Teacher's commet

Good outcome. I have a dd who struggles with speaking in class....she sets herself targets of contributing at least once in every class, fortunately she has so far encountered teachers who wish to encourage her gently.

That is an excellent talk! I should stress I also have time in classes for individual work and it's a very valid point that extroverts need this (those are the very ones I hear whispering 'this is boring' who then wonder why they can't do an exam or who didn't hear the instructions...)
DS2 told his teacher that he dislikes group work and prefers to work on his own, and I know he isn't alone in that.
I think maybe OP's dd is shy rather than introverted - but that would be a reason also for letting the teacher know that a particularly extrovert class is intimidating for her and that her written work is the way she contributes in this situation.
I hope it goes well, OP!

I hope the Parents Evening went well.

As a teacher I found Susan Cain's TED talk on the Power of Introverts very thought provoking and it has caused me to change my approach in the classroom.

This is the TED blurb about the video: In a culture where being social and outgoing are prized above all else, it can be difficult, even shameful, to be an introvert. But, as Susan Cain argues in this passionate talk, introverts bring extraordinary talents and abilities to the world, and should be encouraged and celebrated.

I think the video should be compulsory viewing for all teachers. Here is a link. Amazing stuff.

I would say: DD was mortified when you commented that she doesn't contribute to discussions. We know this is a problem because it happens in other classes too. She is very shy of the louder, more confident girls but she really wants to make a contribution. We're keen to work on this with her at home. Do you have some strategies that could help?
my guess is he will try to help. If he doesn't, follow up by saying that sarcasm is counterproductive with anxious students.
For what it's worth, it was made clear in my teaching observations that it's my job to draw out the shy students rather than their problem! It's not considered great to ask questions and let the noisy ones talk. One obvious reason is that it's not always shyness and they may actually be struggling to understand but reluctant to admit it. I find getting students to discuss something in small groups and then insisting everyone says something helps quite a lot. students can simply say if they agree with a previous speaker as long as they tell me why!

Wow Dorothy if the teacher knew of all these comments.......

Did you decide what to do?

SheGotAllDaMoves just pmed you grovely writers pm!!!!!

DorithyL, try not to worry about her career just yet.

Your daughter is exactly like I was at that age - I was cripplingly shy to the point that I would look like a beetroot if asked a question or made to present anything.

I was the same throughout university and in my 20s it just started to become easier. Funnily enough I was a biochemist, which is on your list of jobs for introverts. The list doesn't point out that you regularly have to present your research at least to your jab and sometimes to entire conferences!

Like anything else, public speaking is an acquired skill, time and practise are the only things that can help some people. My personality is quite different now, although I'm still an introvert, I can play the extrovert in work situations. I think the majority of introverted people do, I'm sure she will adapt to the world of work when the time comes.

I do also think that a classroom full of 'clever, confident' cocky teenagers, trying to impress a teacher who obviously likes that sort of thing (hence the sarcastic comment) is very UNLIKE many adult work situations.

DD does an excellent - and hilarious - imitation of the behaviour of others in her English class (all 'me, me, me, choose me miss'). Discussion with her teacher at parents' evening showed that the teacher was clamping down on this to enable those - who she described as 'often the ablest and most mature' - who did not engage in this type of behaviour.

It sounds as if the teacher in the OP's scenario may well be valuing 'outgoing / verbal / confident' rather than 'content'. However, the majority of school subjects, in the end, are assessed almost entirely through written work.....

Bunbaker I agree with every word you said.

Hope you never teach my children Brenda.

hocus I completely agree.

We don't need to train everyone up to performer levels . Being a competent, engaging public speaker, who does not avoid it is more than enough for many.

And yes. things often come with time. DH was a very shy boy. His parents go on about it (and on and on and on). I suspect his teachers didn't know what his voice sounded like at school . And yet he is now a managing partner at a huge US law firm. His style remains quiet, measured.

"I don't think you should say anything. Make d say something. She's year ten. Come on"

Are you the teacher Brenda?

You clearly are completely devoid of any empathy for teenagers who have social anxiety or lack confidence. It is people like you that make the shy ones feel bad about themselves. Comments like that will only undermine their confidence even more.

Your comments on this thread are very unhelpful.

Come on Brenda

which don't involve speaking

Speaking in public I meant - not taking a vow of silence

One small point - Yr 10 at school is far too early imho to write a child off as not being able to speak in public. There are some good ideas and strategies already posted. And being able to speak in public is better than not I think. BUT ....

Obviously there are some people to whom speaking up and speaking in front of people comes more naturally. However, most - not all - but a lot - of people are perfectly able, with preparation, to give a perfectly good talk on something they know something about, given a bit of practice and teaching. This is enough for a lot of jobs. Not being a comedian in the Hollywood Bowl, granted, but a lot of jobs. I just wanted to give the OP some perspective that a shy yr 10 girl does not necessarily have to think about jobs which don't involve speaking.

There's a way to go yet .

italian I don't know if the aptitude for public speaking ( by which I include speaking to a largish group as well as the 'general public') is natural ie innate.

Perhaps it is? I don't recall a time when I was fearful of it or didn't enjoy it. Though that might just as well be to do with being an only child as genes IYSWIM.

And whilst I don't think it's imperative to have as a skill, I do think it's an asset in so many areas of life ( not just work related by any means). Like being a competent communicator in the written word, or a competent mathematician or whatever.

Of course people can manage without these skills. But life is easier with them, I think.

FWIW I have a DS who was a very shy child. But he is now a perfectly articulate 16 year old. He won't necessarily press himself forward in class but nor will he shy away from saying his piece. Both his primary and secondary school would not have allowed that!

He now actively enjoys a good debate or presentation ( God how he loves power point).

Personally, I am very pleased he now has this skill. Not because I want to channel him in any particular direction but because his life will be far easier with it. And the job of his parents and his school is to equip him for life, no?

Ps I write crime novels mostly. Though I have branched out into writing for radio and telly. I'm currently writing a book and screen play concurrently for a US production company .

The later project has required and continued to require me to be able to speak up very clearly in meetings etc!

I am not meaning to be difficult about any of this.I am not accepting that children get ignored or left behind by teachers- I am stating it can happen. It does happen.The point about public- speaking is irrelevant here. We are not talking about a child who does not enjoy public speaking, we are talking about one who can't join in a discussion with her peers in a classroom and whose throat closes up if she is asked a question and who would prefer to be given a task she can get on and complete by herself. All I said was communication is a key skill and if she finds it that hard she'll struggle in lots of jobs. It is ridiculous to say she could be a successful teacher in that case- can't speak in a classroom. Teachers have to lead learning and discussion- in classrooms, with whole classes, small groups, in corridors, assembly halls, with groups of staff and parents. You need to be prepared to speak up to do that successfully. That is all I said. I have not condemned her to failure, her mum has explained since she is much better at communicating in other situations so that's all very reassuring now we know.

Ps Teacher I am sure you are a good teacher, I know lots are.

BoboChic finding one's own voice is about having confidence in yourself and expressing yourself, it doesn't mean one needs to express oneself in every situation or in situations and ways others feel are supremely important.

As someone who pretty much hated school I would say school prepares some so very badly, and prepares for so little, or rather it did when I was at school. Having a dyslexic dd I have to say some areas have not changed! I would not say boo to a goose at school but I am not now very happy to speak publicly on anything I know about!.

SheGotAllDaMoves although many jobs may involved some element of speaking to multiple people, I am not sure that they would all involved public speaking, although I appreciate your job does. Do you think it comes naturally to you or did you need to work on it, and if so how?

Personally, I think public speaking is a talent and you can be naturally good at it, or you can work very hard at doing it well and being good at it but still finding it very hard.

Teachers have a job that involves communicating with a class but they are hardly all good at public speaking.

In fact I find the idea we should all be able to express ourselves in the same way or we should all be good at public speaking, and the idea that some teachers should convey this to pupils, or other adults should encourage children to feel if they cannot speak publicly they will fail. Well to me that borders on 'pushing' all children into being the same.

Great advice LooseAtTheSeams.

SheGotAllDaMoves what kind of books do you write? (nosy me!)

Lulu,

DD 'doesn't contribute much verbally in class' (she is younger than the OP's daughter, and discussion / unprepared debate is not yet a critical success factor in her academic work - written work and prepared debate is much more important for her as yet).

However she is also an excellent public speaker and happy to speak and perform in front of an audience in a creative / dramatic role - been in professional panto twice, at the ages of 8 and 10, with singing / acting / dance / small speaking roles.

The two are not mutually exclusive.