Secondary Open Evenings, some questions about them....?

Open evenings in massively over subscribed schools can be very busy. But why should teachers waste a lot of time and effort on families that have no chance of ever going to the school. I know some schools that are really trying to put people off applying, you only get to see the 'real' school after you have a place. So talking to other families about their experience seems to be more important.

If your child has particular interests, say is sporty, arty or musical ask if you can be in a group led by a pupil with similar interests. No point in seeing the music rooms if your child won't go anywhere near. Plus a child to ask questions of someone like minded about what the school is really like.

And be gentle. DD was grilled on how feminist the school was by a particularly fierce mother recently. She had never thought about it, so was left feeling a numpty.

If you have the time, try to arrange a visit during normal school hours; open evenings are good to get a feel for a school, but they all put on a bit of a show and are very careful about selecting the children that will be present and representing the school. I'd do a visit during school hours (the best headteachers I've worked for were always happy to do tours themselves actually) and see what the lessons, kids and atmosphere are like on a normal working day.

Start to let go. Your OP is all about you. It's goodto still have parent guidance at this age but they have to start to become independent too, so listen to your son and what he thinks - and ask him what he thinks!

school's refusal to run enough open evenings

Open evening is a huge event to set up and run. It requires hours and hours of teacher work, working very late into the evening. School kids have to come in to do tours. It's bloody exhausting. We also have sixth form open evening a few weeks later. I'm not surprised the school only runs one, running more than one might finish off a few teachers at what is already a busy point of the year.

A massively over-subscribed and successful comp near me does one two hour open evening. You usually get about 2000 /3000 parents turning up (not exaggerating). You can't ask anyone anything because it's too busy, have to shuffle through the corridors shoulder to shoulder, and it's overall a horrible experience for the children who've been bought along to have a look around. I think the school's refusal to run enough open evenings and open days to allow parents to ask questions and to see the school at work speaks volumes about the school's complacency and lack of respect for families.

Check that you can go back during the school day. A head who is happy for people to walk around during the day generally runs a good school.

Agree with the poster who said look for what isn't said or demonstrated. You are seeing the school " on show" so if the work on display is last years, or all higher years work ask why etc

Talk to you guide loads. I disagree strongly with the poster who said kids shouldn't be acting as guides during the school day - interacting appropriately with adults you don't know is a skill to learn too. These will also be the nice kids. They may not be the cleverest but they are not the difficult ones either.

Playing sorry if I didn't make myself clear - the school is open for two hours, talk by the head first which probably lasts 30 minutes then you are free to wander around the school. If you don't make the talk but get to the school after it, the Head and SLT are on hand to answer any questions.

Some parents cannot make it at all and we offer tours in groups the following week usually on a morning.

The Ofsted report will give you a very limited view of the school
The Ofsted report for the school one of my dc went to was pretty good which didnt reflect the quality of the teaching of some of the subjects
I would ask parents of kids who go to those schools if you can to get a frank real view
Ofsted wont tell you the turnaround of teachers
the male/female mix of teachers (don't know if I am allowed to say this)
drugs issues etc....

We did the walks last year when we looked at local secondaries. I agree that we gained very little from the head teacher's talk, but gained most from the students who showed us round. I was able to ask lots of questions about how the children settled in, bullying, friendships, lessons etc... Far more useful than anything I got from the teachers!

In the end DD chose to go out of catchment, and to a school that doesn't always get as high grades as our catchment school, but my daughter felt that it was the happier school. Certainly, the students were more confident there and the opportunities on offer was greater.

A year on, we're very happy with the choice. The emphasis the school puts on settling the children in has meant that DD has had a really smooth transition, and for the first time in her life has found that she is loving school. We just felt that the school was a good fit for DD, but I guess that's hard to pin down.

PUGaLUGS- a two hour talk by the HT?!

quango - I'd avoid schools that make all children sit GCSEs early, even if a SS. DS goes to one and only the top set did maths early and it's the only GCSE sat before year 11.

Both DS's and DD's school (one SS grammar, one comp in neighbouring county) do head teacher's talk at 2 points over the evening, then everyone is free to walk around and talk to children at the school, and the teachers. Of course the kids on display at the evenings are usually the high achievers or good communicators so not necessarily a good example of the whole cohort.

As well as open evenings both schools also offer school day tours, where parents are shown around by students during a normal school day. Can be worthwhile doing these.

why avoid schools that routinely encourage students to take GCSEs early outbif interest? one of our local grammar schools (super pushy, wouldn't send my kids there) made a big song and dance about this in their talk. all kids do maths a year early because they are super geniuses yadda yadda. is this OK for a super selective?

Most schools around us also offer daytime visits by appointment, I took DD on some of those as well , they give you a different perspective on top of the open evening. (Kids in class, corridor behaviour, interaction between kids and teachers, not just the ones hand-picked for the open evening) Primary schools should be happy to release Y6 students to attend these visits.

At my school there is a talk by the head first (6.30pm till 8.30pm) and then you wander around.

If you don't make the talk but get there to have a wander, the head and slt are always on hand to answer any questions.

What I most remember from the open evenings we went to was that the teachers focused on talking to DS or DD about their subject.
I think all the classes had activities for the prospective pupils, and as well as current year 7s showing us round, there were sixth formers in the classrooms too and they were running experiments and happy to answer questions (& start a conversation too if you were a little shy)

We didn't go to the head's talk, but spent time talking to the teachers and current pupils. We also checked out the state of the toilets - neat & tidy was preferable to covered in graffiti.

Here one local school lets you go from room to room and there are some children in eg science labs showing experiments; the head gives a 15 min talk every hour I thnk. At DD's school a pupil shows you round wherever you want to go and delivers you to the HT's talk for a pre allocated time depending on when you arrive.

Sometimes it's the small things that indicate the feel of the school. Eg one school had DC offering home made biscuits etc in tech; another (the one DD now goes to) charged for everything and even tried to sell stuff made by older pupils to try to fund some sporting trip to South Africa. I should have realised!!

I think it is good to ask about:

-value ad ( much more important than Ofsted or %5a-C , IMO)

• how rigid setting is (I think movement in sets is important and a good thing)
• pastoral care

• have a chat with the HT
• have a chat with teachers too

And see how your DS responds to the place. My DS felt much more at home in the school that was actually my number 2 choice. I think it was the right thing to go with his choice.

Most head teacher speeches are very similar, and I learned nothing about the schools from these that I didn't know already. I observed the students. Are they enthusiastic about the school? Do they enjoy learning? What is their attitude towards the teachers and vice versa?

I have been to umpteen of these things (four children in secondary who all wanted to look around every local school when they were in Y6). The usual format is that you will be handed a prospectus on the way in, put in a small group and shown around by a couple of pupils. Don't be scared to ask them questions. At some point during the evening there is usually a talk by the head teacher (often repeated every hour or two).

Ragged at my school students (who are on the student council) do tours in the day too - eg for prospective staff or parents who can't get to the open evening.

I think it's fab - really gives them a chance to practise their social/presenting skills and much better than a tour by the HT. Many people comment about how clued up the students are.

Oh sorry, I'm an idiot, prev. posters probably mean DURING the open evening, I thought it was tours during the school day. ( I'll just get me coat ).

Should current students be in class learning things, not playing tourist guide??
I'd be if that was my current student.