From Prep school to State Secondary??

I have a DD in a private prep but have no sense of entitlement we work bloody hard and have sacrificed a lot including renting out rooms in our home. We go without holidays, have a ten year old car and my husband has a mobile from the dark ages. My mobile is proudly out of contract and approaching retirement age.

You're going for the whole bingo card there Petts

The biggest difference is that in state comps - even those rated outstanding, with the very best results - there is some appalling behaviour and low level disruption which is simply not tolerated at private schools.

I think that, ultimately, it will come down to your particular situation, priorities and values (we faced the dilemma of private vs state last year).

I have been following discussions on MN (and 11 Plus forum) for a year now and one idea regularly floated is that a bright child will do well no matter which school he/she attends. I don't think that is universally true - it may be the case for some DC but not for others for such reasons as a DC needing more direction/nudging (not all bright children are self-motivated), a DC benefiting from being with similarly-minded peers (academically-speaking), a DC requiring more attentive pastoral care, etc.

We chose to go private (I started with a preference for state) after a lot of debate and reflection (including on financial considerations). While we will never know whether DD would have been equally happy and successful at the grammar school to which she was admitted, we take comfort in DD telling us that she could not be happier in terms of intellectual stimulation and she trying different activities and sports (the latter without feeling any pressure to be top). At the same time, we are on the lookout for the risk of a growing sense of entitlement in DD (it is something that worries us more than a little), discussing our values on material possessions (some of her classmates have the latest gadgets, she doesn't), etc. With the passage of time (although just one term), we are feeling more assured (which hopefully won't change) that we made the right decision for our DD.

"The 'downside' to the comp is that all of the trips are oversubscribed, so ballots take place for trips. Not everyone that auditions gets a part in the concert/play/musical. But saving £6k per term could pay for a lot of tutoring and extra curricular activities."

Most state schools have music and drama opportunities for all levels of ablity. Often there are house drama or sport or music competitions. A child might not get to take part in the main production, but there are other opportunities. In a state school there must be some day trips open to all. Otherwise the school would be failing the pupil premium kids who can't afford the skiing trip.

Not everyone that auditions gets a part in the concert/play/musical - and nor should they. Otherwise why bother having auditions? For me that sentence says everything about the sense of entitlement you might get as a result of going to a certain type of school.

Academic excellence is a given at certain private schools. DC will be challenged and be expected to rise to that challenge.

However, there is a lot of other stuff going on; sport, music, drama, art etc etc. There will also be an active social life.

The parent body will be a mix, as anywhere, in terms of personality and values held. Yes, they will mostly be high achieving (with regards to their own academic and work careers) but not all.

Our DD 2 went to a private prep where the first half of Yr6 was preparation for the Common Entrance exam. We had the options of private from Yr7 or an OFSTED outstanding state comp.
In the end - we thought that the state comp was a better fit for DD, despite her first choice being the private secondary.
She is extremely happy at the comp.

During our deliberations we thought about the possibility of State from 11- 13 then doing the 13 plus if the comp didn't work out - is this an option for you? Also don't kid yourself regarding outstanding comp/state schools depending on the 'catchment' a lot of tutoring may be taking place (under the radar, as it were).

Where we live it is much more difficult to get into the outstanding comps, unless you are within catchment, than the private schools - which affected our decision making.

The 'downside' to the comp is that all of the trips are oversubscribed, so ballots take place for trips. Not everyone that auditions gets a part in the concert/play/musical. But saving £6k per term could pay for a lot of tutoring and extra curricular activities.

Teaching DC that life is a struggle doesn't make them more rounded. It just teaches them to struggle, often quite needlessly.

Not all private schools are the same, likewise with state schools. I live in an area where there are two "top 30" in the country girls independents within a sensible distance. I actually much preferred the all girls grammar in the nearest town to both of these schools as the girls just seemed so much more normal, down to earth and grounded, but it still had the academic feel. The facilities were, however, poor in comparison. Tatty buildings, cramped classrooms (30 teenagers in a room looks an awful lot of people!!!) etc and the girls didn't seem half as confident.

I honestly don't think though that a clever child would do better at the fee paying schools than the grammar and I couldn't justify the expense.

That said, we have fallen in love with a wonderful secondary independent school which gets great results for the students it takes (it's often a backup for girls who fail the 11+), and places as much emphasis on what you do outside the classroom as in it. It just felt so much more like the sort of place my daughter would feel at home. Your gut reaction says a lot about which is the right school.

One final word, two of the five independents we visited felt rather like places where money was no object and the girls seemed to not bat an eyelid when discussing the number of trips they had been on etc. The other three felt so much more down to earth and a lot more about the girl than the size of her parents bank account. Visit all the ones you are interested in and you'll know deep down where your daughter would fit in and be happy.

I have a DD in a private prep but have no sense of entitlement we work bloody hard and have sacrificed a lot including renting out rooms in our home. We go without holidays, have a ten year old car and my husband has a mobile from the dark ages. My mobile is proudly out of contract and approaching retirement age. We did this as the all ability school she was at just couldn't cope with her ability and whilst a great local school just wasn't the right fit for her. We are on the cusp of making the same decision about moving on. DD is in Y6 and recently sat grammar tests. We are not looking at the parents but the students and opportunities for DD. We have a great state grammar which she has scored more than enough to get into but it is always struggling for cash, has a class size of 32, in some subjects comes close to failing students as they don't have the right equipment to enable them to get the best grades but they still manage to be in top 50 of schools nationally. Then there is an amazing independent which does the IB, no government interference in the qualification, the curriculum is enormous in comparison to the state grammar and as part of the IB they community service and all the students I've seen realise how fortunate they are and work hard at helping others. I don't think we can afford the Independent for secondary but if money were no object the attraction of not having the government constantly moving goalposts or making it easier/harder/more confusing would be a clincher for us! OP go with what you think is the right fit for your family.

What a dilemma, cant really help. I looked into private secondary, DC did the entrance exams and was offered a partial scholarship. School seemed great etc.

I talked to a lot of the kids and parents from private education and the reason I decided against it was how do I put it the sense of entitlement everyone had, no experience of how 'normal' people live and struggle. There was something missing that the state sector offered i.e. what real life was and how it affected most people. Its not that it was ignored, more that everyone in private schools thought that was normal. The holidays, the latest smart phone, the expensive cars etc.

I found a state school that produced better results and also a more rounded personality, not just whats considered a wealthy rounded person (very different things). And I had endless money for private tutoring (which so far, I have never needed). Oxbridge here we come ;)