What do you think of these A'level subject choices

For the record - I know someone who got onto a law degree at Oxford with German, Chemistry and Economics.

Economics is a very well regarded subject.

Oh I agree Error, but I wish someone would tell the school's/govt, from ks1 up. Actually, I'm thinking if doing Alevel politics with DS1 for that reason. It's not a subject that appealed to me when I was young, but I'd love to be better informed now. DS1 thinks it's a very bad idea

I always thought the fourth was more about providing flexibility than the value of the fourth AS though

The flexibility is (IMO) very important but when we talk of 'value' I think sometimes on MN threads like this it seems to be focussed on 'does it improve my uni application' rather than 'will I learn something useful or interesting'. Education as an end in itself not just a means to an end.

In the case of FM its pretty clear that for some courses there would be real value in doing it to AS because it will cover more concepts (eg not sure if its changed but the current spec single maths doesn't appear to include imaginary numbers at all). DD did comp sci to AS and definitely learned some useful stuff. But there is a problem with the new format, its not necessarily been designed well for use as AS/A2 - the school policy last year was to put everyone in for AS(which was good for DD) but the teacher said it would have been better to teach things in a different order.

DS's school are still suggesting take four and drop one if it's too much. They're also still doing AS, but it seems that just means covering much of the sane material twice?

I always thought the fourth was more about providing flexibility than the value of the fourth AS though

Is it possible your DS could stay at hus school but do physics at another Op? I did one fairly obscure A level because our school had an excellent and very enthusiastic teacher for that subject and there was a boy from another school who joined us just for that one whist doing his other Alevels at his own school

Doing 3 A levels including FM from the outset would be quite risky for someone borderline A/A* at gcse and (I'm assuming)hasn't done additional maths (is that still a thing? I'm not clear where things are at with the gcse changes). While it is a myth that universities will only accept FM as a fourth subject (on numerate courses), starting yr 12 with it as one of 3 would surely only be a good idea for kids who clearly have the ability and know they will want to do a course for which their 3 choices are appropriate.

Re the suggestion of considering a DT subject instead of economics- on the face of it that sounds sensible, however its probably worth checking the course specifications for that and the computing because I think they both entail a significant chunk of project work. That would probably mean a lot of sustained work to get decent grades, and the OP's DS sounds like a bit of a 'winger' so two subjects like that mightn't suit his temperature.

Yes, I think FM is a tricky one. Fair play this is many years ago, but I didn't take FM because my school didn't offer it (tbh, I'd never even heard of it nor knew it was a option - ditto STEP, S levels etc etc). I studied economics at uni, and not having that extra maths knowledge definitely was a disadvantage, even then when the subject was less maths-y than it is now. I suspect engineering, compsci etc would all be the same issue.

But equally it's obviously a real step harder again than maths A level, and plenty of people struggle with that after GCSEs even without adding a fourth harder subject into the mix!

DD has friends who are good at maths (A) at GCSE and are finding further maths very difficult. IMO the teacher isn't great, but unless the OP's son is going to get an A or equivalent at maths I wouldn't bother looking at further maths A level.

If your DS is as quantitative as those choices suggest, he might want to do Further Maths which is excellent preparation for many more competitive university courses.

True, bojo but I think that economics and computing are both well-regarded subjects though. I doubt there would be many universities who would look down on him because of the subject choices. The issue, of course, is what he might want to do later. It's easy to rule yourself out of a career by making the wrong A-Level choices. I've known a number of people who have had to do an extra A-Level later (often physics or chemistry) because they discovered they needed them for their chosen course.

When pupils did 3 A levels back in the day, there didn't seem to be a problem regarding getting into university because most schools offered a fairly narrow diet of A levels and the vast majority were facilitating. Therefore getting into university was not a problem because you inevitably had the correct subjects. There was no Busuness Studies or Computer Science. At my school there was Art, Music, Economics, RE and possibly Domestic Science and Technical Drawing, but not much else on top of the facilitating subjects. No Philosophy, Psychology, PE, Sociology, Law, Media Studies, Drama, Politics, Art History, Classical Civilisation, Photography, etc.

mean - use the option of starting with four subjects.

I agree that he should not do four full subjects but instead use the option of four to find out what he is capable of and prefers.
A bright but laid back boy may actually do better once he is required to think a bit rather than regurgitate learnt facts at GCSE standard.

I'd suggest he also looks at possible career paths with particular degrees he might be interested in. That way he can see whether A level choices close anything off. When I was in his position (decades ago) I was given information on what a specific degree might lead to by the careers service.

You mention he might be interested in actuarial science. If he's interested in an actuarial career any numerate degree would get him in, but he needs to be happy to study and work hard (outside of work) in order to qualify. If he likes to coast along this is unlikely to be a good path for him.

Yes, I know, but he doesn't want to! That for me would be a main reason not to force the issue. He'd have to work pretty hard to do all 4, so given that he's not keen to start with, I think it would be a bad idea. He'd risk getting 4 mediocre grades rather than 3 potentially good ones.

It also sounds as if his predicted grades are As rather than A*s. Obviously these are very good, but perhaps not enough to convince me he should do 4.

lapinlapin that is right but most private schools and some state schools will still allow the flexibility of four including taking a fourth decoupled AS level particularly for FM.

Yes, A-Levels are changing - going back to the old way of a 2 year course, with no need to do the AS exam. The idea of doing 4 and dropping 1 was introduced when A-Levels weres split 50-50 between AS and A2.

Rickandmorty in the case of OP's DS his school does allow four A levels.

Age I just wanted to add that even if he can't do physics a Further Maths AS level as a fourth subject would be of use for any of the directions his other subjects lead to.

Advice about number of A levels is slightly outdated. The majority of schools for the new A Levels are expecting students to just take 3 from September. It will no longer be the norm to take 4 and drop 1.

When there is the option of doing 4 though as in the case of OP's DS then I would strongly encourage DCs to start with 4 if only as an extended taster of the subjects at A level / preU standard with the aim of dropping the least liked at the end of the first term (or even first halferm). The scenario that BackforGood describes does not seem uncommon.

OP your DS could look at a listing of undergraduate courses such as those here at Sheffield www.sheffield.ac.uk/prospectus/subjectList.do?prospectusYear=2017
I notice that for degree subjects like artificial intelligence and computing or systems engineering there only maths is obligatory and Computer Science can substitute for physics.

If he does n't get the A* in physics and economics is not really his thing, would he consider starting a fourth A level in something like DT / Electronics that would give him a useful component of physics and engineering type skills?

Otherwise if he is very keen on physics and prepared to work a bit harder to do it, my tactic with the school would be to ask the school if he could start with the preU as a fourth subject even if he gets an A to drop it after first term if it is too tough.

I reckon that will result in quite a few having to redo yr 12 with different subjects. Or end up not being able to do the university course they want.

I'd definitely suggest people encourage their kids to go to a couple of uni open days after gcses to help them get an idea of courses they might be interested in and the requirements.

But most younger kids aren't going to have that choice. My y11 ds's school are encouraging three A levels plus some sort of enrichment, but are being clear that whatever you start in September, that's what they expect you to do for two years. Some will still do 4, and a few will do 5 I'm sure, but those numbers will be way down on what they've been in previous years.

We had it drilled into us we must do 4 at AS, all dutifully did, no one used that fourth AS. Waste of time & energy

They have (used the 4th choice) in dd's school (she's Yr13). dd started 6th form convinced she was going to do a certain degree - took the 2 subjects she needed for that and 2 other subjects she just enjoyed (standard at her school to do 4). Turns out the 2 she had loved up to GCSE just didn't do it for her at A-level.... don't know how much struggling with the work made the subject unappealing or if it was the subject now being unappealing that made her struggle with the work. However, on looking round universities and talking to students at end of Yr12, her passion has now become one of the "other 2" subjects. She was able to drop one of the (previously thought as) certs, and still have 3 A-levels.
She is by no means the only one.

Ds is doing economics and not enjoying it. Says it's not what he thought it would be so definitely get your ds to check out the spec.