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Original poster

Help me be calm about bright year 11 who is not doing the work for her GCSEs that are on now

36 replies

grinkle · 17/04/2016 20:57

Just that really.

I just lost the plot a bit when she told me she was planning to go out with her boyf on the night before her French oral and the day when her 2 art GCSEs coursework are due in (she's hugely behind in all 3 subjects and may well fail all, despite the fact she has the ability to get As at least in all 3 subjects). Apparently it has to be that night particularly because he (the bf) is not allowed by his mum to go out any other nights because of his GCSEs!

I am so frustrated that she is not doing the work she needs to do and won't accept any help. I also got v cross when she told me earlier today she doesn't like any of the food I cook because I "only cook food out of packets like pasta etc" - this after I spent 2 weeks of her holidays home cooking her 3 meals a day for her, bringing her a big, fresh-cooked full cooked breakfast in bed etc every day to help her while she studies, even though I work full-time from home. She doesn't appreciate any help she gets.

Just so frustrated with her - I know she's really stressed but I'm finding it so hard to watch her flounder and not put the effort in. We're not well off and can't afford to help her financially so she's going to need the grades to get on in life - and she's super bright so with the effort she could realistically expect all As/A*s. But she has to do the work.

I know my stress levels are not helping - please help me to be the super-calm, helpful parent I'm absolutely not at the moment but really need to be! Flowers

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Original poster
grinkle · 18/04/2016 23:40

lljkk - I'm not saying that exams are the be-all and end-all. Or that it's not possible to succeed in life if you get poor results. But equally, better results make life easier. Part of the reason we're so poor is because dh messed up his exams, despite being bright. Because he didn't put the work in. Which prevented him being able to get a lot of higher-paying jobs. So dd ought to understand the value of working hard.

Its not as though she's got anything more interesting to do most of the time - boyf not allowed out most of the time!

OP posts:
parissont · 18/04/2016 23:23

I don't even understand your post llkjj

Au79 · 18/04/2016 22:39

My dd if she had a boyfriend (that I knew about...) I would insist that she did X, y and z before she could go. That has been working, she has agreed it with us though, for example she did two past papers and tidied her stuff ready for school to start, before going on a sleepover Sat night. And was collected at 10 am and did more work fairly happily. We were a bit surprised! DH wanted to just say no, but I felt we should be more flexible knowing her, she might work better rather than less just to spite us.

It's fairly recent she has buckled down. We also got her a tutor- she works better with one on one attention. Yes, she needs to be more organised, do it herself, should do fine without tutor, Yada yada, but she is 15, not overly mature and pretty lazy! So far it seems worth it.

lljkk · 18/04/2016 20:21

Or alternatively, you could have relatives who were unwed pregnant teenagers, who then stole food since no money left after rent, only got qualifications by going back to school years after the rest of their peer group, didn't own a pair of shoes as a child, hustled pool to get any money, regularly drove the car at age 12 to get drunk dad home from the pub, had abusive parent followed by crippling disability........ And they turned into home-owners, hard workers & steady people, actually.

TBF, they weren't the relatives who lived on the streets, contended with severe mental illness, never got any qualifications, never held down a job, dealt drugs for a living.

Coz then your whole idea of chances of "success" in life doesn't really depend on exam results at 16.

Original poster
grinkle · 18/04/2016 17:20

Thanks parissont! I think it probably helps to be reasonably well off if you're going to feel comfortable allowing your kids to risk failing. If you know your kids will have a comfortable fall-back, it's not hard to be laid back about failing an exam here or there, and it's easy to assume they'll muddle through. But if you've had the experience of not knowing how you're going to meet the rent, it's much harder to be so nonchalant, however much (in theory) you wished you could be, so as not to put your dcs under any more pressure.

I'm sure we all try to do the best by our dcs. I hate the fact we live in a world where the drawbridges have come up so much over the last few years in terms of social mobility. I'd much rather dd could follow her star wherever it took her, but realistically she needs to keep as many options open as she can now, because she has absolutely no idea what she wants to do later. It might be she never needs a French GCSE and instead marries into money (I'm not totally sure that's not her game plan at the moment, actually Hmm ). Or that she walks into a very cool job in...? Dunno what. But as her mum, I feel she needs to try to do the best she can now, just in case.

I'm the child of immigrants too, so some of that 'first generation British', need to work hard at school or else, ethos is strong there too. When you know you've started with nothing, you know that hard work alone will lift you out of that.

Right, deep breath, plates of healthy food in hand, and...go. Off to be sweet and lovely mum/volunteer intensive French teacher, for another day... And try not to lose my temper at dd on her phone/answering back etc again. Lots of deep breathing, in fact!

OP posts:
DropYourSword · 18/04/2016 14:55

If I had my time again I'd do it all differently. I earn a decent wage but really could be on a lot better in an area I enjoyed a lot more. But that really was more, like you say, about career choices and less to do with which uni I went to (and much more about the course I chose!). The thing is though, I wouldn't be where I am now (obviously) without doing what I did. It all worked out. It very often does.
Have you talked to your DD about what she might like to do in the future. I really had no clue at that age and think I really would have benefited much more from career advice (on a more consistent basis). Would have been good to identify strengths, weaknesses and interests and explore different career options. I was so blinkered when I was younger. I LOVED maths and was very good at it. My best subject by far. I wish I had pursued it further, but at the time I thought the only career available for being 'good at maths' was a maths teacher or an accountant - neither of which appealed. I had no idea about all the other avenues I could have explored and it's really too late now for me.
Maybe thinking further into the future about what she'd really like to do and then what she needs to do to get there would be the approach she needs?

parissont · 18/04/2016 14:54

No I don't think you are deafeatist lljkk but I do think this attitude about 'not cracking the whip' is something I only ever see on Mumsnet.

Most boring, steady lower middle class parents like me encourage their dcs to work very hard. If that means missing a party for a month or so before exams so be it. I think any parent that lets their teen do completley whatever they want before gcses is failing their children. Of course they need down time but exams are important!

parissont · 18/04/2016 14:51

If she wants to own a house in London these days she will need to earn some serious money! Probably better off skipping uni and the debt and going straight into work

dd wants to ride and carry on riding competitively

I have made it clear to her from day one that we cannot support her financially to do that, if she wants horses she will have to pay for them. Hence she is working bloody hard.

lljkk · 18/04/2016 14:50

My short answer is I don't know how you change them & I'm mostly convinced you can't. You wouldn't bemoan a dim child who can't make themselves clever. Why bemoan a disorganised-unconfident-not hardworking child? Maybe those things are equally hard wired.

I can't get thru life without a glass half full outlook so I look for what is positive & doable & try to do that and seize the opportunities that are there, not bemoan the chances we don't get. I can't change my kids (at all? much?), but I can sometimes change how I deal with them.

Some people say that's defeatist outlook & better to ban the boyfriend-gadgets, crack the whip, make them achieve no matter what, etc. Good luck to them. I shrug their approach off because we don't have anything in common. I can't be like that.

parissont · 18/04/2016 14:47

Blimey! Don't make this about the OP!!

ALL parents are now worried about their dc's year 11 exams

The issue is that she's not bloody working hard enough!! Don't let her out with her boyfriend, or if she insists on going then its her problem.

Original poster
grinkle · 18/04/2016 14:41

Drop - completely agree with all you wrote. Yes, I'm sure she can see our life and see Oxbridge and think it's not worth the effort! (The fact I chose teaching and not banking afterwards has more to do with it, IMO! But of course she misses the point that I could make both those choices - with a worse degree I might not have had those options.)

Yes, you're right 100% but our lives have been tough financially and I know she absolutely wants the material comforts and security we haven't had eg owning her own home. She wants to stay around London and own her own house - as we can't help her, the only way she's going to be able to achieve her own dreams realistically is to get the grades. So it's not just me foisting my expectations on her, it's also me trying to enable her to achieve her own goals. (If I was her, I'd live abroad/somewhere cheaper, but we're different people.)

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Original poster
grinkle · 18/04/2016 14:35

But then again, yes of course this thread is about how I feel! I do feel I'm over-reacting and so not helping...and need to keep a lid on it at least or step back if that is the best thing for her (not sure if it is?).

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DropYourSword · 18/04/2016 14:34

Two things you've said stand out for me here.

I think her fear of failure results from your own stated fear of her failing. You say that her teachers for years have told her how brilliant she is and how unhelpful you have found that and that you'd never done that. I misinterpreted that earlier as them putting undue pressure on her, but now I'm thinking it's more likely that you don't actually praise her very much, and that whatever she does you expect more. The comment about her 'ruling out Oxbridge years ago' makes me suspect that this pressure/expectation has been heaped on her for years. I'd be mighty tired of it if I was her. This is her life, not a repeat performance of yours.

Secondly, it seems really important to you that she attends a good university and gets good grades etc and I get the impression that you see that, and only that, as a mark of success. But again by your own admission you went to Oxbridge and then mention about how you're not well off, can't help her financially etc. Maybe she thinks that in the grand scheme of things it's actually not as important as some other people think it is.

Original poster
grinkle · 18/04/2016 14:34

I don't know, lljkk - I don't think who she is is something she knows, or that is set in stone. I think she is at the stage now where she could be anything she chooses (well, within reason), but at each stage, like GCSES, some doors shut.

I get what you're saying about denying who she is and trying to mould her into what I want her to be - but if what what I want her to be is more employable is that such a bad thing? And is being someone who can get grade grades not part of who she is too? (It certainly has been until recently.) Is getting good grades not something you do rather than something you are?

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lljkk · 18/04/2016 14:14

So back to what I said... is this thread about how you feel or about you finding ways to make your DD be someone else?

bigTillyMint · 18/04/2016 14:03

OP, I have a Y12 and a Y10, so I know how you feel - it is incredibly stressful parenting teens who are doing exams. It is dreadfully pressured now for teens with predicted grades and exam changes and everything. The stress is passed between teachers, students and parents.

I agree with many others here, you need to step back. Let her come to you for support. 'You can lead a horse to water' and all that.

You say "it does frustrate me because I went to Oxbridge" - do you think that this is one of the issues? You are finding it difficult to accept that she may not reach what you feel is the pinnacle of academic achievement?

Original poster
grinkle · 18/04/2016 13:50

Oh, and the French is IGCSE, so it goes 100% on the exam. Wish it didn't, because we would all have realised a long time ago where the gaps in dd's knowledge were.

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Original poster
grinkle · 18/04/2016 13:46

catslife and parissont - just to clarify I'm no way expecting her to get all A or A*! Though yes, she is academically (if not organisationally) capable of that and yes, it does frustrate me because I went to Oxbridge and know she's at least as clever as me so would like that to be an option if she wanted it (though knowing how hard I worked means she's already ruled it out years ago!).

I am more realistic than that - I'd just like her not to fail anything. And my view of academic success is it's not really about brilliance, it's about habit - if you get in the habit of doing things to a certain standard and getting good grades, it's not really an effort, it's just normal. Conversely, if you don't, that becomes your 'normal'. I'm just trying to get her to set her sense of 'normal' higher up the scale - because I think she clearly lacks confidence in measuring up to her school's expectations (based I think on CAT tests, where I think she must have done very well, given her initial groups).

lljkk - thanks, that was helpful. For me, as I said, we're not well off. So it's easy to say that grades don't matter, choice of uni doesn't matter - and of course, historically and even currently, you're right. But we both know that increasingly lots of those doors of social mobility are shutting as I write - and it seems a waste not to take advantage of the advantages one has, such as a good memory etc. Of course, a confident, outgoing child with bags of confidence can succeed anyway - but dd is not that child. She's the borderline Aspie who struggles socially. So the grades would go a long way, frankly...

OP posts:
parissont · 18/04/2016 12:44

yes catslife our goals are similar for dd

she would like to do A level Biology BUT we (and school ) have said really not worth it unless you get an A at GCSE as it is a very hard A level course. So she is prioritising Biology and HIstory which she is predicted an A in, English which she enjoys, MATHS which she hates and could possibly fail. She isn't too worried about anything except MATHS...

dds problem is not reading the question properly and also just writing down everything she knows to see if something sticks!!

catslife · 18/04/2016 11:30

I have a dd in Y11. I think that the idea that bright children can obtain As and As in all subjects is unrealistic. The real difficulty with GCSEs is balancing the different workloads for many different subjects: some which you may really like and want to take for A level, and others that you perhaps liked a while ago, but you have found the GCSE course less interesting than you thought you would when you started (or are only taking because the school insisted) iyswim.
dd hasn't decided anything about uni yet but comments that you must get all As and As at GCSE for top unis, although very prevalent on Mumsnet, may not be true in the real world!
We have agreed the following priorities for dd:

  1. Maths and English GCSEs are key, as pupils have to keep resitting if they obtain less than grade Cs - so if she doesn't want to be taking these next year, she needs to achieve this standard.
  2. To obtain the best possible results in the subjects that she would like to take at A level.
  3. working on other subjects that she is not planning on taking at A level.
Is it French GCSE or iGCSE? If it's the GCSE they have already done the Writing as controlled assessments. Many schools have already done the orals (speaking) and the main exams are Listening and Reading. At dds school they are doing practice papers at school.
lljkk · 18/04/2016 10:56

Doesn't everyone have fear of failure? The more you can admit that the easier it is to not let it make decisions for you. It's a good thing to try to nudge her along to dealing with that fear. Long term project, GCSE exam season just another opportunity to talk about it.

it will have a real impact on what unis she can get into etc.

Since you asked how you remain calm, as in, (maybe?) how you accept things as they are...

Maybe those Unis somehow ruled out never would be right for anyway, if she has such issues with fear of failure and not as good organisation skills as some kids (& whatever else is holding her back). So yeah, maybe her GCSE results will be so "bad" that they will rule some things out, but who says that outcome will mean anything bad for her personally? Don't have to go to the "best" university to be successful. There are lots of successful pathways thru life.

(If posters instead want threads to answer "How do I make my kid revise as much as I want them to" then I wish they would put that on the thread title rather than pretend they want anything else)

DropYourSword · 18/04/2016 10:22

I think you may have hit the nail on the head there OP. Thinking back to my experience, one of the reasons I didn't put 100% in was that I always had that fallback excuse that I could have done better if I'd tried harder. I think for some people that's easier to deal with than feeling more of a failure because you tried as hard as you possibly could and it still wasn't enough. I had a lot of pressure and expectation put on me (teachers rather than family) and it wasn't helpful.

Original poster
grinkle · 18/04/2016 10:12

All true, parissont and lljkk - but it's hard. Because she will hate herself if she gets poor grades and it will have a real impact on what unis she can get into etc. More so these days now AS levels largely stopped.

She really struggles with organisation and I hope she will learn those skills one day, ie develop the maturity you mentioned parissont, but dumping her in it before exams that actually matter seems cruel.

It's not only her French though that's long been her worst subject. It's also just impacted her two art GCSEs - she was up till after midnight during 4 days of exams last week desperately trying to do studies she should have done weeks ago. Of course she didn't have enough time so the studies she handed in were poor and she has had that experience of knowing that if only she had worked harder she could have done better. I just have to hope her final exam piece was good enough it will go some way towards making up for the poor studies. She's also got to finish off her portfolios by next Tues and again big gaps - but not really knuckling down.

I think the root of it is fear of failure - if she doesn't do the work and fails, she can always tell herself (and others, but mainly herself) that if only she'd done the work, she could have done well. The real fear is doing the work and then her real limitations becoming apparent. That comes from years of teachers (not family, I should add!) telling her how 'brilliant' she is. Very unhelpful - I never say stuff like that to her and want to cringe when teachers do.

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lljkk · 18/04/2016 09:48

You can lead a horse to water (offer to help & remind her why she wants to do well) but you can't make it drink (she has to do the work).

Didn't you ever have to learn anything the hard way, OP?

Even if she totally blows her GCSEs (I doubt she will) there are other ways to be successful in life, and even to get back on track to university, etc.

I wish my yr11 DS had a girlfriend, he'd be keen to impress her with how clever he is.

parissont · 18/04/2016 09:15

In my mind, ability isn't just about being clever. It's also having the maturity to do the work! I have said to dd the worst feeling in the world is walking out of an exam knowing you could have done better if you'd put the hours in.

I am glad dd doesn't have a boyfriend tbh although she does have a horse which is equally as time consuming Hmm