How late is too late to swap A levels?

is "incapable of managing" written to insult giraffe?
or to show your superiority perhaps

I have no doubt that many students forced to do 4 A levels would do much better doing 3 than 4 subjects, especially those where low A* at GCSE predicts that they may struggle to get an A at A levels. That is relevant to chemistry and physics in particular and maths to certain extent.

Glad to hear there's a positive outcome.

Sorry about the double post. Really patchy signal where I am

Op I’m really glad your dd is sorted.

Well I’m sorry noble but when I said “ 'may have a detrimental effect on their other grades” I meant that studying 4 s levels for a year, particularly with no intention of even finishing one of them may have a detrimental effect on their other grades. Not whatever alternative meaning you may choose to put on it. I meant exactly what I typed. Not your version of it.

Diluting effort for a while year on 4 instead of 3 subjects is bound to cut down on the amount of time that students have to devote to extra reading and other experiences which makes such a contribution to top and good grades.

Not to mention that for many students, the 4th a level is just that: a bit of an afterthought / padder that they intend to drop at the end of year 12 anyway.

My dd, like many others, decided at age about 7 what she wanted to study at uni. So your horror at narrowing down her curriculum is only welcomed by her as an opportunity to concentrate on the (as it happens 2) subjects she loves.

DS's comp starts everyone on 4 (a very few on 5, though the one i know of has already dropped back to 4), and they take ASs in all of them.

Then usually drop 1 and continue to 3 A levels of their choice.

Seems to work - excellent grades last year, the first year of AS's being 'stand alone' not contributing to the A-level. Especially valuable to somewhat 'spiky' students like my DS, who will be able to apply to Uni with hopefully excellent ASs in the subjects he is really good at, rather than the slightly more mixed GCSE grades because of his spiky profile. Also good because he struggles with the exam process, so the more practice in 'exam technique' he gets the better.

Seems like a good compromise. :)

It would be a shame to restrict our brightest students to what we used to recommend only to the weaker students. Such a restricted range of subjects post-16 is very unusual internationally.

I'm sure your DD has done what's right for her personally, but I would be horrified if a superselective had such low expectations of its general intake.

Well I’m sorry noble but when I said “ 'may have a detrimental effect on their other grades” I meant that studying 4 s levels for a year, particularly with no intention of even finishing one of them may have a detrimental effect on their other grades. Not whatever alternative meaning you may choose to put on it. I meant exactly what I typed. Not your version of it.

Diluting effort for a while year on 4 instead of 3 subjects is bound to cut down on the amount of time that students have to devote to extra reading and other experiences which makes such a contribution to top and good grades.

Not to mention that for many students, the 4th a level is just that: a bit of an afterthought / padder that they intend to drop at the end of year 12 anyway.

My dd, like many others, decided at age about 7 what she wanted to study at uni. So your horror at narrowing down her curriculum is only welcomed by her as an opportunity to concentrate on the (as it happens 2) subjects she loves.

You said 'may have a detrimental effect on their other grades' which I read as 'incapable of managing', especially when this thread is about the brightest students.

I don't think that a broader curriculum should be sacrificed for brighter students as a matter of course and I still think the move to 3 A-levels is to the detriment of their education, which is what sixth form is ultimately about.

Sorry about the typos. Hope it makes sense

Did anyone say they were incapable. I know I didn’t. I think the idea is that it’s not especially the best use of their time. The amount of extra curricular activities age reading and work that my dd is expected to go is infinitely greater than was expected of me. Doing 3 A levels too a high standard doesn’t feel like an easy option for her at all. I think she’d find your view quite irritating to be honest. She’s working her socks off with 3 A levels to the very best of her ability.

She’ll end up with 3As which means she’ll have the pick of universities. If she did 4 she might get ABBB and while we are all congratulating her on 4 great A levels she’s missed she’s out on her first choice uni which needs AAB.

Up until last year, the vast majority of students did, and managed perfectly well, 4 subjects in Y12. The idea that even the brightest are suddenly incapable of managing this is bizarre. The enforced taking of 3 subjects only for 2 years means a narrow curriculum, students taking 'safe' choices instead of potentially difficult or unknown ones, and students who struggle with a subject having no option at all to drop it. What then? We now have the ridiculous situation of students carrying on into Y13 with a U in their Y12 exams because they did all right in their other subjects.

The new A-levels aren't like the new GCSEs, they're not meant to be harder, they're just linear.

If you're worried about dropping a subject in Y12 and not having anything to show for it, the option to sit an AS exam still remains.

I really disagree noble. I think it’s utterly pointless to slog away at a fourth subject for a year or two when the results don’t matter and may have a detrimental effect on the other grades. And I say that with a dd at one of the super selective grammars who was gently told that with her GCSE results (which were excellent but not 13 A*s material) that she’d be better off doing 3. She insisted on trying 4 and they let her. It lasted 3 weeks. She’s now doing 3 and predicted 3 As

Tbf the superselective grammar school is probably quite reasonable in expecting their highly able intake to be able to cope with 4, especially if one is FM which is nearly always taken as a 4th.

I think the move to restrict students to 3 even in Y12, especially bright students is appalling. It’s mainly to do with funding cuts, with no regard to the severe narrowing of education aged 16.

Why is the school insisting on 4 A levels when all universities say 3 is enough? I think I'd ask them that, again and again, until I was satisfied with their response.

I swapped A level subjects at Oct half term of what is now year 12. I don't think you could reasonably do it any later.

I too find it strange some schools insist on 4-5 A levels when universities (even Oxbridge ) only want to know about 3. I agree it would be very difficult to pick up another subject now - not impossible, but a lot of work and frankly unless she's really passionate about a subject, and it doesn't sound as if she is, then there's no point. Stick to 3 and excel.
Could be time for you to make contact with the school and explain the negative knock on effects that sticking with FM is having. Don't see why she would have to leave her existing class and teacher either; surely there would be no class clash

And just to add that with the abolition of (most) AS levels there seems little to no point in doing a 4th one to drop it st the end of year 12

I find the insistence on 4 subjects odd tbh. DD1 also attends the sixth form of a super selective grammar and only their top top students take 4 a levels. They believe it’s better to get 3 excellent A levels than 4 mediocre ones.

My DD has been given the option of an AS in her 4th subject once complete she can then choose to do it as an A2. Cant see how any school could push to do 5 a levels there’s barely enough time in the timetable for 4.

My DDs lucky not in a super selective school but only class bigger than 6 is maths.

I think it would depend on the school, and also which subject the student is changing to.

DS1 changed two of his subjects at October half term in Y12. He had to put in a fair amount of effort to catch up, but it was definitely the right decision.

Do they insist on AS levels? Usually students are allowed to go down to 3 in year 13 so if no AS levels any choice will broaden her education without having to cause extra exam stress.

Have the school said she can take on a new subject? I would not be happy about taking on a new student this far into the term - I have completed whole topics of work already within my subject.

And even if they did allow it, it would be incredibly stressful to attempt to catch up alongside 3 other A levels. It therefore probably wouldn't be an easy option compared to continuing with FM.

It's a bit tricky re resources because it's the new Further Maths A-level (not even sure if there are textbooks yet).
There's loads of stuff for the old FM A-level here: mrbartonmaths.com/students/a-level/a-level-notes.html so she should be able to find at least some of the stuff she is doing.

There are also videos for pretty much any maths topic on youtube if she searches for them.

Asking for help in lessons isn't any sort of indication that she's failing, merely that she's paying attention. Has she had any feedback from her teachers about how she is getting on and discussed how stressed she is with them?