Sixth form - how tough is it? Opinions welcome

If the EPQ is going to jeopardise better results in the A levels then it is not going to add value and would be better dropped.

I do wonder if schools are keeping up with the shifting sands in higher education. My DD's school was encouraging students to start 5 A levels which just seems like madness.

"Most unis, to my knowledge, don't make offers based on EPQ anyway."

If it's a points offer, the EPQ is worth 50% points they can use for university entry.

If it's an offer university, then universities are increasingly making reduced offers on gaining the A in the EPQ. This year, at least 13 universities are doing this including Bath, Southampton, Birmingham, Leicester etc. Does depend on the subject though. But it is increasingly being used as part of an offer by more and more universities.

Is there no way that she can drop the EPQ OP? DD, now 1st year at Uni, started doing it and realised that she would struggle with her other important subjects if she continued. School were keen for her to carry on, but once she went and spoke the head of sixth form and explained how she was struggling, she was able to drop it. She ended up getting into her first choice, good uni which possibly may not have been the case if she'd spread herself too thinly by carrying on. It may be worth getting her to ask. Most unis, to my knowledge, don't make offers based on EPQ anyway.

I googled it, looks very interesting. If that is what is pulling her forward then all power to her.

I only put the caveat in about psychology because too many of my DCs' friends started it thinking it would be fun and not too difficult only to find they have got it utterly wrong.

It looks like your DD has a good sense of what the subject would entail.

Thank you Gnome. My daughter is now thinking to do Computational Psychology with linguistics, hence the psychology A level. However, thanks for the heads up, I shall let her know what you dd said about this subject.

Biology, Maths and German are all facilitating subjects (subjects which RG universities require for entry). The Psychology isnt a facilitating subject and according to DD is currently the subject causing the most stress and tears.

Has your DD any idea what area she would like to study after A levels? There is no harm in starting this conversation now. It is an iterative process. What to study at degree level means what to study at A level. Dont like those A levels then back to the degree choices and round again.

A levels are a means to an end rather than being an end in themselves. Choosing A levels should be a fun process. Lots of thinking and visualising different futures.

Good luck to your DD in her GCSE year.

Gnome thank you so much for the advice. My DD is thinking along the lines of Biology, Psychology, German and Maths. All of these seem quite challenging A levels for me.

Scarydinosaurs. English Language at A level is not a facilitating subject. On the Russell Group website they state English Langage without Literature is only accepted by a few universities. It is not offered by lots of schools for this reason.

If a young person is struggling with the workload, perhaps not doing one activity every night needs to be addressed in the light of the workload. De stressing it might be, revising for a test it is not. Go to the gym after the test or at school ( if it has one). In a free period for example. Most students adjust their daily routine according to the needs of the course.

Puzzledmum something I have observed having had three DCs go down the STEM route (oldest at uni in a STEM subject, middle at college on a STEM BTEC, youngest doing 4 STEM A levels) is how different all three have reported the advanced studies are from GCSE.

Many STEM subjects change enormously between GCSE and A level. The subjects are different ( physics, maths and chemistry start to form an unholy alliance, biology turns into an essay subject). The study methods which deliver success at GCSE (memorising) wont work at A level. A level is about understanding and applying.

All three of my DCs have reported friends finding biology and psychology very different from what they expected and also far harder.

Basically, you and your DD need to read through the syllabuses for the possible A level choices. Read up about what each entails. One of my DDs decided against History for A level when she realised she would be spending an awful lot of her time looking at the Russian Revolution!

English language has lots of theory and is very challenging- I cannot agree with PP who suggested it isn't academic.

Have you asked your DD what would help? Is she struggling to complete the assignments on her own? Would she benefit from a tutor to sit and do homework with her until she feels more confident in her own ability? Or are you able to set aside time to be with her whilst she is working so she can refer to you if she is stuck? It sounds as if she feels like she is drowning and a bit isolated in her worries; sometimes it just takes a bit of reassurance that you ARE doing the right thing and you ARE on the right track to feel better.

Watching with interest as I have a DD Y11, currently thinking of A level choices.

My eldest really struggled with 6th form. She is now having a year out and we are still seeing the signs and stress in her that her last two years of school caused. She did ok, BCC but the days where she couldn't get out of bed for crying where awful for us all. She has agreed to resit the 2 C exams. But she hasn't been in school and refuses to step foot in the place. I am hoping time might heal wounds, but there are no guarantees.

I found the jump from GCSE to A Level rather big. I was shocked as to how much more difficult things were. I did Chemistry, Maths and Physics. I was so stressed that I practically failed (grade Ds and Us) all of them at the end of the 1st year.

I was lucky that the sixth form allowed me to repeat the 1st year. I did the same subjects, with totally new teachers and that made a big difference. The new maths teacher was brilliant with us (about 4 of us repeated that year); he never made us feel like failures but I remember one thing he said to us and it stuck with me the whole time. He said, "See this new start as that. Assume you are learning everything first time and see how it goes. I know you are all smart enough." Best thing he could have said because it all then made sense 2nd time round. I was a year older, more determined, more organised (this is very important for independent study) and the grades improved tremendously.

I got As in maths and science GCSEs but that seemed not to be enough at the beginning. A change in teachers seemed to have done the trick for me at A Level.

Tell your DD to stick with it. Does she actually love the subjects? Because even when I found the sciences difficult, I could not see myself doing anything else. I loved the subjects (and still do) so much that even when I got terrible marks during tests, my love for the subjects thrived on the challenge. That will also make a difference to how your DD puts in the effort. I probably put a lot more effort in maths because I enjoyed it slightly more than the other sciences.

I ended up with ABD and I did a STEM degree. I am also doing a STEM job. What I am trying to say, is that it is hard but she will pull through. The good thing also is that you seem to be a lovely supportive mum. I was so scared at the time when I decided to repeat the 1st year as to what my mum would say. She was ok with it but the fear of her disappointment in me made the stress worse. I could have talked to her a lot earlier in the year when things became unbearably difficult.

I have heard from many people that the jump from GCSE to A -levels is the biggest jump anywhere on your education travels.
A lot of fairly able dc can get through GCSEs on ability alone, and then they move into 6th form and find they don't actually know how to study, and how to revise and ^how to cope when they don't just 'get it' straight away.
A lot of dc either leave or re-do Yr12.
Sciences and Maths are reputed to be particularly difficult a jump, and it is not uncommon for pupils to have to achieve an A or A* to be able to move to do them at A-Level.

ugh it is really tough

my ds told me that in his yr 12 approx half the total students didn't continue into yr 13

at his college bs and cs at gcse means you are probably in the bottom half of the year

if you feel she is working as hard as she can she will either get into the swing of it all and do well or maybe have to consider other options.its really not the end of the world - its about what is best for her :)

good luck

I disagree Bojoro an hour doing exercise should be fine if she finds it anjoyable and a way to destress.

I think anyone with a B or a C in any science will not find A level sciences easy. However, PE and English Language are not the most academic A levels, so the Biology is probably stretching her more and is more challenging. I think a B at this stage is perfectly OK. I would mention to the teacher that her style of teaching is unsettling DD. Do not accuse her of shouting, but do say that your DD responds to encouragement and a calm approach to telling her where she needs to improve. Your DD would appreciate that, and so would you.

My DD didn't find the transition to A levels particularly difficlult but for some it was. University essay wriing can be a challenge for some too! As can actually getting to the lectures!

I do not think an hour at the gym every night is a good plan during A levels either. Is this necessary every day? Seems just a touch fanatical.

What did she get at GCSE?
If she got a B then she got about half marks.

The teacher shouting is a sign she is not coping. Though unpleasant, it's no reflection on your dd.

My dd is in Y13 and doing sciences. Unfortunately, the constant tests are normal. She does a lot of past papers as part of her revision.

I think the move from gcse to a level for sciences can be quite confusing as things learnt for gcse are then replaced at a level. They aren't built on instead they are thrown away.

Some further tips from my DD:

• stop worrying about what the teacher says. They all seem to come out with versions of 'come on, my year 10s can do this'. It means nothing.
• your DD may need to attend EPQ lessons but that doesn't mean she has to spend any effort on it. Any uni offer will be based on 3 subjects.

Yes, I did means ASs. The school's current Y11 are still doing them but DS's year won't.

The school have said they won't be having end of Y11 internal exams, to allow for more teaching time. Having said that, they have a fairly narrow ability band and stringent entry requirements for sixth form, so that decision might have been made to suit their cohort; I can see the sense in having end of Y11 mocks.

They've just announced that they are dropping AS2s completely, so that pupils will do 3 subjects to A level, or 4 if they are exceptionally able. There will be no exams at the end of year 11.

Do you mean ASs? This is standard now. I presume there will be internal mocks at the end of year 12 to help the school and the students with predicted grades and whether they're likely to cope with A2. Schools might sell it as a stress saving exercise but the cynic in me knows it's much more likely to be down to saving money on exam entries when they have to resit everything (even if they get too grades) for the A2 qualification.

Fizzley plum, yes this is standard now and has been introduced for a couple of years or so. I think it's only maths and a couple of others that still have the as. AS2 is the final Year basically, AS the first year.

University places are normally conditional given on predicted final a level results, then the offer is confirmed once the results are given, i.e. It's fairly simaltaeneous.

It is a step up but normally they adjust. It's still relatively new to her. Could she speak to her siblings?

I think also a lot comes down to if they actually want to do it or not. Can you talk to her about why she will benefit if she knuckles down?