what grade does your school require to do an A level in that subject?

So. Having been to ope. Evenings. They seem to generally want 6's in the harder subjects.
My son want to do further maths, maths and physics and hes needs a 7 in either physics or maths and a 6 in the other....but a 4 in English.

So those jobs aren't for students who get Ds then. I find it sad that at 16 we seem to be saying that if you can't get Bs and As that you don't get the chance to study a subject you love, just because you might get below a C at A level. My favourite ever A level class (in many years of teaching) had the full range of A* to E. And the student enjoyed it the most was the boy who got a D. He went off to join the police force. Biology was irrelevant to that, but he loved it and wanted to do more of it before he started his career. I loved teaching him.

But there are passing grades below a C.

Maybe a "pass" in the education world, but a lot of professional courses require grade C's, and when you're in the real world, you'd be competing for jobs/courses etc against others with higher grades.

My nephew reached the published "minimum requirements" for his chosen courses, but didn't get a place from various providers simply because they could fill their training courses with people who got higher grades.

One of our local sixth forms requires a 6 in Maths and English to do anything.

For DD, who is predicted 7-8 for everything except maths, that's somewhat annoying. She wants to take history, art and English (all predicted 8-ish), but may well have to go elsewhere with her probable 5 in maths.

But there are passing grades below a C.

7 for maths and sciences. 4s/5s for other subjects depending on the child (as performance depends on maturity to some extent).

To put it into context, if you get a B/6 at GCSE, then on average, for most subjects, you'd get a C at A-level (based on the 2016 Transition Matrix).
That's why schools require 6/7s.

Sorry, i start making mistakes when i post without my glasses on.

Why can't an academic from Oxford University be a brilliant Hairdresser / or a Chef!

Why can't you be a 'brilliant academic' from Oxbridge who is also a fantastic hairdresser ! Similarly why can't some interested in childcare be a ace fully qualified ' Nutritionist'

I think B/C grade students should choose what they want.
When I did PC PgCE there were A grade students wanting to take vocational qualifications at college and being put off/ told they couldn't subjects like Hairdressing, Travel and Tourism, and Childcare.
These courses were marketed at those who weren't academic, which is great as some of the units from each can be sought after by different employers. But if the academic ones choose a vocation they certainly shouldn't be put off.

Why should B/C grade students be expected to pick vocational subjects at 16? What's wrong with two more years of History, or Biology?

Perhaps we could have a form of the YTS introduced for vocational education.

The modern apprenticeship scheme does that. It's taking forever to get rolled out, but more and more employers are now offering it. The demand is there, but places are limited because the colleges offer very few places as they're also more interested in classrooms rather than workshops. That means, it's mainly the bigger employers who do it as they have in-house teaching facilities.

A way of introducing it would be to allow companies, to reduce corporation taxes .

By participating in the scheme, big corporations such as building companies etc could train educate students as well as reducing thier tax bills .

There has to be 'carrot' otherwise nobody is interested.

There seems to be at the moment , a growing movement across both the public and Govt of attacking big companies with a 'stick' ; regarding tax avoidance without any offerings of a 'carrot' to refrain from it.

Perhaps schemes like these would encourage companies to invest in people , if their tax liabilities could be shelved or limited!

It's not surprising that schools can't offer vocational subjects with all the cuts to education.

But in the high spend years of Labour, they didn't either. So I don't think it's all about the money. My son's school has loads of tech, including 3d printers, laser cutters, CAD computers, routers, etc., but they still make the kids spend a term making a wooden fish and another term hammering a metal trowel into shape - that's exactly what I did 40 years ago, so it's just not changed! Unless a pupil chooses to take it to GCSE, they don't even get to see the more advanced tech equipment, let alone use it. Why aren't they "marketing" the tech to the pupils before GCSE decision making to try to encourage more to choose it? I really don't think there's the "will" in schools to push the tech, except for the less academic, so basically, if you're doing OK at the academic side, they'll not push you into manual skills, tech, etc.

A way of introducing it would be to allow companies, to reduce corporation taxes . ! Perhaps we could have a form of the YTS introduced for vocational education. Students earning so £35-£50 a week subsidized by Govt and Employers 50-50.

Our local college offers lots of vocational subjects from age 16+ and also Access courses to Higher Ed, for those without A levels, and of course A levels. This is in addition to extensive apprenticeships.
It's not surprising that schools can't offer vocational subjects with all the cuts to education.

You see that's the point, i would have loved to have been able to study, such vital skills for the country . However, due to the fact of being Dyspraxic and Dyslexic i would likely blow a house up if i studied to be an electrician.

There are though many children with limited academic qualifications that process the ability to be ; potentially talented and innovative industry. In doing so people could make themselves not replaceable and thus guaranteed highly paid work; for life !

the country is crying out for skilled vocational training, especially after Brexit ; why or why cant the country make vocational education a priority.

There was a new "technical" school opened in Lancashire which was aimed at manual skills, trades, etc., but it's closed down because of low numbers of pupils. Quite simply children/parents had the belief that the "trades" were beneath them, so continued to press on with academia. When you had Blair aiming for a completely stupid 50% going to uni, there's a long way to go before we'll get back to more vocational/manual education. Sadly, far too few people want it, and those that do, think it's someone else who should do it, i.e. teachers don't want to teach it, politicians don't want it, parents/children have unrealistic expectations, etc. It's going to take quite a shift in opinion/belief from all sides before there's any real change.

You don't have to be planning on university to do A levels. If somebody had the capacity to pass an A level, even at an E, and they love the subject and want to study it in more depth for 2 years, then surely that is at least one of the aims of education? I used to teach Biology and Psychology and have taught quite a number of students in that category. I do agree with noblegiraffe about Maths, and would add Physics and Chemistry to that. But lots of subjects are accessible at a lower level of attainment.

I do think it depends on what the person wants to do in the future.
If the Uni the person is applying to has lower expectancies, then surely they should be allowed to take the subject, even if they don't do so well.

My dd future Higher Ed choice only require 3 GCSE's A-C equivalent and min of 2 A levels E and above.
It's set particularly low as there is a specialist subject in there where obviously you'd need really good grades.
Ao bearing in mind they have to take 8/9 GCSE's there's bound to be some in there that aren't such good results and perhaps an A level or two that are only an E.

Just looked at the prospectus for the school where I teach. They ask for a 7 in maths for maths/further maths, 6 in maths + science for sciences. I don't know what they used to ask for in letter grades.

I teach MFL, we ask for a 5 in the relevant language but would let you in with a 3

My dd school expects a B/6 to continue to A level, you don't need to have passed any other subject to take a particular subject.
You don't need a Maths GCSE to take science.

I worked in policy development for one of the biggest exam boards in the country until a few months ago and all of our work was focused on the grading structure and helping people understand it. At that time 7 was a very high B/low A but I left before this year's results were out so appreciate it may have shifted since then.

However not writing them off isn't the same as allowing everyone who has got 4s and 5s at GCSE to do A Levels or to do GCSEs in any subjects they choose.

I have been looking at some of the entry requirements of further education colleges for A levels ; some of them are ridiculously lax.
It cannot be in any child's interest to study 3 A levels , if their profile is 4 grade 4 (C) grades. However , look through the internet and you will see many colleges allowing access to A level courses; with as little as 4 grade 4s.

A grade four isn't even recognized by the Government, as being of academic rigor . The Government only accepted it as a pass, after it became clear of the chaos ; that would have followed, if they had not.

The world has moved on since i was accepted in to my grammar school sixth form with a profile of 3 Bs and 3 Cs at GCSE in 1990 !
Somehow i achieved 2 Cs and a D at A level !

I would suggest that A level study was not the right choice for me, given how certain posters have commented on my lack of understanding of punctuation !

However, by entering students with profiles that really require more work at GCSE level on to A level studies ; the student will invariably be attaining U or E grades at best !
Two whole years of study wasted for students concerned. These types of students were should be pointed towards doing BTEC type qualifications . The two bonuses would be first the student, who is likely to come out with a grounding knowledge; about an industry. Secondly perhaps BTEC and other vocational qualifications would lose the attached stigma of being for 'dummy's'.

the country is crying out for skilled vocational training, especially after Brexit ; why or why cant the country make vocational education a priority.