Winchester College- Sports

Very sound advice alphaBravo

I was being lighthearted. But it does have the reputation for producing serious and studious young men: I have no idea if the school has changed and if that reputation is now undeserved.

Before people even tell me what school they went to, I can very often recognise traits as being OE, Charterhouse or Old Wykehamist (as well as many other schools), so it certainly used to be true that schools leave a personality impression on their pupils. I suppose it's unsurprising given kids spend as much time at boarding school as home.

I would say send your child to a school where you recognise the current pupils as being similar types to your child or being the sort of young men you would want your child to become. The school's values have to chime with the family's otherwise it causes all sorts of difficulties where your child is likely to feel different or ideologically opposed to the school's ethos and rules.

Go and see those boys with your own eyes. Never mind what the masters say and ignore the glossy brochures: go and see the school and spend as much time as possible talking to as many current pupils as possible.

Actually I think over the last couple of years-the sports results are slightly improving. Isnt there a fairly new head of sport the ex army chap who teaches physics and let's not forget that they are on the same schools circuit as the likes of St Edwards, Radley Charterhouse and Eton where sport is taken considerably more seriously.

Indeed Happy - thus my addition of exeption, rather than rule! :)

Agree that you should not choose WC because of sport, but dont rule it out because you think is has no sports. I truly think it has suffered from this (thus the lack of success in cricket perhaps?). If all 'sporty' boys rule it out, then there is no pool to take from.
As I said up thread, I agree that it is not the ideal place to pursue a 'professional' sporting career, nor is is somewhere you will gain status amongst the boys for your sporting achievements (as is the case at several other schools), but it is somewhere you will be able to enjoy a variety of sports and as I think you have said as well, pursue the sports you enjoy rather than those subscribed by the school.

I accept (just) that the odd pupil goes to the world championship in their chosen sport but if a boy has his heart set on a GB team for most mainstream team sports then the necessity of playing against others of even remotely similar standard is just not going to arise because there is no termly main sport like most schools have so when it comes to the different sports the school lacks strength in depth.
The other week I was talking to a cricket nut teacher who coaches cricket at another school he was saying that he was rather sad to see the relatively poor standard of cricket at Winchester apparently 10-15 years ago they were seriously good cricket school my DH also remembers them as a seriously good cricket school.
But the point is that as said above you don't choose Winchster because of the sport. Winchester is nuanced, unlike so many it is multi faceted, which is why some struggle to work out in the beginning what it's all about. it does have so much more to offer than many other. On the other hand it doesn't claim to suit all bright boys.

I really think that WC suffers for this reputation that it is not sporty - we were under that illusion before we went.
It does not force those who do not want to, to do a specific sport. But it is very sporty indeed for those who wish to persue sport.
As per above, WC is not the ideal place for those who wish to pursue a sport professionally, though saying that, we know a boy who went to the World Championships in his sport and is still pursuing it seriously at school and every sunday (exeption rather than rule though).
In a sporty house, a sporty boy will thrive - I am convinced.
Alpha Bravo - you cant have come across the boys that I know (admittedly only about 10-12)... fit, tanned, and charming (not body builders though...)

As the proud but sometimes exasperated mother of a DS (not at Winchester) who in his early years was always outside running around but since turning into a teenager rarely ventures outside or even opens the curtains let alone run outside, kick or throw a ball I can tell you my Wykehamist DS looks muscular and tanned in comparison!
I think Win Coll remains the only refuge for the seriously non sporty, all in the beginning try a selection of sports but some are unable to find anything that appeals and after a couple of terms don't do any, they can choose non sporting activities which run at the same time. I understand this sounds wrong to many but if you really loath sport it must be a relief. As a non sporty person (horses aside and not offered at my school) I clearly remember myself and my fellow sports haters standing on hockey pitches/athletic pitches/netball courts usually in the wind and cold loathing every minute of it and not putting any effort in at all, much to the annoyance of my fellow sporty pupils and staff. We would have been much happier if we been offered an non sporting alternative.

AlphaBravo my DS would probably look like that to you. He does n't spend much time bulking up in the gym or row and obviously does n't play rugby but is keen and good at several outdoor ball sports and plays as much as he can, several hours of a lot of running around just one day last week for example not including matches.

I have also noticed that the flexibity and choice of the Winchester system has turned several boys who were put off sport at junior school and vowed between themselves to give up sport as soon as possible into extremely enthusiastic athletes or rowers or blackbelt martial arts.

As DarkJane says there is limited time in the day at any school and even the very bright allrounders who can fit so much in end up by making choices.

The talented musician at prep school who is also sporty for example to county standard in several sports and acts (there are a fair number of those at Winchester) once at senior school and factoring in the time to practise for a couple of instruments to progress at diploma level, play several hours in the orchestra or committed to the chapel choir won't also be able to train as intensively at sport as they might like or participate in as many plays or whatever. The talented musician may decide not to progress as much in music but prioritise sport or whatever else they have discovered but they choose. Sometimes for the DC (and their parents) the realisation that they can't do everything to the same level is difficult.

Wykehamists never look like they even go outside. Let alone run around outside throwing or kicking a ball.

WTH - sorry if it came across as you that you weren't looking out for the things which are important for your son - I did not mean that. It was just a comment from someone who now has an 18 yr old rather than 11 yr old and only meant to be a helpful and friendly comment. As they get older they have more demands on their time. At some point they have to make a choice. But , WC will give the opportunity to try a very many things to a high level. You will see that when you visit & I wish you and your son all the best , whatever you decide. Do ask or PM if you would like any more help.

DJ

You definitely don't need to worry about the music

DS is musical and we've attended some of the concerts.

The boys playing were phenomenally good. Very advanced, technically challenging pieces.

And these weren't even the music scholars!! Nor were they all seniors. What particularly interested me was that so many of the non-playing boys had chosen to go along and listen - it wasn't compulsory because it didn't need to be.

We know a top sportsman who's the same year as DS he attends a school with an outstanding club in his choosen sport. It's a sport that in most schools is often only offered as a minor sport/extra curricular activity but at his school it isn't, he doesn't have to stand on the rugby pitch three afternoons a week. The club has one of the UK's top coaches, and add into this he has exceedingly dedicated parents who shlep round the country on weekends taking him to competitions and in the weekday to other clubs so that he get more practice the time, and the level of effort he and his parents have put into this reflect his ability and his current GB/world ranking. He's decided to make a career in this sport and parents were quite honest and told me this will reflect in his exam grades. Interestingly he only made the decision to take it this seriously when he was in yr 10 luckily the school was on his side. We also know a full boarding school (same sport) who also have one of the UK's top coaches and DS's ex coach again those who wish too can pursue only this sport, he has the freedom to take them out of lessons etc any day and take them to competitions. He was fairly recently saying to me that if DS2 has gone to this school how many more opportunities he would have had to be much better at the sport, GB ranking would be a given (injury aside), but as he knows DS well he then interestingly added at this selective big name full boarding school DS2 would have been bored stiff when in all other lessons etc!
Win Coll IMO is not for those with serious sporting ambitions like those I've detailed above, but what it does which neither of the two schools above provide (this first one is also a big name) is offer a broad intellectually stimulating curriculum with a large non examined part. My non musical DS was completely put off music at prep, yesterday he was humming (badly) Elgars cello concerto, I noticed he was listening to Brahms the other day on his phone and then AC/DC, he was talking to my DH about Thomas Hardy, and first WW1 war poets over dinner this weekend and he is a regular visit to art galleries where he looks and talks with genuine passion. He loves languages and excels at math, ok he's could have been in the GB ranking for his chosen sport if he's gone to another school but he wouldn't have all those other interests. I also believe that the camaraderie between the boys is pretty special at Win Coll in comparison with others that's also important and that the boys are allowed to be themselves which I believe is essential.
Our children are being pigeon holed so early now a days, those of us who are lucky enough to be able to afford school fees are often trying to decide when our children are 9/10 which senior school will fit them best, many have to choose (I)GCSEs at an age when many don't have a clue what they want to do in the long term and even worse at 15/16 they are asked to choose A levels (Pre U's in the case of Win Coll) when again many don't have a clue as to what there long term plans are. Between yrs 4 -8 children change a lot as they become teenagers they change all the time, schools like Win Coll offer so much and boys find interests that they previously never had.
OP I knew when DS was at prep that I wanted to my DS to have a very broad intellectually stimulating education, regardless of the fact that I was being told by his then coach that he was showed genuine talent in his choosen sport and that I should send him to X, my gut feeling was that he was the sort of child that would benefit from this breadth and depth. He has friends at other boarding schools whose parents either didn't want this or who felt their DS's wouldn't benefit from this. Most like me haven't regretted their individual decisions.

Sorry - just one thing which occurred to me as making early morning cup of tea - looking at Winchester with sport as a main focus reminds me of those adverts for the V&A some years ago - "an ace caff with a rather nice museum attached".

WTH, one more thing I would just add, prompted by some pps.

Your son is quite young. My own personal experience is that when younger, Ds was a pretty good all rounder (although we did know at an early age e.g. he was never going to play cricket for Hampshire or compete for team GB at athletics.) As the boys get older they cannot do everything at the highest level IMHO. So e.g. if your son is very able musically that will take a certain time out of his week , if he is very very talented at cricket, so will that. That is even before you have thought of, is he good at rowing and does he want to do it for example. Or, might he find that he is very good at debating, which will equally take time and effort outside normal school work. Or indeed drama / acting. By the time they are older they can't do everything and their school work.

If you think you think your son has a real shot at a country / county level sport, you probably may know that by now. Equally if he has the potential / aptitude to become a first rate musician. There may be things you don't even know he is good at which a school like Wincoll will give him the chance to discover. There are boys at WC who are hugely academic and clever and play sport and do music for example to a high level. But it depends how you define high level. Boys do get music scholarships (e.g.) offered to for example Oxbridge. That said you need only look on some threads on MN to see that there are many DCs who are very gifted musically who go on to specialist music schools / conservatoires for example.

I think that Winchester has a very strong "offering" (sorry rubbish word but early morning) in that the academic side of things is very strong but also a little different (e.g. have you looked at Div and what that means ) . I would say that if you are worrying primarily about whether they beat Charterhouse or Wellington at football once a month, and the fact it is close to home and pretty, then possibly you aren't looking at the things which (again IMHO) make Wincoll a really good school.

Again - do PM at any time - happy to help.

DJ

Dear OP
Have you visited WC?
We had ruled it out for our DS mainly for the reasons you have. We have a sporty DS who enjoys a variery of sports including rugby. Our HM inisted we paid a visit and our minds were changed.
If your DS wants to shine in the glory of his sporting success and build his popularity amongst his peers based on it, then WC is not the place to go. If however, he wants to enjoy brilliant facilities and excellent coaching in the sports of his choice, then I really dont see why not.
Visit and ask also to see the housemaster in one of the more sporty houses and perhaps also one of the more musical houses, you may be plesantly surprised!

summer is right music is taken much more seriously DS knows a boy whose in the National Youth Orchestra. My DS is not musical but I understand from talking over the years to a few that are that the standard of music is very high, that there are a variety of orchestras, quarters and ensembles but most music scholars will be at the very least grade 8 on arrival at the school and that musical opportunities such as playing a concerto for any but the very best players are limited.
There are numerous inter house competitions including sport, football being one of them, my DS is not a team sports player but inter house competions seem to be taken very seriously. There are also house concerts for parents at least once a year, I've never been to one but I'm assuming all who play an instrument to a reasonable level get a chance to play if they so wish.
I asked DS about the sporting opportunities he genuinely feels that Win Coll is not the right place for the "gifted all round sportsman" who aspires to compete and win at a high level. The boys were reminded by the head in chapel a few years ago they were not there to do sport but academia.

Actually workinghard I think Winchester is one of the very few boarding schools that allows a near specialist music school level for the serious musicians. There are a number of very high level musicians and the teaching staff and ensembles at the high level are great. Also, the plus side of flexibility in students being able to choose to do less sport is that they can spend a lot of time doing music and practice. There are now also ensembles for intermediate musicians but they will have less performance opportunities than perhaps in other schools. The music tech is also very popular and well taught.
As always the boy who like sport and music will have clashes and will have to make choices.

My DS also excels at school in his chosen non major sport beating nearly all he plays on the school circuit but to get to the next level including getting into even the lowest level of the GB ranking would require him to practice outside of the school club at the very least on a weekly basis and also attend out of school competitions at the weekends to get the necessary experience so essential to be even fairly successful at the next level up and the school will not allow this. We know others in the same sport at a variety of independent schools who are doing this. Obviously it's easier in some sports to get more practice in school and school time so for example there are some exceedingly strong cross country runners.
But ultimately Win Coll is not about sport or excelling at high levels in sport if this had been our priority DS could have gone to our localish big name independent school. But everything else about the place he would have hated.

Charterhouse is also primarily weekly boarding.

I think Charterhouse would be a better fit than Wellington if your son is academic. Some very bright boys from DS's prep won scholarships there and, of course, they are a football-playing school.

DS enjoys sports and actually excels at a few, but they are not team sports. He receives excellent coaching in these and the college seems to take physical education very seriously.
He loves playing football, but isn't very good at it. Winchester, from his perspective, is a perfect fit!

Charterhouse and Bradfield are both football, weekly boarding schools.

There is in rugby at Win Coll so that's a positive.