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Original poster

Exclusion from secondary school

60 replies

parentgov1 · 13/05/2016 14:55

Headteachers seem to have to much power to exclude with governors often supporting and Independent Review panels not able to reinstate. Schools and their leadership do not seem to recognise that if you address needs and get education right this may lead to improved behaviour,they focus too much on behaviour policies (often excessively even when not working) and not need/education. Schools don't seem to look at themselves enough to see if they have made mistakes and how provision could be improved instead they blame the child. If they can get it right for the most challenging child and saw it as an opportunity it would benefit the school. Would be interested to hear from other parents with similar concerns.

OP posts:
littledrummergirl · 13/05/2016 20:10

Having my Sen dc come home in tears today I wish they could kick the fuckers out much quicker.

Hth

MrsDallowaySaid · 13/05/2016 19:25

In my job, I have, sadly, been instrumental in the permanent exclusion of several children. It breaks my heart every time. I have done everything the OP suggests and more but i have no choice if children and staff cannot be kept safe. I love my kids, but sometimes permanent exclusion is the only answer. It shouldn't be, but in my local area our alternative provision places are all full.

BoneyBackJefferson · 13/05/2016 19:16

parentgov1
"If I was found. To do something illegal in my job I would lose it and wouldn't work again, I don't get given a choice of a small fine which is the situation we are now with schools"

In what way are schools acting illegally?

In fact I wonder if schools are acting illegally by making staff continue to teach those that have attacked them

catslife · 13/05/2016 19:00

"you're coming across like a journal and that makes me uneasy."
Am not sure why you are asking the question OP and have doubts about your conclusions. It seems to me that you have reached a conclusion first and are trying to find evidence to fit that point of view. That isn't great journalism.
Most state schools do go to great lengths to meet the needs of every child OP and (permanent) exclusion really is the last resort. You say in your post if you address needs and get education right this may lead to improved behaviour. They key word here is "may" as often it doesn't improve.
So agree with other posters.

Myinlawsdidthisthebastards · 13/05/2016 18:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
parentgov1 · 13/05/2016 18:52

There are cases where this is happening , schooks should be held to account and do things right, parents should know their rights, that's why I Started posting

OP posts:
gymboywalton · 13/05/2016 18:39

you speak like someone who has never worked in a school and never had to deal with disruptive pupils day in, day out.

titchy · 13/05/2016 18:37

Maybe OP's re-writing the article, now entitled 'Why is it so difficult to exclude violent pupils?' Wink

NicknameUsed · 13/05/2016 18:34

"you're coming across like a journal and that makes me uneasy."

I'm getting that impression s well. I think the posts are a bit odd and not very specific.

OddBoots · 13/05/2016 18:16

OP, I think you are going to need to be more specific about what you think schools should change.

Not vague stuff, actual examples of what you think they do wrong and what you think they should do instead and if the measures you suggest are going to cost more then what budgets should be cut or what funding should be given to cover those costs.

Myinlawsdidthisthebastards · 13/05/2016 18:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

titchy · 13/05/2016 18:08

There is no evidence that exclusions are dealt with in the manner you suggest. In fact the evidence supports the opposite.

Senac32 · 13/05/2016 17:56

In reply to meditrina -
I used to be an Ed. Psych. (I'm an older member on here.) These problems have existed for many years and in my view are mainly due to the set curriculum not being appropriate for many pupils. Too academic.
One senior high school I visited was lucky enough to have a new scheme promoted by a local business with philanthropic interests. Courses were offered in a range of practical subjects including hairdressing, plumbing, photography , childcare etc.etc. Many pupils who were long term truants returned, plus others who had been excluded, and the scheme was a great success.

Original poster
parentgov1 · 13/05/2016 17:50

I feel strongly about this and concerned for other parents who may not know their and their child's rights, hoping I'll be able to explain more soon

OP posts:
noblegiraffe · 13/05/2016 17:47

If schools could exclude on a whim as you are suggesting, there would be way more exclusions than there are.

Original poster
parentgov1 · 13/05/2016 17:45

If I was found. To do something illegal in my job I would lose it and wouldn't work again, I don't get given a choice of a small fine which is the situation we are now with schools

OP posts:
Original poster
parentgov1 · 13/05/2016 17:43

My point is that an exclusion should be treated seriously with proper investigation, risk assessment of keeping a child at school and any SEN matters, is the school behaviour policy potentially contributing to issues , the lack of SEN provision means this is often not addressed sufficiently

OP posts:
NicknameUsed · 13/05/2016 17:25

I don't understand what point you are trying to make parentgov. I have read so many threads on here from parents of children who have been physically bullied really badly and the schools have done very little to help. They haven't excluded the perpetrators because it is very difficult to do so.

I used to be a parent governor and during the last 5 years only two students have been excluded, both for drug dealing.

RidersOnTheStorm · 13/05/2016 17:20

It isn't easy enough to exclude violent children. Heads should be able enforce instant suspension and permanent exclusion if it's deemed necessary for the protection of other children.

titchy · 13/05/2016 17:17

That's 1 kid excluded each year per 2 average sized secondary schools. Half a kid per school. Not exactly earth shattering.....

titchy · 13/05/2016 17:16

Easier to exclude?! I think you'll find it's more difficult now to permanently exclude a kid.

2009/10 - 0.15% of secondary kids permanently excluded.

2024/15 - 0.13%.

Original poster
parentgov1 · 13/05/2016 17:08

thanks for the contributions so far have to sign off for a while

OP posts:
Original poster
parentgov1 · 13/05/2016 17:07

my concern is that it now far easier to exclude rather than the school look at itself or even really understand say a behaviour that led to the exclusion, it allows and can lead to poor leadership at schools in my opinion, Governors are there to provide oversight/ judgement but don't often do this, tending to support poor decisions

OP posts:
Original poster
parentgov1 · 13/05/2016 17:03

SEN are much more likely to be excluded and arguably missed in exclusion process often making them illegal, check out the school exclusion project

OP posts:
NicknameUsed · 13/05/2016 16:46

"The more usual complaint is that it is too difficult for schools to exclude disruptive pupils and even when they do the decision can be overturned."

This ^^

It is my understanding that ofsted mark schools down for excluding students.

A school in our LA found students dealing drugs this week. I think the dealer will be excluded from the school because they have a zero tolerance policy as far as drug dealing is concerned.

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