Would you/have you started going to church to get child into a good church school?!

Nobody is forcing Christianity on anyone. Nobody has to attend.

10 years rather gives the lie to the idea that there are "Christian children" doesn't it ?

In all these threads and in the news, I have never read of the kids themselves being asked if they were Christians.
Some kids decide they are Christian, others merely accept the label given to them by their parents. I had quite strong religious views at 11, most kids don't, and a few have distinctly non-christian views, but that is apparently irrelevant.
What we have here is a process quite divorced from the spiritual needs of children.

Seems to me that children with non-Christian parents should be actively solicited so they might be saved, but they aren't because what we have here is our taxes being used to bribe parents to go through the rituals of Christianity.

Regular attendance for 10 years(either weekly or fortnightly) is required for the local C of E secondary.

My children both go to a catholic school, none of us are catholic. When we applied I stated that we were not catholic on the form and left it at that. As a family we have never been to church, but of course the children do when at school, they rather like going in fact.

I would certainly go back to the fold but dh has banned me from doing so! also our local state school (primary) is good. I know loads of people who have done just that though - lots and lots. My s used a rental property as her home address just to get dc into good primary. I think it sucks but all ethics seem to go out the window when it comes to education - witness the present government - the PM, Ruth Kelly, even D Cameron is down for a church school.
Instead of Education, Education, Education. He should have said: Selection Selection Selection!

The "cotton wool" thing doesn't apply just to playground fights, it's about how their thought processes grow. It's not enough to teach them the truth, they must be exposed to lies, wishful thinking and spun versions of events.

One thing I did in history was the "big lie", theory of propaganda. This worked for the European dictators of the mid 20th century. They of course got it from their Christian heritage.
An obvious parallel is the existence of Christ.
Even non-religious people have swallowed this, in spite of the quite striking lack of evidence. The Romans who were really into record keeping seemed to have missed him, and there exists not one single document of the time which mentions him. (unless you count the recently discovered grave of Christ...).
I'm dot saying he didn't exist, but there is no evidence either way.
The Old Testament is quite striking in that if anything there is a negative correlation between events and it's records. OK, the flood is a fairy story caused by ignorance of geology, but the huge events that best the Egyptians left no mark, no records or even the sort of discontinuity you'd expect.

Though like the grave of Christ, occasionally some Americans "find" the Noahs Ark. I recall about a dozen so far...

Thus religion will give my kids an insight intro how crap many people's thinking is, and how even quite smart people go along with the flow. That used to be out of fear of what superstitious mobs would do to you, but now, it's the long grind of politics.

Thus Christianity serves as examples how of

I went to a Catholic primary and a Catholic conven t school (because at the time my parents were practicing Catholics) and I was very happy at both - especially the primary school - but because I am lapsed and dh doesn't believe in any God or religion I didn't feel it was right to push ds towards a Catholic school. People pretending to be religious in order to get their child into a faith school might also think about how they may be depriving a bona fide Catholic child of a place.

Don't know about C of E schools but catholic schools do not wrap the children up in cotton wool. Subjects such as death aren't hidden from them and as many have further to travel to school get used to using public transport at a fairly early age.

Regular churchgoers recognise when it is coming up to school application time as the church is packed with families of three year olds and ten year olds who will then sit at the front. The priests/vicars aren't daft they can see it coming as well.

Maybe I am wrong but could the faith schools be succeeding because the parents have actively chosen to send a child there and therefore are fully supportive of the school and its staff - the same probably applies to selective and independent schools

If I were a more-or-less-believer, sort-of churchgoer then I would probably be prepared to up my keenness quotient and attendance levels to get my DCs into the "right" school. Mind you, under those circumstances I'd probably be trying to keep it up anyway because one thing I do like about organised religion is the sense of community that can spring up around a good church.

As an active unbeliever, though, I wouldn't. But I don't object to other active unbelievers doing it if they feel it's right.

DC, do you think that sending them to a church school is better or worse than an ordinary state school? And if so in which ways? Because if you're not into 'wrapping in cotton wool' then wouldn't it be better to let them tough it out in the ordinary state school system? Your posts leave me curious.

Well, I wouldn't. Admittedly it's a long way off for me with DS being only 2, but I despise religion and disapprove of faith schools because they are discriminatory and divisive. If, when DS gets to the changing schools age, there isn't anywhere reasonable to get him into, then I'll home school him. Have no idea, incidentally, if the church schools round here are better or worse than the non-church schools. BUt home schooling sounds better than having him taught creationism, or abstinence-led sex education, or social discrimination, or homophobia...

Choosing a school requires trade offs, and yes that means exposing DCs to superstition.
It's pretty mild at the school, and DSs are both very smart and self possessed. Hard to see them losing their free will. I've seen the opposition, and fear it not.
I don't think you build a good adult by wrapping the child in cotton wool. DS1 understands wishful thinking, and the ?horrible histories? have given an inkling of what the endgame of what happens when you give people like that power. He sussed out Bush all by himself.

Ummm DC ... let me get this straight ... Because you're not "selfish and self-centred" you won't deprive your children of an education which will teach them to be like the other "mentally ill" religious people they will become friends with, while alienating them from you, their "evil" parents ...

Do you think it's perhaps you changed schools?

I trust explicit numbers from the BBC, and given their bias, I use their figure since no one is going to accuse the BBC of making religion seem unimportant. The real figure is presumably smaller, inevitably since even with their superstition-friendly spin, the gap between the counting and the reporting means it has declined yet more before publication.

haha, just caught up with this thread!

DC, I though you didn't trust statistics from the BBC?

And pmsl at Motherinferior's posts

(sorry Bomper, you were asking a serious question ).

Oh god I hope not. I'm already lying about being married

no - it's just wrong and dishonest

I went to a C of E school, because it was the best school in the area. My parents lied that they were church goers and attended church only to secure me a place. I would do the same if in that situation.

There was none of this, 'filling my head' with religion. We had RE lessons, as normal and sang hymns in assembley. That's as far as it went.

"mentally ill" DC? In what respect?

No. I find it an odd idea. If I haven't "got religion" to the point of wanting to set foot in a church myself, then why on earth would I want my kids' heads to be filled with it every day?

I still think that if five to 10 per cent of women (including transgendered ones) identify as lesbian - and I don't even want to think of blokes who identify as lesbian - they're highly unlikely all to be sexually active in any given week.

Unless all my lesbian friends are extremely uncharacteristic, of course.

Is that women having lesbian sex, or really people?

And no I wouldn't go to church for any reason, including education. I have the greatest respect for a number of friends who do hold religious beliefs but I personally don't.

If you think all those lesbians are having sex every week...

Mercy, church attendance is so low that all sorts of minority occupations outsize it.

Church attendance is around 6.3 % according to the BBC who actually have the job of encouraging it.
Less unpopular
Accurate figures for lesbians are a bit harder to find, but seem to vary between 5 and 10%.

Even allowing for the fact that some people's Christianity does not include church attendance, there are far more people at discriminating schools than who ever observe their rituals.

DC1 is at a CoE school. As it happens, the chaplain knows my religious views, one discussion some years ago left me with a scar...
But I wonder what happens with parents who've lied ? If like most people, you simply don't care very much, there's no issue I suppose.
But if like us you regard religious people as mentally ill, how do you cope with the fact that your kids come home spouting all sorts of hysterical superstition and beginning to suspect you are evil ?