Is igcse science a lot harder than GCSE science

Yes, they sure were...

It's so complicated.

Did a quick goggle and it looks like coursework is 'optional' in some exam boards for iGCSE but that would suggest they then did more exams.

Either way, for a whole host of reasons, I feel really sorry for anyone doing the new GCSEs in English (actually more specifically Lit) this year. One of the exams - one!- is 2 1/4 hours long with AQA.

Obviously , we are mainly talking about bright children on this thread for whatever reasons but imagine the least able enduring that. I feel like weeping. It has been known :(
The new English Language AQA GCSE is actually rather solid and sensible and methodical. What they have to read is rather archaic.But it's at least structured and predicable, to an extent.

beans it's a couple of years ago now so I don't recall. I think more work went in to Lit.

I remember that DD's GCSE English had endless CAs which were bloody time consuming but great for banking swathes of good marks.

Get , do you remember if that one exam involved any revision? This is genuine curiosity... one terminal exam doesn't seem much unless it was very long and detailed!! GCSE always had two exams.. I think... God, everything changes so much I no longer have any confidence in my memory!!

When I started teaching it was 100% coursework nostalgic sigh

I am beginning to sound a bit like Gove. the horror.

That's part of the problem though with iGCSE Abraiid... how can it be so unregulated that each exam board even has differing % of coursework, from 40% to none!

I can't recall our board but we did three coursework assignments and then I had to sit through the torture of endless speeches...

My DS did no coursework or speaking and listening for his IGCSE English.

Just one terminal exam in year 11.

My daughter's English Language IGCSE did not include speaking and listening. I repeat, there is more than one IGCSE syllabus/qualification. Just as there with GCSE.

I teach IGCSE English language at a private school.

We chose it because of the 40% coursework element.

All our Nice But Dims have not only us, but also lovely helpful tutors at home.

Our results are very very good indeed .

I ma interested that iGCSE MFL is superior . My son loves languages but even he knows he is drilled to get through the GCSE and he is worried he'll crash and burn at A level. My friend, who teaches Spanish, is still sulking at the changes made to GCSE because , I think, she has lost control of being able to do their CAs for them
I agree it's too easy. But my other friend who teaches Languages at a private school does GCSE, too, so I think the iGCSE in anything other than the core is quite unusual?

But.. this must be because it's an international GCSE , surely? It assumes a different linguistic experience prior to 14/15?

My big concern is students' results being compared against each other at uni application stage.. but I guess it was ever thus.

LOL.

Not sure sense of humour bypass MNers will appreciate that...

Marketing isn't an issue for a lot of these schools. They never photograph their pupils jumping up and down with clutches of top grades or ask their pupils into school to receive results. They don't send out press releases

really?? the six private schools which dominate my town do!! Blonde girls with shiny hair and everything...

I would also add that I teach A level English to students who have iGCSE English grades A and B and they are not suitable A level candidates, compared to those (form the same school) who got As and Bs in the old GCSE.

This may, of course, mean the issues lie only with English. The iGCSE has coursework and the exam is basically comprehensions. There's also a speaking and listening element.:all rather lovely.

Off topic on to maths slightly - my DH teaches maths at a selective private school where they do iGCSE. he brings home maths papers for my state educated son to do as revision (year 11). He routinely gets B to low A. In the new maths GCSE the poor soul is doing at his sate school, he is currently working at grade 5.

I think my husband's shock at the difference is a little more than anecdotal ...

I also myself teach a boy who is working at the 4/5 borderline in the new English GCSE. He sat iGCSE English via one of mummy's connections in November and got a 6. He is orally bright and fairly intelligent (very lazy!) but he CANNOT spell.

I am just hoping against hope for my own boy and the legions of children doing the new GCSEs in whatever kind of school that the grade boundaries are put in sensible places..

Science , I have no experience of, OP - sorry :)

I have one twin who took GCSE and one who took IGCSE.

Both went private.

The twin who took IGCSE went to a much more selective school that had no need to worry about grades or marketing.

The school chose it to avoid the endless modules that existed at the time and to expose pupils to that bit more science ( especially those who would not be taking them in sixth form).

It's sticking with IGCSE I believe whilst things bed down with the new changes.

Historically (i.e. 7 -10 years ago) when selective private schools moved over to IGCSE maths and science courses it appears they were chosen because they were seen to be more challenging and rigorous. According to the links below, GCSE science was very 'dumbed down' a few years ago although I expect things have evened out now. I don't think the perceived easiness in obtaining a Grade C in English Language IGCSE has much relevance to IGCSE maths and science.

www.theguardian.com/science/2009/mar/27/gcses-science-dumbed-down

www.independent.co.uk/news/education/schools/the-appliance-of-real-science-should-all-children-take-the-igcse-2026801.html

"Parents at Parkside became even more alarmed when curriculum reform in the mid-2000s, ostensibly to make science more relevant and accessible, brought in a new emphasis on ethical issues, such as organ transplant and abortion. The new "tick-box" multiple-choice exams did not require pupils to write any scientific term or recall formulas, and led to widespread concern. A group of teachers took the unusual step of launching a Downing Street petition deploring the loss of scientific content."

"Even the official exam regulator, Ofqual, called on the exam boards to improve standards, arguing that questions about the advantages and disadvantages of CCTV, mobile phones and the internet were no substitute for the principles of physics."

"Under pressure from scientists and teachers, the Government ordered a report from its curriculum advisers. The report concluded in 2007 that the IGCSE should not be endorsed for the state sector because it was too difficult and was out-of-step with the national curriculum, covering material that had been moved over into the higher AS- level exam."

www.theguardian.com/education/2009/mar/04/private-schools-gcses-manchester-grammarschool

Martin Stephen, high master of St Paul's school in Barnes, west London, said: "The new GCSEs (2009) are appalling for the most able students. They are simply pap, they are baby food, they are examination rusks in too many subjects, and they do not stretch and challenge the most able." The school offers IGCSEs in maths, science and music and is considering expanding them.

We always avoided igcse cos it supposed to be so much harder and were gobsmacked when we actually looked at it. Subsequently, all our lower sets were pulled from aqa and sat igcse. I didn't schools allowed to do them anymore-or I'd that only if they want it to count the bucket thing?

The English igcse was definitely a lot easier than Aqa. I think the maths one was too. Gutted we can't still do it.

DS2's school doesn't publish its IGCSE results As and A*s at this level are a given. It does however publish its Pre U results.

Exams are just hoops to jump through. Clever students will do what is required and get the top grades regardless of the syllabus, make up of the exam etc. Less clever students will find them more challenging.

Well, you must be alive to the possibility that they're lying if they say openly and directly that they have chosen the most challenging and rigorous courses and you say that you believe they choose courses that are easier to get good grades in. Both things can't be true. That's all.

I don't think you quite get what I am saying. I am not saying the schools are lying, I am saying that there are a number of reasons why one course may be more suitable than another which has nothing to do with which is perceived 'easiest'.

Of course these schools worry about marketing - they might not have full page advertisements in the local rag to attract enough students but they are still competing for the top flight students (and parents) and for the attention of their alumni who are normally a source of substantial funding.

Marketing isn't an issue for a lot of these schools. They never photograph their pupils jumping up and down with clutches of top grades or ask their pupils into school to receive results. They don't send out press releases. But that's another issue related to league tables.

Of course, blaeberry, you're right in many ways about what it is preparation for. I think you're wrong though in that when you have lots of very able children, you're not worried about them not getting the top grade. You're choosing exams that you think will challenge your most able pupils. But we can disagree about that. As I say, maybe all the teachers are lying when they explain why they constantly review the courses.

However, specifically describing the Edexcel science course they've chosen as 'more rigorous and demanding' (though I guess it doesn't say than what) seems a clear statement. They are currently reviewing their Maths IGCSE in view of the new GCSE specification.

I probably have a similar experience to a previous poster in that I've seen GCSE study guides for by (one) of my friend's children compared to my son's IGCSE in sciences, and my son's covered more material. But that's one example so hardly robust.

My daughter managed AS maths grade A having done IGCSE maths and the double award igcse science helped net her a medical school offer this year.

There are different Igcse boards. They're not all the same.