Criticism Over Helping DS With Homework...Views Please

Gosh I would definitely chill out. Your ds has struggled to make his sock monkey. Teacher has observed as have you that he didn't have much of a clue. Conclusion ds not v good at this particular tech subject. End. It really doesn't warrant all this angst and pouring over his primary school teachers comment that he is good at arts. Honestly you sound really OTT. As regards MFL he may well have been working at 4b. He may continue to consolidate this level over different topics and may get slightly higher by end of year or not.

Girl:

I think Swan has the right approach - raise that your son has organisational issues and needs to work within a structure, possibly in small bursts.

However, I suspect part of this mark is reflecting that not a lot was getting done in class - and the reality is that your DS does need to make an effort when on his own as well.

I also think you have to step back and realise that there are always a few teachers that are 'dragons' and that aren't particularly supportive/ reasonable/ professional with children/ young teenagers. They exist - and it's always been the case.

When I was in high school we all dreaded a maths teacher who was very fond of pop quizzes or putting ridiculously hard questions on tests to 'challenge' us. We were endlessly told we were stupid and worse than any year he'd taught before. But we all left that maths class learning to keep our heads down and get on with it - and I've certainly been less frightened/ intimidated by 'dragon' colleagues/ managers ever since.

I agree about the instrument as Ds1 can play violin to Grade 4 level (although he should be higher at his age) and can write perfectly well and walk in a straight line without bumping into things AND has an excellent sense of direction. But still shows major deficits which led him to be diagnosed with DCD (dyspraxia)

I think teachers of D & T and Art get very resentful of parents that think these subjects are not important and don't need any effort; this sometimes means they are more short tempered with those pupils they regard as the high achievers in other subjects. When I explained ds1's lack of ability (and historic lack of ability - like not managing D & T at primary either not being able to colour in a simple picture etc) they were much more forgiving and looked at his effort not the offending work itself.

Thanks. I know DS is not dyspraxic because, well, he's not dyspraxic. A bit like him having many ASD traits when stressed, but investigations having shown that he's NT but has at times been very anxious, dyspraxia was suggested and ruled out after investigations. I was trying to give 'laymen's examples' of his non-syspraxic traits (despite his total lack of DT and art ability perhaps indcating some dyspraxic traits), and have thus in a way further muddied the waters. Apologies.

I am a teacher, btw. Have not always been a teacher - was a home educator before I was a teacher, and had 2 previous careers before that - but am presently a teacher.

To make it clear - I would not suggest a diagnosis of dyspraxia to anyone, or rule one out, on ability to play an instrument alone. However, for DS, a whole raft of things, including his ability to play football to an extremely high level and play 2 instruments well, as well as his specific responses to other tests, rule out dyspraxuia as an 'underlying reason' for his low ability in DT.

Honestly OP I would not worry about this at all. As children go through secondary their skills and talents start to come through, as do those subjects they are not do good at. It helps them decide what to go forward with to GCSE and what to drop.
My DS hates art, is not good at it and as a result finds it hard to be motivated. I don't help him, if he is struggling I advise him to be honest with his teacher and seek help there. I've told him it's important to put in his best effort and that's all he can do. He'll be dropping it as soon as he is able and I opted not to make an appt with the teacher on parents evening.

Not at all. You'd be amazed at how many teachers have a very dodgy grasp of dyspraxia. You'd be amazed at how many of them 'don't believe in it' too. And if the poster does teach in a school, rather than being a teacher at home or a former teacher or a different sort of teacher (because, how do I know? I know you're not an explorer and you know I'm not a rabbit but other than that....) then it's worth pointing out because, most emphatically, being able to play an instrument to a high level is NOT a surefire sign that a child isn't dyspraxic yet DD1 and DD2 have both been told, at different times and by different teachers, that they are 'surprised' they are having music lessons because they are on the SEN register for dyspraxia and surely they can't 'really' be dyspraxic if they can play. There is so much wrong 'information' about dyspraxia out there that it's really important to counter it every time you encounter it.

"Just in case you are actually a teacher in a school and might need to know this in the future. "

Uncalled for.

Teacher - While I'm sure you're right and your DS isn't dyspraxic, being able to play an instrument isn't a sign of not being dyspraxic. Just in case you are actually a teacher in a school and might need to know this in the future. :)

Hi
I am dyspraxic too, was very academically able, sewing and food tech nearly killed me. The teacher took me outside and asked me if I was deliberately making my work poor for attention as she knew I was a bright girl! The thing is, I do look back and laugh BUT I suffered so much stress in my university years about my inability to organise myself and at 38 I still can't drive... Which is how I discovered I had dyspraxia. So yeah, no one has to be good at everything and design tech doesn't have to be a strength but if he's struggling hugely with these sorts of tasks, then it might be worth pursuing.

He isn't dyspraxic, btw - he has great gross motor skills, though not quite so good fine motor skills, and can e.g. play a quite fiddly instrument to a high level. He just isn't any good at DT, or Art. As long as he works hard, I don't care. If his EFFORT grade dropped, I'd be on his case like a shot. Achievement grade, if he's clearly giving it his all - nope.

DS has the highest possible effort grade for DT...and is way behind his end KS3 target.

He'll give it up at the end of Y9, but he can cook, sew and handle both a saw and a soldering iron to a moderately useful level, can folow instructions to create something basic (endlessly useful in future life with flatpack furniture) and has developed much greater empathy with those who struggle in the subjects he finds easy (Maths, PE, MFL, History).

Result, in my book.

A whole week to make a sock puppet?!
I know Dd has initiative but she's knocking out 3 Xmas stockings this evening, they seem pretty similar each to a sock puppet project Nervously hoping she doesn't knacker my sewing machine.

OP's son "got on with it solidly for a whole week", to create something which amounted to 75%+ the boy's own work, but still needed help from OP that even OP admits made it noticeably better than his peers', although it was still "only mini-inputs" that OP gave. Yet enough help that very clear to the teacher that OP had helped.

I'm very , but to respond to general principles: verbal advice, brainstorming & being a third hand is fine. Sounds like OP must have done a fair lot more than that, though. I don't understand why. Do you help with his other homework like this?

"The SATS are not used to judge the children."

On which planet? DD's secondary only set maths in Y7 and they used KS2 SATs (marks) to do that.

Agree that your poor ds cannot be great at every single subject.

You say that education is "super important" to you - but driving your ds to achieve well at everything is guaranteed to make him feel inadequate. Those levels, sub-levels etc - who cares? As long as he is doing well at the subjects you know he is good at, or has the aptitude for, and is doing his best in everything else, that's what is important.

Working his socks off for Level 6 SATS? Why? The SATS are not used to judge the children.

And doing projects for dcs - what you are basically saying is, "Ds, your work is not good enough. My work is, however, so that is what we are going to send in." Not good for self esteem, and sometimes you have to be realistic and honest. Ds cannot draw for toffee. What would be the point of sending him in with something dh (who is great at art) had drawn, just to get the hallowed top level? Zero point.

I think it is unrealistic to expect a child to be good at everything. Our school also gives grades for how well the child has worked in class. My DS is rubbish at all DT subjects but gets good marks for effort, that matters more to me than how he achieves in a subject he has no aptitude for.

It's possible that the teacher has identified your son has difficulties with practical subjects and wants to discuss this with you re possible assessment for dyspraxia. Or that your DS is underachieving because he isn't working well in lessons in which case you need to discuss his behaviour in subjects he doesn't enjoy/do well in.

However, it's also possible that the teacher is an arse.

If he wants to berate you for helping with homework, you can say that it wouldn't be needed if teacher input hadn't been so poor.

If he wants to say your son is underachieving at 2 sublevels below the y7 minimum, you can point out that it's only the start of the year and ask what the teacher will be doing to ensure he meets his target? Or say that sublevels are bollocks (which they genuinely are) and you don't think yearly targets are accurate.

Or if teacher is particularly arsey, just say "well, it's only DT, it's hardly a priority for academic DS"

But do point out that you don't appreciate your DS being publicly singled out for underachievement.

It's rare to be good at everything

Children have different skills, so it is likely levels will vary across subjects, surely the teacher has also used a judgment on what he has seen to assess levels and the skills displayed in class. There is likely to children underachieving in odd subjects and doesn't sometimes it help to struggle rather than finding everything easy

Strange thread about a sock monkey!

Ds1 IS dyspraxic and all his D & T projects were very basic. He was never told off for bad work because they could see he really couldn't understand the instructions unless someone stood next to him and explained every step.

He has given up D & T now (Year 10), thank goodness. He did enjoy the projects though. We still have the working hacksaw handle and the sculpture of a shark made of wood. I'm glad he had the chance to try D & T because he would never have attempted any of that in RL.

I do remember getting very upset when he was criticized in Year 7 for not trying with his presentation or immature drawing (this was in Art). But he actually was quite good at stuff which was bigger and bolder like papier mache and collage. So you might find your son does shine when things are less fiddly.

I must admit I don't quite get the problem with homework help, if (as seems here) it doesn't actually involve doing the work for them, but just giving appropriate guidance such as a teacher might provide. My dad went through pretty much every essay I wrote in later secondary school with a red pen. Result: I got shit hot at both writing and structuring arguments. No way would a teacher in a class of 25 kids have had time to give me that level of input. I now have three Oxbridge degrees, and I don't need my dad and his red pen any more . My PhD supervisor certainly used a red pen on my thesis though, and nobody thought of that as cheating!

Sorry op, just musing! My kids are still in early primary, I'm clearly going to find secondary school quite traumatic! But fwiw I don't see that you did much wrong, and I think the teacher was out of line humiliating yr ds. On the other hand, he's only 11, and its just DT, so I don't think you need worry!

It does seem a bit unlikely that he was a mile behind everyone else at the design stage, and with a small amount of help over a period of a week he was suddenly ahead of them all. I would imagine the mark is a combination of the finished product (a fairly high mark) and the design stages (very low marks).

Though I'm bemused by how you "design" a sock monkey. Take sock, follow instructions.

The public message was very rude - the teacher should have written to you to tell you she needed to speak to you.

My DC also has good levels, apart from in music , art , drama and DT. He is yr 7 and was actually scored 2a for music! He is fairly hopeless at anything practical and completely tone deaf. His report though said he tried in the subjects, and he hasn't been humiliated by the teachers. I'd don't help him, he does get DT and art homework, though no music or drama so far, and I don't help. Like an earlier poster I treat his hopeless marks as a bit of a joke. He is doing cookery for DT at the moment and is so bad I am actually going to give him an intensive course in how to peel veg and basic cooking over the holidays, as this is a skill I want him to develop, he needs to be able to cook healthy food! But I wouldn't help with homework. If I were you I'd repeat your OP to the teacher at parents evening but I wouldn't take it farther than that, he doesn't need to do DT for GCSEs after all.

"the arts" doesn't mean art and tech, it means English and drama.

4b is fine for 1st term in year 7.

This is a serious "pick your battles" situation. Does your DC want to make a career out of something he needs Tech for? No? Well then, pat him on the back, tell him he'll just have to do his best for the next 2 or 3 years till he can give it up, no one's good at everything etc.

See the teacher. Apologise for helping. Say you helped because you could see he is underachieving and you were not sure if he was getting any help at school as he finds it really hard. But now you know not to and won't do it again.

But don't go complaining to the head because if something serious happens like bullying and you have to go in all guns blazing they'll roll their eyes and say "Oh it's HER again."

Education is important to me too. I don't think you should worry though. Yes get to the bottom of things as it may uncover an issue but also remember that this isn't his A level or GCSE mark. He's only 11. I must also add that if it was his actual GCSE work, it would create a big problem marking wise.