A* or A in maths. Does it matter?

Wow, well done to your DS, those are amazing results!

It does make me wonder what they were making the fuss about back in December though!

1805 Congratulations to your DS!

I followed with interest. Our school decided not to enter the top 2 sets early this year (who traditionally take iGCSE Maths early in year 10). Their reasoning was they wanted to see where the grade boundaries will be set for the 9-1 markings.

Our school is very strong in Maths (last year A* - 157 pupils, A - 14 pupils, B- 3 pupils C-1 pupil (none lower than a C).

They wanted to ensure everyone had the best chance at getting a 9. So this year and next only year 11s are sitting Maths early. After that they feel they'll know where the levels are and it may go back to early entry Maths.

Whereas those that took Maths early then went on to Additional Maths in year 11 they will now do it as an extra iGCSE alongside there others.

Good luck to him in the rest of his exams and with his eventual Oxbridge application.

This child will be "competing" for an Oxbridge place against students who have grades 8 or 9 on the new harder GCSE maths specification.

For that reason, the A or A* - would to me, carry less weight regardless.

Perhaps they are going on to do the new specification next. In which case, don't worry.

From what I am hearing from DB (physicist), DD1 (biochemist) and DD2 (A levels in maths and sciences) all the sciences are very maths heavy. To the point where at some levels I am seeing them as branches of one big subject.

The big question about early GCSE is what is done afterwards. DD1 did maths early then all the school offered after was statistics which she found neither use nor ornament as prep for going into maths A level. The school realised this had been a mistake so by the time DD2 did GCSEs she was able to do maths early then do GCSE further maths. This has been far better as a run up to maths and further maths A levels.

1805 I think you are misunderstanding what PPs are saying about the fact of his maths being relatively weak and future degree choices. It is not about lowering aspirations but understanding what degrees in subjects like physics, engineering or chemistry entail. The question which is worth considering even at this early stage is would he enjoy and be suited to maths heavy degrees.
However it sounds as through he has a very good chance of an A at GCSE maths if he is prepared to practise because the school is experienced in knowing the levels of its pupils. Even if he does n't achieve the A through taking it rather early (and perhaps being prone to careless errors for example), he may still really like maths and have the ability to tackle difficult topics at higher level with ease.
Don't necessarily assume though that even the best of schools are infallible in their guidance of A level subjects and degree choice.

I think you have to trust his teachers at this stage, and let things take their course. He can always resit the Maths GCSE if he doesn't get the A*.

Is he really suited to Oxbridge sciences if Maths is his weakest subject?

Agree with Richmal that it would be very difficult indeed to rock the boat and school and insist on withdrawing the DS from the exam.

OP my DS took maths a year early in middle set and has just got 100% in each of his AS units. Those sorts of marks go into the UCAS reference. Oxford medicine is a bit unique in the sense of needing a stack of A* but other sciences are able to look at the application more holistically. Potential isn't capped at GCSE, even in maths.

I'm amused by the quote upthread that 'only on mumsnet are kids totally and utterly self motivated, with no whip cracking from school or parents. It's like Billy Elliott on here, honestly.'

My DD is driven. Totally self motivated. I spend the school holidays actively encouraging her to see her friends and to take it easy. Which she doesn't do. But she has been predicted 6As and 6A*s and it will be the end of the world in her eyes if she doesn't achieve that. She has a whiteboard on her wall with a countdown to whatever the next set of GCSE exams it is.

She's always worked extremely hard, enjoys school work (and does find it easy) and is her own motivation. She finds the social side of school more difficult, doesn't suffer fools (those that mess around in lessons or not work hard) gladly and just wants to do the best she can.

I do think I'm extremely lucky that she doesn't need nagging to do her work or revise, but at the same time I often worry about her state of mind and stress levels.

We were initially told that due to the new exam structure in Wales, that they would not be entering anyone for their exams early. But come this year and that had changed. All levels of pupils did their papers in her school. I think it's to get a grade under their belt if they can do well. And to then target and retake it if they don't get a good grade or the grade they really wanted.

Agree, why on earth would they enter students early for any exam, does not benefit anyone top or bottom students.

I think the Summer iGCSE exams are actually in May. Why rush and take this exam in January when he will probably obtain an A* in the Summer?
What are the school planning on taking in Y11 - if he is planning on A level Maths there will need to be some sort of Maths taken in Y11.
It may not be a problem if he stays at current school for A levels, but taking exams early could be a problem if he moves elsewhere.
For A level Maths the A or A won't make a difference, but if Further Maths is possible then sixth forms usually require As.

Wanting them to go to a good university and have a good career is being a mum.

And it's perfectly possible to do both things without an a star in maths, or going to oxbridge!

Does your son want to put the work in over Christmas? Would you have the time, ability or inclination to help him? I would wait until you are sure he has a very good chance of getting A*. However, it can be hard to rock the boat and say no at the place where he will be at school for the next 4 years.
If you do decide he should do the exam, he needs to not only do exams as practice, but to go over the mark scheme to see where he is loosing marks and to learn the stock phrases which keep coming up. It will save time if he can reel these off in the exam.
I'm guessing, if it is an IGCSE, you have paid for him to go to a good school. However, I cannot see why wanting a good education for your child is a bad thing. Wanting them to be a doctor or a lawyer is being pushy. Wanting them to go to a good university and have a good career is being a mum.

There is lots and lots of maths in chemistry and physics. Maths often seems to be a platform, so that comes first before you can do the subject stuff. DS is studying economics at University but the advice he received, which was to do as much maths as he could at school, because it made first year University easier, almost certainly holds true for other subjects.

I remember overhearing DS discuss A level results with an Asian boarder friend. Essentially some boys who had always been good at maths did not do as well as expected whilst others did far better. DS concluded that hard work and practice had made a lot of difference. His Asian friend was astounded that DS had not realised this.

He should do the work now, though that may be hard to explain to a 14 year old. Unless he is struggling with concepts, and A level maths will be a slog. In which case he should probably revise an ambition to study physics.

Presumably the school is trying to decide whether to put him in early. I would be surprised if a private school was putting anyone in early if they were not going to land the A*.

I assume it is for the good mathematicians. GCSE is not a huge hurdle for those with aptitude. Some schools may like to get it over with so that kids can then move onto to Add maths (which is what DD did after taking the GCSE in January) or perhaps plan for a three year A level course. The advantage of that would be to allow more scope for taking Further Maths A level as a fourth A level.

Your DS must be reasonable able. In which case GCSE is really a matter of practice. He should decide whether he wants to do something sciency, in which case, and depending on what the school do next, he should practice past papers like blazes over Christmas and land the A*. Or decide maths is not his thing and he is unlikely to want to take a degree with a high maths content. In which case, drop to a lower set and enjoy taking things a bit easier.

Its not really about Oxbridge, but keeping doors open. He may decide he wants to be a medic, where A* in maths really can matter, or an economist or engineer where good A level maths will be required for good courses. The problem now is that without AS levels, Universities will look at GCSE results to put A level predictions into context. Its less of a problem for Oxbridge who put huge resources into entrance exams, interviewing etc. It could be more of an issue if applying to oversubscribed courses elsewhere (LSE, say, do not interview) and where GCSE maths may well be used as an initial filter.

Oxford has to whittle down the applicants for places based on Alevel predictions so they do take GCSE results into consideration. So some applicants get immediate rejection and the best get an interview followed by either a conditional or unconditional offer of a place.

It is a fact that you are unlikely to get into Oxford without excellent GCSEs. It is a fact that it matters less for Cambridge. And it is a fact that some institutions require a certain number of GCSEs to be taken in a single sitting.

These facts aren't actually facts. Under the new system of no AS grades, GCSEs are likely to matter as much for Cambridge as for Oxford.

Which institutions/courses have a rigid requirement that a certain number of GCSEs have to be taken in one sitting? I'm an academic and I actually don't know any course that has a rigid requirement. For one thing, it would be ludicrous to hold a school's silly behaviour against a strong candidate. For another, many home educated pupils don't have GCSEs at all or of they do have GCSEs they have often taken them in several different sittings.

Maybe need to qualify what leaning towards sciences means. Often degrees that require sciences also require maths.

I'd also agree that doing it early may not be best if he's going to require it at a level, will he be straight into studying it next year?

It's simply a lot of kids who get a star in maths GCSE struggled with a level, not as in fail, but they struggle to get the same A star at a level, depends on the kid. My daughter got a star in maths, and considered it, in her words "an easy exam" and most of the kids feel the same. She didn't do maths A a level, but the ones who did and also got a star, felt the leap between the two was huge.

There's always a big leap between GCSE and a level, but for some reason, maths is the one most of my daughters friends felt had the biggest leap.

There's nothing wrong with being pushy, as long as it's not too early or damaging to the kid and is simply helping them achieve their potential. Some kids are lazy little sods and do need a bit of a push.

I didn't push my daughter, because yes the sdhool did. im not sure if say uni does, but they like to pile on the work..😂