Calling Year 12 parents....

Hi Circular, I think it's my DD you are referring to. I agree that you don't need an A at Gcse to carry on a subject to AS level. DD1 didn't get As in any of the subjects she has continued with and has managed fine. Chemistry at AS does contain a lot of maths so taking maths does help. I think physics really needs maths as well.

Same stage here with child no 3. Trouble is we thought we knew what was what but bloody gove .... Nuff said!

My thoughts from having dd1 do A levels (arts) and DS (science) ..
Music is quite easy if you have a good sound performance ability and play often - only grade 6 at AS and 7 at A2 needed really (don't play virtuoso pieces averagely , play easier pieces like a virtuoso!).
The ethics based RE was huge fun.
English lit she gave up as pulling stuff she loved apart was almost upsetting !

Critical thinking ( and general studies - that DS did) honestly - waste of time. If you can write good essays you can write good essays - evidenced by a high grade in a narrative subject. These add nothing and aren't rated by academic courses. Yep even an A*.

Dd2 isn't even being offered them.

EPQ - dd 1 did one, enjoyed it and got distinction. Was it worth the time? Not really - dd2 may have to do it but we will guide her into a field of study that utilises niche current interests and adds breadth to Areas Of A level work (eg they study the Tudors in history, she sings lots of Tudor church music ... What she doesn't realise is how much of the political situation is reflected in the music - Protestant vs Catholic composers, english vs Latin text etc)

DS and sciences? Take maths if you possibly can at least to AS ( though I reckon that applies anyway!) don't do physics without A2 maths as well. Be bold, if you do biology it really is hard to get far in a science field without chemistry as well. A level chemistry is very hard - almost in the same way that A level maths is- a huge step up - it's wasn't just DS who found this. Biology and music were and " upwards slope" rather than a vertical cliff!

Dd2 doesn't know. She's thinking law conversion eventually but something humanities 1st eg humans sciences. She's chosen so far music (easy win for her) maths ( loves it) English and history. However we've been chatting to friends and it's been suggested she look at economics instead if English? Anyone advise us on that? She/we know nothing !

Ds has to hand his options form in next week He wants to go into Law so was thinking about RS. I've suggested History, English Lit and Classics (AS). Do you think this is essay overkill?

I would say only do FM if you have a genuine love and interest for maths

I would recommend getting hold of some study texts before deciding on STEM subjects because they are very different to the way they are studied at GCSE.
As DS(1) put it GCSE physics and chem are more learning about the subject whereas at A level you start learning teh subject itself.

'I am going on a looooong holiday the day after we take DS2 to uni!

a you probably won't be able to afford it with 2 of them to support!!

Neither must disagree with you Re the maths,
It depends WHY the DC is not an A* pupil.
DD1 (yr13) got a mid-A at GCSE maths, but had no problem with the difficult stuff, just makes a lot of careless mistakes. Went on to get a mid-B at AS and predicted B at A2. Seems to be a low drop out rate for maths at her sixth form, over half the year group took it, and they are ability set.
I recall one other on the yr13 thread with an A at GCSE getting A at AS, and has an A prediction at A2.

thanks for the wine, I definitely need it!

I can't even think further than getting through the GCSE's!

Sparkling, I'll give you advance warning: it only gets more stressful!
Honestly, DS1 has had me stressed out since we started looking at unis. I keep wishing we were 3 yrs from now with DS2 in uni!!
I am going on a looooong holiday the day after we take DS2 to uni!

Sparkling, a couple of the sixth forms we have been to see specify A or above for Maths, Sciences, English Lit and MFLs - the jump up would be too great otherwise. No pressure there then

So far we have...

Maths, Further Maths, Chemistry , French, German and Music. Not going so well with the elimination....

DS is choosing Maths, PE, History and either F. Maths or Geog.
He wants to either teach PE/Maths or do something sport related. Are these reasonable choices?

The wave - we haven't decided what we are going to do about the linear A levels for definite yet. The 1st wave of new specifications start next sept but the rest of the subjects the year after. All the friends I have that work in other schools/6th form colleges appear to be undecided as well.

Personally, I think management are waiting until after the next election to see what happens with the AS before final decision are made. Crap isn't it!

Don't select subjects just because they are useful. We always have a large group of students take maths because they know its so useful, but it has by far the highest drop out at the end of AS due to getting U's or E's. Take maths if you are good at it but for some students despite working their socks off, still won't get it (same goes for chemistry and to an extent physics as well). It ends up with them wasting an option.

If you are unsure and planning to take both sciences and humanities. Do select at least 2 sciences (bio/Chem, physics/maths, chem/physics etc) as this will give you options as most science degrees which ask for a minimum of 2 sciences. One science subject is a bit limiting if you then decide to go the science route. However this does go back to my 1st point!

And ask the school to clarify what they are doing about the linear A levels. I've been to a few sixth form open evenings in past weeks for my yr 11 and they are all different in their planned approaches. Some are saying you have to commit to A2 at the start so choose only 3 subjects plus epq, others are still going to stick with a decision after AS even though the AS will not go forward for the full A level any more, others didn't know yet what they would be doing!

I echo what Littleham has said: Both DC are reasonably academic, but fairly one-sided. They hate essays.

1. Start with the next step. What might they want to study. What will help them most. What do they need to achieve. (Be aware on competitive subjects, you often need more than the minimum, unless you have a reason such as you are coming from a very poor school.) Note on competitive courses they sometimes look for a fourth subject at AS, so standard offer becomes A*AAa. Academic students in the Private sector often take 4 A levels as a matter of routine. I assume the schools know what they are doing.

1. Then look at the match. DS had a dilemma. Chemistry would have been easier than history, and he was not sure about Further Maths. In the event Further maths was easier than he expected and history more difficult, so UCAS might have been easier had he chosen chemistry and got a better grade. That said the skills acquired in history should stand him in good stead later on. Employers,. presumably, prefer applicants who are both numerate and literate.

1. Maths. If you are aiming for science or social science do as much maths as you can at school. This keeps more doors open for University entry, plus makes the initial weeks at University easier. But do not do maths unless you found the GCSE easy. Maths is a light workload if your can grasp the concepts quickly. A nightmare if not.

1. Teachers. Look at the results the school is achieving. Ask sixth formers about teachers. Don't be surprised by big variations. Factor in the subjects that more able students are selecting and then consider. If somehow the biology department is getting the average child to an A and the chemistry department is getting the average child to a C with some Us, consider how important it is to do chemistry. If it is important be prepared to support.

1. Mix. Where you can avoid "ology" subjects, other than biology, or anything ending in "studies" other than religious studies. Try to ensure you have two facilitating subjects or something else, like economics, which is well regarded and seen as rigorous. It is usually good to have a bit of contrast, eg maths with humanities, or an essay subject with sciences. Keeping up a language is usually good, though beware that some Universities won't offer against A levels in a mother tongue.

YY to keeping your options open and at the same time choosing subjects you are naturally good at and enjoy doing.

Do not do Maths if you are not an A* pupil - the leap to A levels Maths is high. Maths is essential if you think you may want to do engineering. Doing a science subject along with Maths is usually recommended but there are exceptions.

Remember that you can change subjects after GCSEs results day so once your application has been accepted, its not set in stone so don't get too stressed.

Ask the sixth form if your son can meet with an advisor to help with the decision making process - most sixth forms should include a brief meeting as part of the application.

My recommendation would be to chat with the Sixth Formers themselves when you go to the Open Days / Open Evenings for an insight into the different courses.

When we went round the local Sixth Form College this time last year, DS knew he wanted to do Physics, Maths and History, but was stuck for a fourth subject. At the college they start off on four subjects for AS-Level and usually drop one at the end of Year 12 (though that may all change for future years due to the de-coupling of AS-Levels from A-Levels with the switch to end of course exams).

Anyway, we were about to leave when I noticed the sign for the Chemistry classroom and suggested we took a quick look. DS hadn't considered Chemistry A-Level before, although he'd already passed the GCSE in that subject at the end of Year 10. He was good at it, but didn't find the GCSE course that interesting.

Well, we were very impressed at the college! The students were so enthusiastic and were telling us how Chemistry was by far their favourite subject. I believe much of this was down to the teachers, but also the syllabus and the way in which the subject was taught at the college. The teachers were very positive too and happy to explain the syllabus to us and the merits of taking the subject.

So, DS chose Chemistry as his fourth AS-Level option, but still expected to drop it after Year 12.

That's all changed now though. It's his favourite subject and the one in which, so far, he seems to be doing best. He intends to carry on with it to A-Level and drop History instead.

My points are:

1. Your DS1 may find inspiration at the open events as mine did and help him to make his mind up over his choices.
2. Sometimes a student is good at a subject, but doesn't particularly enjoy it at GCSE level because it's all a bit "basic", the syllabus may not go into any real depth and the young person is left slightly bored. That can all change at A-Level. There is a big difference. Hence, my suggestion that you and your DS1 talk to the Sixth Formers themselves.

The RG document is really good even for those who will never in a million years go to an RG
because it puts in stark words the point about
keeping options open
and being informed

it should be compulsory reading for every GCSE student and teacher

even DDs friend who struggled to get his 5 C grade GCSEs and is now heading towards Army basic training found it useful to help his focus.