think daily lists are the key (what to hand in and what to take) and the good habit of writing everything down in the day book or journal or whatever it’s called - Rough Book in my day! This needs practice and need to be reinforced with reminders. Must be very annoying for teachers to have this irritation all the time. I also don’t think it should be up to teachers to keep nannying y7 children. Forgetfulness won’t be much good at university or Work either so finding a way to remember is key.